The Ultimate DAX Scalping Discussion Thread!

Quote from trade4succes:

"Always" is a little absolut not?

But maybe you're right in some cases. You can also turn things around. Traders with marginal psychology conclude that trading is all about trading strategies, since that is the only way they can get around their poor psychology.

From my experience I think psychology deserves the most attention. I rather start with perfect psychology and continue with perfect money management and conclude with trading strategies than the other way around. But that may be because I started off with excellent trading strategies in the first place :p

Thanks to all you guys for the nice responses, most of which I agree with as qualifications to my statement.

Actually, the comeback I was anticipating was for someone to say that all trading methodologies are "marginal" in some sense, so therefore psychology was in fact of paramount importance. :)

Still, I'm reluctant to give psychology such importance, since I too often see traders trying to account for their mediocre performance by some psychological explanation, rather than doing the work it takes to get a real edge (i.e., they're too quick to think "if I had only been thinking this or that, then I would have succeeded" instead of realizing that they simply didn't do their homework and don't have a clue as to what they are doing).
 
Quote from franklin:

Note Scientist's reluctance to talk about the details of his trading methodology, but his eagerness to talk about "psychology". Which do you think is really more valuable to him? His apparent studiousness, testing, and attention to detail impress me, but his need for attention, verboseness, and claims of psychological superiority do not.
1) Where please am I reluctant to talk about methodology? Are you kidding?

2 Need for attention, verboseness? Hello? I started this thread, so you
a) Don't need to pay attention to it
b) Don't need to read all the verbosity

I'm not force-feeding you. You can eat whatever you like. Some concepts take words to explain. What do you want me to do? Post a 3-line formula?

Scientist: I like reading your stuff, and only about 25% of what you now say is total ****. :) The latest **** being your contention that the only real traders are the ones who trade large size in extremely short time frames. Ha! It would be fun to have you go back and document for us all the stuff that you now think is nonsense that you once spouted with such confidence on ET.
3. I would greatly appreciate if you made me aware of the 25% and taught me better. Constructive criticism is always welcome. And sure, we all evolve. I don't use much TA anymore, but it worked for me at the time, I just have better tools now. Just because I'm better now doesn't mean I was so bad then. Did you make money a year ago? I did. What's your problem?

4. Regarding "my latest 25%", my "contention that the only real traders trade large size on short time frames" - Wait a second... What was just the title of this thread??? Scroll to the top of page, please. What do you see? Thank you! :)

To sum up things I've said before: No style is "the best". I mentioned very recently that there is no "better" style, but only the one that suits you best. You can do very well as a swing trader, and work a lot less. AMT can make more than me with a lot less trades, he can work less. No doubt he has a good approach which isn't scalping. Jack, who also contributed here, does not scalp, either. He trades SCT, which is, in my eyes, the most refined and extraction-effective method of trading altogether. Yet I'm not discussing it here.. Now could you please point any other of the supposed "25%"?

Finally coming to psychology: Here is a nice recent quote from Mark - A very good trader. Probably not nearly as good as master franklin - nor does he have his face on nearly as many dollar bills - but good enough to comment. I'm sure you've read his journal.
Quote from velocity_trader:You don't need a book.

When it comes to scalping 80% of it is discipline. You have to "eat " your losers quick and never let winners turn into losers.
The other 20% is getting a feel for the market. The best way to do that is watch it day in and day out and write down your observations.

No book will ever teach you how to be disciplined and stay in control of your emotions. Most people can't do these things and that is why there are so many losers.
You must identify what your "trading demons" and get rid of them, it's hard though because most are embedded deep within your belief system and its uncomfortable,e even if it makes you money, to get away from what you have always done.
Here are some guidelines for the continuation of conversation:

This is a Scalping Thread. You or I may talk about other things on other threads, but for this purpose, this thread is for scalping. In any reference or discussion, which refers to execution, psychology, technology, thinking, position size, time frame, ratios etc, we are referring to scalping.

That means, if we talk about psychology, the context is scalping psychology.
If you want to talk about trading systems, "edges", or Buffetology, please do it elsewhere. Thank you for your courtesy!


And now I would appreciate if we could get back on topic, with valuable, on-topic postings, please. Cheers! :)

Scientist
 
Quote from franklin:

Thanks to all you guys for the nice responses, most of which I agree with as qualifications to my statement.
Translates to : Look at me, how arrogant I am, and so open to objective discussion.

Actually, the comeback I was anticipating was for someone to say that all trading methodologies are "marginal" in some sense, so therefore psychology was in fact of paramount importance. :)
That's what you call a "model of the world". In your model of the world, all "trading methodologies" are "marginal". Well, maybe your trading methodologies. In my model of the world, good trading methodologies are not marginal, in fact it's a taboo to me. Then some others are fully mechanic, not marginal either. It varies a lot. Whose model of the world is more expanded? Open your mind. Don't just discount "anything new".

Still, I'm reluctant to give psychology such importance, since I too often see traders trying to account for their mediocre performance by some psychological explanation, rather than doing the work it takes to get a real edge (i.e., they're too quick to think "if I had only been thinking this or that, then I would have succeeded" instead of realizing that they simply didn't do their homework and don't have a clue as to what they are doing).
This is hilarious. "The work it takes to get a real edge" - How much work does it take you to get a "real edge"? Not that much for me. Couple of hours a day homework maybe, and staying on track. trade4succes, what do you think? How much work to get a real good psychological makeup? Plenty! An "edge" may always give you just a little bit of return, a certain recurring "market inefficiency". But if you get your psychology under control and see all the opportunities in the flow, you can own the world.

I warmly recommend reading Douglas. He's now my favorite author on the subject.

The world is your oyster!
Scientist
 
Quote from wercurna:

Wouldn't you agree that strategy showing very positive results in the testing period can still generate some uncomfortable feeling once traded with real $$?
Not franklin. He's a man of steel, and he's got a real edge.
 
Quote from Baruch:

Did you trade the economic news today?
I do try to get in when the figures are out and catch a bit / the rest of the move, preferably by entering a discount, though (small retracement), so my stop is pretty small / risk isn't so high.

As said, I'm not a good news player. I don't have the infrastructure to do it properly, nor do I have the experience. I just kind of "limp behind" the pro's when they make their run.

How about you? Did you play the news, Baruch? :)
 
Yes, I love to play the news. Today only the rebound. But I could like to get the news more quick. But how? I don't know.
 
Quote from Baruch:

Yes, I love to play the news. Today only the rebound. But I could like to get the news more quick. But how? I don't know.
Well, "rebound" is what I meant with discount or retracement. It's hard for a 'retail' trader to play the release itself, though, which is where the $ is.

How to get the news more quick? Don't you know? You need pro news feeds! Ask Mark, he uses Bloomy, Reuters, on a T1 line. You get news about 15s or so earlier than the "public", which is significant. A T1 is quite costly and I think you might need it (not sure), so it'll set you back a bit. He said he pays something like 2.3K a month for the lot. But if you're serious about trading news, it might be worth it. You should just ask him, he'll probably give you references and set you up. I'm pretty sure both Bloomberg Terminals and T1 lines are available in Denmark. Well, they were in Northern Germany where I lived, and that was hardly 200km from Denmark. :p

Fun aside, though. Myself, I'm seriously thinking about it now. I wonder about paying for all this stuff even while on holidays, it really means you have to be pretty dedicated to be there and use it. On the other hand, it could more than pay for it and the holidays... I do already have a dedicated, always-on, 1.6mbps A-DSL line, though (essentially T1, same speed etc), so I might be able to skip the extra T1 thing.

Baruch, what specific news feed / source do you currently use???

I need to get off now, I'll be back tomorrow or so. Good Luck & CU!
 
I get streaming Reuter news. But they are not very quick with the news! I don't know why - and I don't understand it. It's their business!
I have heard that Bloomberg Radio (on the web) gives you the news very quick. I will try that.
 
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