The Strife Inside Israel's Government

gwb-trading · Mar 2, 2024

As the Gaza war progresses, the conflict inside Israel's government is becoming more open. The conservative Netanyahu faction does not want a two-state solution after the war while more moderate factions want to proceed towards a peace solution including a two-state solution.

Now we are seeing moderate politicians making overseas trips to discuss their proposals with government officials in other countries. This is the start of a very open split -- which may not wait for the end of the war.

Israel's Gantz to travel to Washington, Netanyahu furious
War cabinet minister Benny Gantz will travel on Sunday to Washington for a series of meetings with US officials, though he did not coordinate the trip with Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu, according to reports.
https://www.al-monitor.com/originals/2024/03/israels-gantz-travel-washington-netanyahu-furious

Benny Gantz, a centrist member of Israel's war cabinet, will travel to Washington on Sunday for several meetings with American officials. Notably, he did not coordinate the visit with Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu.

The prime minister's office was outraged by the publication of the meeting, according to Ynet, which first reported the story, saying that Gantz would be traveling without asking for Netanyahu’s approval. The prime minister’s office reportedly said government regulations "require every minister to approve his travel in advance with the prime minister, including approval of the travel plan," adding that "the prime minister made it clear to minister Gantz that the State of Israel has only one prime minister."

Gantz is expected to travel first to Washington before continuing to London. His US visit comes against the backdrop of reports claiming that the Biden administration is losing patience with Netanyahu over his management of the war in Gaza and refusal to plan for a postwar government of the enclave. It also comes as Israel's government and war cabinet have been split on how to proceed in ongoing hostage release and cease-fire negotiations led by the United States, Qatar and Egypt.

Some 1,000 people, including families of hostages held in Gaza, marched Friday for the third day toward Jerusalem, calling on the government to reach a deal for their release. Addressing the marchers in the city of Beit Shemesh, Gantz said, "The mission of bringing them [the hostages] home is the mission of all of us; it is our top priority alongside the other important goals. We will bring them home, all of them as much as we can, and rapidly."

Biden announced on Friday the United States will soon airdrop humanitarian aid, mostly food, into Gaza, similar to joint operations carried out recently by Jordan and France.

Cuddles · Mar 2, 2024

why start a new thread? Is this where you pivot? We all know your historical support for Bibi and his goons.

gwb-trading · Mar 2, 2024

Cuddles said:
why start a new thread? Is this where you pivot? We all know your historical support for Bibi and his goons.

Cuddles · Mar 2, 2024

gwb-trading said:
As always your assertions are laughable. Why don't you dig up some evidence of my support for "Bibi and his goons". Let's see if you can do it without misquoting, partially quoting, or changing my actual quotes in a manner to twist 180 degrees exactly what I stated. Or reverting to your usual approach of quoting a single paragraph of a news article I posted rather than text by me.

There are plenty of posts by me outlining that I do not believe that peace or a two-state solution is possible with the conservative Netanyahu government in power and a more moderate government must be elected in Israel to allow any progress towards peace.

piece of cake:

In this thread, you pushed the false narrative (now deep sixed by fox) that Obama (your president) was trying to oust your boy Bibi by funding an NGO whose purpose is to push for a two state solution (the very thing that you now claim to support).

https://www.elitetrader.com/et/thre...th-your-tax-dollars-to-oust-netanyahu.290320/

OneVoice defines itself as an "international grassroots movement that amplifies the voice of mainstream Israelis and Palestinians, empowering them to propel their elected representatives toward the two-state solution."

https://www.jpost.com/Israel-Electi...ion-ties-to-effort-to-unseat-Netanyahu-393905
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OneVoice_Movement

In this thread you champion segregation by using a passive thread title. You then use a fox article spinning this segregationist move as somehow reasonable. Par for the course to segregationist Israel:

gwb-trading said:
Earlier story...

'Not Welcome': Members at DC country club take swing at Obama over Israel stance
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/201...b-take-swing-at-obama-over-israel-stance.html

Members at an exclusive Washington-area country club think President Obama is a real duffer when it comes to foreign policy – and the fairway furor could cost him one option for a post-presidency home course.

Though it’s unclear whether the outgoing president would even seek membership there, some at the Woodmont Country Club in Rockville, Md., are preemptively trying to keep Obama out of the predominantly Jewish club amid complaints about his stance on Israel, according to reports. The members have sent a barrage of emails to club President Barry Forman and General Manager Brian Pizzimenti saying Obama is "not welcome."

The pushback stems from Obama’s decision last month not to have the U.S. veto a U.N. Security Council resolution criticizing Israeli settlements in East Jerusalem and the West Bank and from Secretary of State John Kerry’s speech two days later accusing Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu of undermining the possibility of a two-state solution.

“[President Obama] has created a situation in the world where Israel’s very existence is weakened and possibly threatened,” longtime member Faith Goldstein wrote in a Dec. 26 email obtained by the Washington Post. “He is not welcome at Woodmont. His admittance would create a storm that could destroy our club. ”

A Dec. 15 email to Forman from Bethesda attorney Marc B. Abrams reportedly said Obama’s stance on Israel should make it “inconceivable” that club leaders would even think of granting him membership.

“If you have views on this matter, I would urge you to make them known quickly,” Abrams wrote. “Timing is critical.”

During his eight years in the White House, the commander-in-chief racked up more than 300 days on the links with most rounds taking place at the course at Andrews Air Force Base or while on vacation in Hawaii.

But with the Obama family staying in D.C. until their daughter Sasha finishes high school, the outgoing president will need to find a new club in the D.C. area.

There has been no official indication Obama plans to apply for membership at Woodmont, but he has played at least four rounds at the course during his presidency and reports from last summer indicate Woodmont would be his club of choice when he leaves the Oval Office.

Representatives from Woodmont did not return FoxNews.com’s requests for comment, but the sentiments over the president’s policies in the Middle East appear far from unanimous among the club’s members and local Jewish activists.

“How cool is it that the first African American president of the United States may well be joining a country club originally established because Jews couldn’t get in anywhere else?” Ron Halber, the executive director of the Jewish Community Relations Council of Greater Washington, said in an article published over the summer by the Jewish newspaper The Forward. Halber is not a member at Woodmont.

Jeffrey Slavin, the mayor of the Maryland town of Somerset and a legacy member at Woodmont, sent an email this week to Forman – and copied fellow Woodmont members and local Jewish leaders outside the club – in which he threatened to organize a mass membership cancellation campaign if the president were not welcomed at the club.

“This has gone way beyond the club now and this makes the Jewish community look bad,” Slavin told FoxNews.com. “The club needs to reach out to the president and say ‘if you want to apply for membership we’ll certainly accept you.’”

Woodmont was founded in 1913 at a time when Jews faced widespread discrimination in applying to country clubs in the D.C.-area. Since then, the club has grown to 460 acres and offers its members an opportunity to play golf and tennis as well as socialize just outside the Washington Beltway. The club has an $80,000 membership initiation fee and members pay $9,600 in annual dues.

“Woodmont was a place you could go when you weren’t welcome anywhere else,” Slavin said. “There are so many ironies here.”

Here you're mad that Obama "disrespected" someone who deserves all the disrespect in the world, your boy Bibi, because Obama was not a "good boi" and toed the Israel line

gwb-trading said:
Obama refused to talk to Bibi. Obama has refused to support Israel. Obama deserves Bibi's disrespect.

The one thing Obama has definitively done is turn a large number of Jewish voters back to the Republican party.

In this latest thread you now paint "moderates seeking a two state solution" as reasonable despite them not wanting to wait for an end of the war. Something you've demonized cease fire advocates and Palestinian protesters for over and over while parroting Bibi's "not until Hamas is gone" line over and over again:

https://www.elitetrader.com/et/search/17325926/?q=hamas+eliminated&o=date&c[node]=27&c[user][0]=9113

gwb-trading · Mar 2, 2024

Cuddles said:
piece of cake:

In this thread, you pushed the false narrative (now deep sixed by fox) that Obama (your president) was trying to oust your boy Bibi by funding an NGO whose purpose is to push for a two state solution (the very thing that you now claim to support).

https://www.elitetrader.com/et/thre...th-your-tax-dollars-to-oust-netanyahu.290320/

OneVoice defines itself as an "international grassroots movement that amplifies the voice of mainstream Israelis and Palestinians, empowering them to propel their elected representatives toward the two-state solution."

https://www.jpost.com/Israel-Electi...ion-ties-to-effort-to-unseat-Netanyahu-393905
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OneVoice_Movement

In this thread you champion segregation by using a passive thread title. You then use a fox article spinning this segregationist move as somehow reasonable. Par for the course to segregationist Israel:

Here you're mad that Obama "disrespected" someone who deserves all the disrespect in the world, your boy Bibi, because Obama was not a "good boi" and toed the Israel line

In this latest thread you now paint "moderates seeking a two state solution" as reasonable despite them not wanting to wait for an end of the war. Something you've demonized cease fire advocates and Palestinian protesters for over and over while parroting Bibi's "not until Hamas is gone" line over and over again:

https://www.elitetrader.com/et/search/17325926/?q=hamas+eliminated&o=date&c[node]=27&c[user][0]=9113

Once again -- good luck with your assertions. As demonstrated at the time of this particular thread -- it is inappropriate for the Obama administration to be funding outside groups dedicated to removing Netanyahu from office with a “Just Not Bibi” campaign. This basically is election interference in another country by the U.S. Likewise it is absurd that the Obama administration was desperately scrambling to provide rebuttals to a speech Netanyahu made -- even before the speech occurred. Let's state it bluntly-- the Obama administration was not friendly to Israel and basically propped up terrorism across the Middle East by giving Iran money, etc.

Now go read all the links I provided above and tell me how I am a supporter of "Netanyahu and his goons".

And here is one additional link about what was being discussed to provide some context to what was being discussed at the time of the Obama administration--

https://www.elitetrader.com/et/threads/netanyahu-speech-on-now-at-aipac.289988/page-2#post-4094217

"In a speech to the US Congress, Benjamin Netanyahu warned that a deal under discussion on Iran's nuclear programme could "pave Iran's path to the bomb" rather than block it."

In hindsight, Netanyahu was quite correct in his assertions that the deal with Iran would provide a path to Iran having a nuclear bomb and promoting terrorism in the region.

The problem I had with the Trump administration cancelling the deal with Iran was that it sent a message that the U.S. does not stick by the deals it made -- which undermines international diplomacy. The deal from the Obama administration which sent plane loads of cash to Iran which was then used to directly fund terrorism was never a particularly good deal. And by the way, Israel, Saudi Arabia and other countries in the region are now paying the price for the Obama administration's deal.

Cuddles · Mar 2, 2024

gwb-trading said:
Once again -- good luck with your assertions. As demonstrated at the time of this thread -- it is inappropriate for the Obama administration to be funding outside groups dedicated to removing Netanyahu from office with a “Just Not Bibi” campaign. This basically is election interference in another country by the U.S. Likewise it is absurd that the Obama administration was desperately scrambling to provide rebuttals to a speech Netanyahu made -- even before the speech occurred. Let's state it bluntly-- the Obama administration was not friendly to Israel and basically propped up terrorism across the Middle East by giving Iran money, etc.

uh....yes, I linked the thread, and no matter how you spin it, the fox narrative was bullshit. Not to mention you've championed toppling other regimes in the region so there goes any semblance of consistency. Yes, Obama was not friendly to Israel (with good reason) and no , he did not prop up terrorism across the ME despite what fox told you.

gwb-trading said:
Now go read all the links I provided above and tell me how I am a supporter of "Netanyahu and his goons".

I never said you weren't a flip flopper, quite the opposite in fact.

gwb-trading said:
And here is one additional link about what was being discussed to provide some context to what was being discussed at the time of the Obama administration--

https://www.elitetrader.com/et/threads/netanyahu-speech-on-now-at-aipac.289988/page-2#post-4094217

"In a speech to the US Congress, Benjamin Netanyahu warned that a deal under discussion on Iran's nuclear programme could "pave Iran's path to the bomb" rather than block it."

In hindsight, Netanyahu was quite correct in his assertions that the deal with Iran would provide a path to Iran having a nuclear bomb and promoting terrorism in the region.

The problem I had with the Trump administration cancelling the deal with Iran was that it sent a message that the U.S. does not stick by the deals it made -- which undermines international diplomacy. The deal from the Obama administration which sent plane loads of cash to Iran which was then used to directly fund terrorism was never a particularly good deal. And by the way, Israel, Saudi Arabia and other countries in the region are now paying the price for the Obama administration's deal.

yes, keep doubling down and cheering for Bibi's asinine policy on everything Iran as Obama's deal had our inspectors keeping the deal in check. Keep championing their war hawkery and assassinations, that paid dividends on October, w/the Houthis, and Hezbollah.

gwb-trading · Mar 2, 2024

Cuddles said:
uh....yes, I linked the thread, and no matter how you spin it, the fox narrative was bullshit. Not to mention you've championed toppling other regimes in the region so there goes any semblance of consistency. Yes, Obama was not friendly to Israel (with good reason) and no , he did not prop up terrorism across the ME despite what fox told you.

I never said you weren't a flip flopper, quite the opposite in fact.

yes, keep doubling down and cheering for Bibi's asinine policy on everything Iran as Obama's deal had our inspectors keeping the deal in check. Keep championing their war hawkery and assassinations, that paid dividends on October, w/the Houthis, and Hezbollah.

Once again let's provide the Fox article I posted. As outlined below -- funding a "Just not Bibi" campaign with American taxpayer dollars is inappropriate election interference in an outside nation -- one which is the only effective democracy in the Middle East. Both Democrats and Republicans in the U.S. Senate rebuked the Obama administration for doing this as per the Washington Post.

Obama funds non-profit with your tax dollars to oust Netanyahu
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/201...r-obama-administration-funded-effort-to-oust/

A powerful U.S. Senate investigatory committee has launched a bipartisan probe into an American nonprofit’s funding of efforts to oust Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu after the Obama administration’s State Department gave the nonprofit taxpayer-funded grants, a source with knowledge of the panel's activities told FoxNews.com.

The fact that both Democratic and Republican sides of the Senate Permanent Subcommittee on Investigations have signed off on the probe could be seen as a rebuke to President Obama, who has had a well-documented adversarial relationship with the Israeli leader.

The development comes as Netanyahu told Israel’s Channel Two television station this week that there were “governments” that wanted to help with the “Just Not Bibi” campaigning -- Bibi being the Israeli leader’s nickname.

....

And let's also be clear -- you do not support changing the regime in rogue nations like Iran which fund & promote terrorism around the world.

I see nothing wrong with championing the changing of these regimes -- in fact the oppressed people in these countries living under effective dictatorships would cheer on a change of regime.

Similarly Hamas is a dictatorial terrorist governing entity in Gaza which needs to be removed in order to have any progress towards peace.

Cuddles · Mar 2, 2024

gwb-trading said:
..... as Netanyahu told Israel’s Channel Two television station this week that there were “governments” that wanted to help with the “Just Not Bibi” campaigning -- Bibi being the Israeli leader’s nickname.

....

You just don't get it do you?

gwb-trading said:
And let's also be clear -- you do not support changing the regime in rogue nations like Iran which fund & promote terrorism around the world.

I see nothing wrong with championing the changing of these regimes -- in fact the oppressed people in these countries living under effective dictatorships would cheer on a change of regime.

Similarly Hamas is a dictatorial terrorist governing entity in Gaza which needs to be removed in order to have any progress towards peace.

I'm not entirely opposed to toppling regimes but the conditions have to be there for it to happen (Arab spring comes to mind). A bigger Iraq under the supervision of Trump, Pompeo, or Bolton is not my idea of "regime change".

gwb-trading · Mar 2, 2024

Cuddles said:
You just don't get it do you?

I'm not entirely opposed to toppling regimes but the conditions have to be there for it to happen (Arab spring comes to mind). A bigger Iraq under the supervision of Trump, Pompeo, or Bolton is not my idea of "regime change".

The thread above is typical of the behavior we have seen demonstrated by Cuddles, Here4Money, and all of his other monikers over the years.

In this example despite being provided with nearly 20 posts (and I can provide dozens more) outlining my negative opinion of the conservative Netanyahu a regime; Cuddles has to go back to 2015 to find a thread where I criticize the Obama administration. Somehow to Cuddles this is evidence of my support for "Bibi and his goons".

The reality is that it is evidence of the Obama administration's failure in the Middle East -- not any type of support of Netanyahu. Obama send piles of cash in planes to Iran which drove terrorism across the Middle East. Not only Israel opposed this Obama deal with Iran, most of the Sunni Arab nations in the region such as Saudi Arabia opposed the deal as well.

Using U.S. taxpayer dollars, the Obama administration attempted to undermine the elected Israeli government by funding a group dedicated to removing Netanyahu from office. This attempt by the Obama administration to undermine a democratic government was heavily criticized by both Democrats and Republicans in the U.S. Senate. Even more laughable was the Obama administration providing rebuttal points even before Netanyahu spoke in front of Congress.

Once again -- all of the above is about the failure of the Obama administration, not support of the Netanyahu government in Israel

In summary, the failure of the Obama administration to engage Israel in open and honest dialog to shape the direction of the future --- actually ensured that a right-wing government would remain in power in Israel for many years to come after Obama left office. Basically Obama turned out to be the biggest promoter of Netanyahu while Jews felt abandoned by Democrats. In the U.S. this lack of support of Israel by the Obama administration also caused many Jews to start voting for Republicans as evidenced by the 2016 election.

Cuddles · Mar 2, 2024

gwb-trading said:
The thread above is typical of the behavior we have seen demonstrated by Cuddles, Here4Money, and all of his other monikers over the years.

In this example despite being provided with nearly 20 posts (and I can provide dozens more) outlining my negative opinion of the conservative Netanyahu a regime; Cuddles has to go back to 2015 to find a thread where I criticize the Obama administration. Somehow to Cuddles this is evidence of my support for "Bibi and his goons".

The reality is that it is evidence of the Obama administration's failure in the Middle East -- not any type of support of Netanyahu. Obama send piles of cash in planes to Iran which drove terrorism across the Middle East. Not only Israel opposed this Obama deal with Iran, most of the Sunni Arab nations in the region such as Saudi Arabia opposed the deal as well.

Using U.S. taxpayer dollars, the Obama administration attempted to undermine the elected Israeli government by funding a group dedicated to removing Netanyahu from office. This attempt by the Obama administration to undermine a democratic government was heavily criticized by both Democrats and Republicans in the U.S. Senate. Even more laughable was the Obama administration providing rebuttal points even before Netanyahu spoke in front of Congress.

Once again -- all of the above is about the failure of the Obama administration, not support of the Netanyahu government in Israel

In summary, the failure of the Obama administration to engage Israel in open and honest dialog to shape the direction of the future --- actually ensured that a right-wing government would remain in power in Israel for many years to come after Obama left office. Basically Obama turned out to be the biggest promoter of Netanyahu while Jews felt abandoned by Democrats. In the U.S. this lack of support of Israel by the Obama administration also caused many Jews to start voting for Republicans as evidenced by the 2016 election.

GWB once again makes wide declarations, provides zero sources and instead of apologizing for having made mistake (only human) and backing trash conservative leaders (bibi, Putin, Trump) and their trash policies, pivots to the irrelevant. Just own up to it GWB, there's much respect to be had in doing so.