Jack leaving like that seems more than a little bizarre to me. Jacks been around the block a few times and realizes himself that 4 out of 5 people disagree with him, which he knows is a kewl place to be. So why would he let a few goofs get to him when he also knows there are many more that appreciate his efforts here. This has been going on since the beginning of the thread and, to me, it seemed like he was handling the critics very well. I thought he even got a kick out of it. Of course he could easily ignore them and continue with the rest of the class. Surely at 70 years old he's learned how to tune people out. I have benefited tremendously from Jack's teachings and will continue to learn and implement his methods on my own. I'm still digesting the information, but the more I go over it and realize a few things on my own, the more clear it becomes. He doesn't owe me or anybody else here any kind of explanation and I sincerely thank Jack for sharing his knowledge. It just seems uncharacteristic of the kind of man I see Jack as being.
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The Stochastic Indicator
- Thread starter jack hershey
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Quote from kleck:
Jack leaving like that seems more than a little bizarre to me. Jacks been around the block a few times and realizes himself that 4 out of 5 people disagree with him, which he knows is a kewl place to be. So why would he let a few goofs get to him when he also knows there are many more that appreciate his efforts here. This has been going on since the beginning of the thread and, to me, it seemed like he was handling the critics very well. I thought he even got a kick out of it. Of course he could easily ignore them and continue with the rest of the class. Surely at 70 years old he's learned how to tune people out. I have benefited tremendously from Jack's teachings and will continue to learn and implement his methods on my own. I'm still digesting the information, but the more I go over it and realize a few things on my own, the more clear it becomes. He doesn't owe me or anybody else here any kind of explanation and I sincerely thank Jack for sharing his knowledge. It just seems uncharacteristic of the kind of man I see Jack as being.
link: http://www.elitetrader.com/vb/showthread.php?s=&postid=314103#post314103
I was really looking forward to his live trade call.
Jack doesn't need me or anyone else to speak on his behalf, but as to the cause of his leaving ET, I think he got fed up with the low standards of this site's operator and moderators.
The final straw came in the following thread:
http://www.elitetrader.com/vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=21239&perpage=6&pagenumber=3
I'm amazed at Jack's energy, really. He put up with a lot of shit from dummies who obviously can't trade and were inexplicably threatened by his posts. I found his market insights, which he was sharing for FREE, to be brilliant.
There are dummies who will read this and say "His posts were too long and he used 800 words to describe a simple thing like price channels in riddles." What these dummies are missing is that good trading is really not complicated. Jack's rockets, icebergs, points 1-2-3 channels are nothing original. It's the pictures he drew that accompanied those things that are the keys to success.
Jack is a master at erasing pictures that lose. Actually, you can't erase losing pictures. You have to replace them with winning ones. But how does a losing trader form winning pictures? A losing trader can't. Only a winning trader can do that, hence Jack's emphasis on starting with the very basics and building on success.
The dummies who complain about the length of Jack's posts and want someone to give a short version miss the point entirely. They are stuck and don't have the energy it takes to leave where they are because they are spending it on defending their losing ways. Notice how loudly these losers defend their beliefs and how important it is to them that others share their views. Is it any wonder they can't make money trading?
In the end, Jack owes us nothing and those of us who continue to learn from him owe him a great deal. He is a generous man and this thread is a testament to his generosity and to his mastery of the trading craft. It's too bad the authority here at ET didn't comprehend that.
The final straw came in the following thread:
http://www.elitetrader.com/vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=21239&perpage=6&pagenumber=3
I'm amazed at Jack's energy, really. He put up with a lot of shit from dummies who obviously can't trade and were inexplicably threatened by his posts. I found his market insights, which he was sharing for FREE, to be brilliant.
There are dummies who will read this and say "His posts were too long and he used 800 words to describe a simple thing like price channels in riddles." What these dummies are missing is that good trading is really not complicated. Jack's rockets, icebergs, points 1-2-3 channels are nothing original. It's the pictures he drew that accompanied those things that are the keys to success.
Jack is a master at erasing pictures that lose. Actually, you can't erase losing pictures. You have to replace them with winning ones. But how does a losing trader form winning pictures? A losing trader can't. Only a winning trader can do that, hence Jack's emphasis on starting with the very basics and building on success.
The dummies who complain about the length of Jack's posts and want someone to give a short version miss the point entirely. They are stuck and don't have the energy it takes to leave where they are because they are spending it on defending their losing ways. Notice how loudly these losers defend their beliefs and how important it is to them that others share their views. Is it any wonder they can't make money trading?
In the end, Jack owes us nothing and those of us who continue to learn from him owe him a great deal. He is a generous man and this thread is a testament to his generosity and to his mastery of the trading craft. It's too bad the authority here at ET didn't comprehend that.
I know you may not care but you guys along with a few others ruined what a lot of other people thought was a great learning experience in this thread. If you objective was to ruin what we were learning, i congratulate you. You succeeded. My daily checking in on ET has now become a sad thing. What has been done has been done. You truly have taken away from many other peoples' enjoyment.
sincerely,
Jc
**as i am not going to post much if ever anymore on ET, I would like to wish everyone the best of luck in learning jacks methods. As i am grooving as of late, anyone who has a question can pm me and i will answer their questions as best as possible. best of luck to everyone.
sincerely,
Jc
**as i am not going to post much if ever anymore on ET, I would like to wish everyone the best of luck in learning jacks methods. As i am grooving as of late, anyone who has a question can pm me and i will answer their questions as best as possible. best of luck to everyone.
Like I said, this stuff has been going on since the begining. It's not new or unexpected. He must have been almost done with the final reedit he was working on up to that minute. Then just quit on it because for the 100th time someone disagreed with him. This had become standard operating procedure. I was looking forward to Labor Day as much as anybody. Oh well, enough of that, the only way to really understand would be if Jack explained it himself. He was here because he wanted to share what he knew. Why would he brush off those who were interested in what he knew because of those who were not?
No answers. Just thinking..............OK, I'm done. Back to learning how to trade for a living.
No answers. Just thinking..............OK, I'm done. Back to learning how to trade for a living.
I will try to divert the topic back to trading before more people decide to leave ... nwb, I hope you stick around for a while, your contributions and insights are very helpful.
Tue
9:45 Mich report due -> came out late at 9:55 -> BO -> rocket
Hesitated to enter waiting for pt 2 -> pt 2 at 10:05 -> pt 3 at 10:25 ->
#1 short 10:29 9374 (late)
-> fail trav right away -> reverse 10:35 9385 (late again)
-11
-> trav left -> exit at 10:40 9398 at what I thought was away side. In fact I chickened out.
+13
Left 30 pt on the table so I decided to stop trading in that spiteful state.
Day +2 (2 trades)
Throughout the day I've been feeling the pressure of live trading - hesitation to enter on setups, fear of losing profits, glued to the P&L.
Wed
CCC on low volume (stoc in short zone but MACDhist bad and volume real dry) forming a pennant -> BO at 10:57 -> hesitated again -> waited for pt 2 at 11:01 -> pt 3 at 11:18 but vol still dry -> picked up at 11:29 ->
long 11:30 9413
sell 11:37 9414 on failure to traverse (exit should've been a couple minutes earlier)
+1
Edit: should've reversed here.
Day +1
Week +3 (3 trades) practically BE.
Today was better, still hesitating to pull the trigger on setups. Low volume weighs on setup validity as well, so if I don't know what's happening I will not enter. Will keep it simple in the beginning till I eliminate some of the emotions.
I am using Sierra to chart YM; times on the chart are set to European central.
Good luck,
Vorzo
Tue
9:45 Mich report due -> came out late at 9:55 -> BO -> rocket
Hesitated to enter waiting for pt 2 -> pt 2 at 10:05 -> pt 3 at 10:25 ->
#1 short 10:29 9374 (late)
-> fail trav right away -> reverse 10:35 9385 (late again)
-11
-> trav left -> exit at 10:40 9398 at what I thought was away side. In fact I chickened out.
+13
Left 30 pt on the table so I decided to stop trading in that spiteful state.
Day +2 (2 trades)
Throughout the day I've been feeling the pressure of live trading - hesitation to enter on setups, fear of losing profits, glued to the P&L.
Wed
CCC on low volume (stoc in short zone but MACDhist bad and volume real dry) forming a pennant -> BO at 10:57 -> hesitated again -> waited for pt 2 at 11:01 -> pt 3 at 11:18 but vol still dry -> picked up at 11:29 ->
long 11:30 9413
sell 11:37 9414 on failure to traverse (exit should've been a couple minutes earlier)
+1
Edit: should've reversed here.
Day +1
Week +3 (3 trades) practically BE.
Today was better, still hesitating to pull the trigger on setups. Low volume weighs on setup validity as well, so if I don't know what's happening I will not enter. Will keep it simple in the beginning till I eliminate some of the emotions.
I am using Sierra to chart YM; times on the chart are set to European central.
Good luck,
Vorzo
Attachments
OK I am posting again. I was puzzled by all the people in support of Jack, so I went back and started reading the thread again. You know what? The stuff makes sense this time around. I think my trading has progressed to the point where I understand market sequences better, and this is all clicking now. I still don't believe everything Jack says, but damned if this isn't going to help my trading. Jack if you are reading this, I apologize again, and thanks for taking the time to type all this up. I also apologize for being one of the people that helped drive him away.
Bagger
Bagger
I have a contructive idea...
Why dont the Jack followers start a brand new thread.. and just talk about Jack's methods and how it relates to your trading daily. If it goes well.. I am sure Jack will come back.
Honestly I dont believe any of Hershey's posts and unless he posts some P&L or trades in realtime.. I never will.
But if you guys actually see light from his posting than I apologize too.
--MIKE
Why dont the Jack followers start a brand new thread.. and just talk about Jack's methods and how it relates to your trading daily. If it goes well.. I am sure Jack will come back.
Honestly I dont believe any of Hershey's posts and unless he posts some P&L or trades in realtime.. I never will.
But if you guys actually see light from his posting than I apologize too.
--MIKE
Quote from kleck:
Like I said, this stuff has been going on since the begining. It's not new or unexpected. He must have been almost done with the final reedit he was working on up to that minute. Then just quit on it because for the 100th time someone disagreed with him. This had become standard operating procedure. I was looking forward to Labor Day as much as anybody. Oh well, enough of that, the only way to really understand would be if Jack explained it himself. He was here because he wanted to share what he knew. Why would he brush off those who were interested in what he knew because of those who were not?
No answers. Just thinking..............OK, I'm done. Back to learning how to trade for a living.
It's 11pm here and it's late.
I made a mistake. And I have reviewed the situation.
Inandlong upset me. I explained to rend trader my views. They were deleted so that only a partial mathematical explanation remained.
On the other hand, what was not deleted was the stuff that trend trader laid into the thread. The words left in were "claim" and "ridiculous" or something like that.
Inandlong left those words in and deleted my comments on trend fader's thinking proess.
You have to understand that I and trend fader are not cut form the same cloth.
I did not make a claim.
What I posted was not ridiculous.
Inandlong does not know enough to read stuff and make the judgments he does.
Trend trader uses words that are left in threads. My words that explain why trend trader mistakenly uses the words he does are deleted and I am admonished for saying the words that are deleted.
What I said was that a beginner achieved a goal in a period of time and the record of his work showed two averages. These are facts. They when through some stuff in 1999, etc.
I have considered the situation. I have read, transferred into Word 602 posts. I printed them and annotated them in four colors. I organized the annotations under headings and I will break up the annotations into the headings andsort the 602 posts accordingly. And I will explain to inandlong why a person like trend fader is in the place where he comments on my posts and where inandlong, himself, does not differentiate the thread input he edits, deletes and admonishes me in a comment; to whit:
Inandlong posts:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Jack.. what bothers me is that you write 800 word posts and try to sound like some brilliant market technician.. You think that anyone that is not on your level is inferior.[/color}
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
{color=green]I get a number of PM's that say this very thing, none of which have been from TrendFader.
Clearly the members would love to learn your method bubba'. And they would really love to see it traded real-time by you. Please consider doing so. Maybe you could "cut to the chase" more quickly in your posts, and save the lengthy commentary for a journal.
As for your posts on this thread, and some others here, I have edited out the personal attacks. Personal attacks are crap. That is obvious to everyone. Stop the crap please. It will not be tolerated."
The blue is what inandlong gets from people. The green is what inandlong says to me.
Trend fader made 602 posts that I reviewed. I reviewed his three page Journal on Spy trading; it lasted two days. I took particular in terest in his thread entitled: The truth About Daytrading Futures. I also reviewed the two trades he posted: PG and QCOM.
They are unsettling to read in ET. My standard is me and what I stand for. I cannot compare trend fader to myself. There is no basis or commonality.
Inandlong wants me to can the crap and to post shorter posts. He does not perceive of anything about me at all. I deal in process and success. I give and give and give and give and give.
There is no one in this place who has not gotten a picture from me; and that picture replaces something of lesser value. I paint with substantive facts and I give unsparingly of my time in support of all that ask of me.
Inandlong has not treated me with the respect I deserve.
He must learn to tell people who do not like what I do to not trouble themselves further.
When trend fader tells the members here that I am messing up the place, he is mistaken. The place he occupies in the world is not a place where I can be compared to. He is not eligible to tell this membership that I am messing it up.
When he says "claim" in response to my statement of a performance of a beginner who worked and used my method and reported it. I know his stated performance on 100 trades swing trading is 0.575R from his stated posts. This is the basis that Inandlong substantiates as the standard of trend fader and as a consequence makes a fact that I post appear as a "claim". And it remains posted that trend fader's word qualifying it is "ridiculous".
Inandlong moderates and supports comments of others that have foundations based on performances that are extremely different than the facts I post. Trend fader says he makes money. He says he wins 35% of the time swing trading. I have every word of his posts clasified by the types of trades he does. I have sub classified his viewpoints that surrond his trading method into 15 subordinant categories.
When trend fader uses the word "claim" with respect to facts I post, and then that is supported by Inandlong, I have my hands full with the picture these two people are creating here.
I only have 123 typed pages of trend fader quotes to back up my view.
It is not possible for a person in trend faders shoes to comment on those who have learned and practice my methods. The inconsistencies in his posts, I have cross referenced.
The moderator closed the thread and his editing and comments and trend fader's make up most of the thread. It will rot there in that slovenly state. I posted one over all chart of the process emphasizing QA and ROI. This is an elegant refined and perfected picture. I have taken trend fader's history and all it's subsequent turns and twists to where it is today. It is not elegant. It is not comprehensive. It is not 47 years in the making. If you took a small branch and a whittling knife and sat in the twilight, you could whittle for the experience of developing a skill. I have honed a skill at getting to the heart of matters that is rarely excelled. As a side bar here in ET I am going to begin to do that with the twigs that come within my reach that need to be turned into mulch.
I made a mistake. I reacted to the Inandlo0ng statement made to me to cut out the crap as he at the same time edited my post and left trend fader's "claim' and "ridiculous" in the post I made to set trend fader straight.
There is no way that people here are not going to realize their potential if I have anything to do with it. I asked the detractors to forego their comments. They say that I make a mess of ET. I do not. I am an older person passing along to the future of America a way to participate in the wealth of this nation and world.
There is no post that I put on here that does not have at least one small fact that forwards people's well being.
If I have to again not run live and in voice, it will be for health reasons. I am not stupid enough to want to start before labor day. The reasons are: I want to have the support materials for this done. Iwant to begin from a vantage pint that expert traders can participate along with beginners and intermediates.
Trend fader posts on daytrading futures. He has not done that. He failed to keep a journal on SPY. He is not past beginner in swing trading and is operating at .575R, roughly. He has baggered Dawg on all the rockets aspects beginner stuff. Magna copied six of his requests of Dawg and told trend fader that if dawg wanted to post what he was trying to gleen from him dawg would volunteeer it. He argued with Magna next and took the trouble to explain that what i was doing was nothing and the fact that Dawg was doing so well was just becuase of dawg's efforts. I had not seen this duplicity before.
For the reasons above, I will no longer tolerate trend fader in my presence. Nor will I tolerate any of the other detractors. I am stuck with Inandlong.
I request that the stock thread be reopened after the posts by Trand fader, Trendy, and most of all Inandlong.
in this thread I request that the posts of all the detractors be removed as time permits going back from the present to the beginning.
I make the request based upon my personal character and what I am contribututing to the membership. I plan on meeting my deadlines and I plan to run live on aol when someone starts it up and I plan to run 5 to 15 minutes ahead of the market after we get the drill down for those who are coattailers. for reference their are transcripts available now of past stuff. you can consult rqagingbull as well for up to 30 post series on day trading stocks. There is one that goes from 22 to 11 to 16 in 30 posts. More than five participants took the ride and i posted on one days notice for a friend who have low 7 digits in the stock. I do not want any detractors participating in the voice. I am used to having full Col marine adjuncts at the WH and I am not up for pussies in my presence. If you do not know what a pussy is ask any marine here.
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