The real truth of Trading- Read it once, you will not be Disappointed.

[Scataphagos]

Quote from dwpeters:

"... From the people I know to be successful I have always heard the importance of understanding the reason for entering a trade, what to expect from the trade, and how to recognize the trade is not meeting expectations and move on.

Yes. KISS. If you can't describe your reason for the trade in 10 words or less, it's probably wrong.

Recent clear example... the ES high in November at 1224-1225... Goes like this... "Possible intraday double top @ 1224. Short". That's it.

While 1224-1225 may not be where YOU got the trade on, that's still the operative parameter. Stop at subjective amount above 1225... 1229-1230, maybe? (You want your stop to be a buffer which contains small, false, overshoot if retested... beyond that, your short play is probably wrong. "Exactly where" to place the stop, and therefore how large of buffer to allow, is something of an art and a guess.)

Another ES potential play which is more current.... "Possible multi-test of 1171-1173... support? Go Long". Stop somewhere below 1171.

 

[the1]

I mean, because of your experience and the expertise you have developed as a result, you can instinctively respond to a given situation without much effort.

Another quick short story if you so desire. I was taking my 3rd semester of Calculus -- Vector Calculus. There was a guy in my class who showed up late, sat his butt in the chair, did no homework, never studied for the exams, and pulled an A out of his ass on each and every test. I spent hours studying for those exams to get over the hump from a B to an A. This guy obviously understood Vector Calc better than I did but he still had to go through the learning process but he had an innate or intuitive ability to learn calculus that I didn't. The same is true for trading. Some will learn it quickly, some will learn it over time. Most will never learn it. I'm talking about talent, knowledge, chemistry, intuition, experience, and so on.

At no point am I referring to witch craft, black magic, fortune telling, voo-doo dolls, or the like. And, I am 100% sure you fully recognize that but one of your characteristics or pleasures is to instigate conflict or to argue, which isn't necessarily a bad trait. That's a terrific trait for an attorney and perhaps even a trader.

Quote from BSAM:

Oh. Is that what I do?

When you say "apparent effort", you mean it's not voodoo, but trading because of visual experience. Is this correct?

 

[BSAM]

Quote from Scataphagos:

Yes. KISS. If you can't describe your reason for the trade in 10 words or less, it's probably wrong....

Scat, when I first started seeing you here on ET, I thought you were a real dumbass. People (including me) sometimes have to just listen.

(Where I come from, this is what we call a left-handed compliment.)

Maybe, it's just your political posts that I find narrow-minded.

 

[emg]

Quote from kingfisher3210:

But brother, some of trades which those simple mindless set ups take, a discretionary trader with a good reading of the markets will never ever take.

Good reading of the markets is essential, paramount and imperative for consistent gains. You can employ automatic set ups with a good reading of market so as to combine discretionary and system trading.

The best traders i have met have a real good grasp of market structure collective thinking. They are tuned with the market mindset. The money flow in their account effortlessly.

They have reached the pinnacle in trading which is the intuitive trading- Using right brain intuition to work on trades. If you ask them why they took short or long, they will have hard time in giving reasons for a particular trade except saying possibly getting a feeling this trade can work.

"The best traders i have met have a real good grasp of market structure collective thinking. They are tuned with the market mindset. The money flow in their account effortlessly.

They have reached the pinnacle in trading which is the intuitive trading- Using right brain intuition to work on trades. If you ask them why they took short or long, they will have hard time in giving reasons for a particular trade except saying possibly getting a feeling this trade can work.
"

I agree with you 100%. Its all about managing loss when trading without stop. that is intuitive trading. For the traders who trade with stop, good luck to you. trading with stop is for loser

 

[BSAM]

Quote from the1:

I mean, because of your experience and the expertise you have developed as a result, you can instinctively respond to a given situation without much effort.

Another quick short story if you so desire. I was taking my 3rd semester of Calculus -- Vector Calculus. There was a guy in my class who showed up late, sat his butt in the chair, did no homework, never studied for the exams, and pulled an A out of his ass on each and every test. I spent hours studying for those exams to get over the hump from a B to an A. This guy obviously understood Vector Calc better than I did but he still had to go through the learning process but he had an innate or intuitive ability to learn calculus that I didn't. The same is true for trading. Some will learn it quickly, some will learn it over time. Most will never learn it. I'm talking about talent, knowledge, chemistry, intuition, experience, and so on.

At no point am I referring to witch craft, black magic, fortune telling, voo-doo dolls, or the like. And, I am 100% sure you fully recognize that but one of your characteristics or pleasures is to instigate conflict or to argue, which isn't necessarily a bad trait. That's a terrific trait for an attorney and perhaps even a trader.

Hmmm...Your first sentence does make sense. I think you and I have some disagreement on what the word "intuitive", at the very least, implies.

I do believe that the ability to do Calculus is something many have, while others just cannot get it.

I do not believe the same is true in trading. I think I could teach a San Diego Zoo monkey to trade. (Well, almost.) It just takes a lot of screen time to get "there". I think that's what most lack. In other words, commitment/discipline/time.

I would say that I do like to stimulate conversation sometimes. I'm mostly here for entertainment. But, sometimes I just like to see what someone is thinking or where he is coming from. New insights are sometimes helpful, but usually at least entertaining/laughable.

 

[BSAM]

Quote from emg:

...They have reached the pinnacle in trading which is the intuitive trading- Using right brain intuition to work on trades. If you ask them why they took short or long, they will have hard time in giving reasons for a particular trade except saying possibly getting a feeling this trade can work....trading with stop is for loser

Nonsense.

 

[MKTrader]

Quote from the1:

Another quick short story if you so desire. I was taking my 3rd semester of Calculus -- Vector Calculus. There was a guy in my class who showed up late, sat his butt in the chair, did no homework, never studied for the exams, and pulled an A out of his ass on each and every test. I spent hours studying for those exams to get over the hump from a B to an A. This guy obviously understood Vector Calc better than I did but he still had to go through the learning process but he had an innate or intuitive ability to learn calculus that I didn't. The same is true for trading.

Again, if we're talking about someone learning to trade and becoming adept at certain setups (mechanical or discretionary) in a certain market environment, maybe there could be such a prodigy. That would be comparable to someone learning math, music or a sport much faster than normal. And yes, some traders (like pro gamblers) naturally have much better instincts and emotional control re: money management and risks.

However, the claim is that someone has developed extraordinary intuition and a grand understanding of the market's context and ebb and flow...in 2 years. (Actually less than 2 years since apparently this guy has been successful since the beginning).

I'm not buying it.

 

[Scataphagos]

Quote from MKTrader:

"... The claim is that someone has developed intuition and a grand understanding of the market's context and ebb and flow...in 2 years.

2 years? How 'bout, NEVER!

Fortunately such "knowledge" (or one's false belief he has such knowledge) is not required to be a consistent winner.

 

[MKTrader]

Quote from Scataphagos:

2 years? How 'bout, NEVER!

Fortunately such "knowledge" (or one's false belief he has such knowledge) is not required to be a consistent winner.

You may be right. I'm certainly not convinced that anyone can consistently do what the guy claims over many years and market phases. But if someone can, it's some dude who has been at this for 40 years, not a newbie. And he'll still have his share of losing/flat periods.

 

[the1]

With that I agree. It took me much longer than 2 years and even after more than 2 decades of trading I still have more questions than answers but the post does raise some interesting concepts, which is evident by the interest this thread has drawn.

Quote from MKTrader:

Again, if we're talking about someone learning to trade and becoming adept at certain setups (mechanical or discretionary) in a certain market environment, maybe there could be such a prodigy. That would be comparable to someone learning math, music or a sport much faster than normal. And yes, some traders (like pro gamblers) naturally have much better instincts and emotional control re: money management and risks.

However, the claim is that someone has developed extraordinary intuition and a grand understanding of the market's context and ebb and flow...in 2 years. (Actually less than 2 years since apparently this guy has been successful since the beginning).

I'm not buying it.