"The Real Romney": Did Mitt pressure a single mom to give up her baby?

[Epic]

Re: the op

As I understand it, sexual relations outside of marriage are grounds for excommunication in the mormon church, which this woman would obviously be guilty of. Also, after checking into it, in the mormon church it is standard practice for two men from the woman's congregation to be assigned to look after her, and help when needed. I guess there are two men assigned to each different family. If Romney was her bishop and he received a call for a religious blessing of some sort, it would be these two men who would be sent as standard practice. Mormons typically divide into local groups of around 300 people, and their members typically meet for various meetings at least a couple times a week. The fact that she didn't know these two men and only knew the bishop evidently suggests that she was likely receiving welfare assistance from the local organization but actually had little or no involvement with the church.

Seems there is a high likelihood that all the facts aren't being presented in this story.

 

[AK Forty Seven]

Quote from RCG Trader:

Nah, they won't play the Mormon card. They won't have to go that deep.

The flips and the King of Bain are more than enuf.

I agree and disagree .Obama wont play the the Mormon card but the super pacs and media will

CNN,MSNBC 60 minutes etc will do stories highlighting Mormon history such as racism,polygamy,magic underwear etc

Bain and his flips are good but Obama has to win and they will throw everything at Romney to assure that including playing the Mormon card imo

 

[AK Forty Seven]

Quote from Epic:

So, if I understand you correctly...

You are equating criticism of Obama's agenda, policies, and the economy with outright demagoguery and anti-religious propaganda, and then suggesting they are the same thing and that turn-about is fair play?

Its fair play when they attacked Obama's church ,called him a Muslim ,Non American etc imo

 

[Epic]

Quote from AK Forty Seven:

Its fair play when they attacked Obama's church ,called him a Muslim and Non American imo

Only the party fringe attacked the birther stuff or the muslim stuff.

Actually, it could be argued that Obama's church attacked itself. They were using actual statements in full context from his current Pastor that were exclaimed during the previous months. And his Pastor liked to release tapes of himself and go on the record saying this stuff.

The topics you point to about mormons don't fall in that same category. You cite racism, polygamy, and magic underwear.

Racism---anyone who claims that Romney's pastors preach racism would look like a fool. First, because anyone who's ever been to a mormon sermon knows that there isn't a preacher giving a sermon. It is a few normal members and youth asked to speak for a few minutes about typical christian topics. Second, because if I'm not mistaken non-white mormons are either close to equal or slightly outnumber white mormons. Only 5% of churches in America are racially integrated, but the mormon church doesn't allow segregation. You go to the assigned building during the assigned meeting times according to what neighborhood you live in. If you're the only black guy in the neighborhood, so what. If you are the only white guy in the neighborhood, who cares.

Polygamy---the mormons they'd be referring to haven't been involved in polygamy since the late 1800's and even then the majority of men weren't involved. The media suggests harems of many wives but in reality a little research from objective sources shows that it was usually just one (or maybe two) additional wife who lived in a separate location and many times there was no sexual relations with the second wife.

Magic Underwear---even a small amount of research shows that both within and outside the mormon church, the "magic" part is just rumor and propaganda. While there are unvalidated rumors spread by over-zealous mormons about a friend of a friend who knows a mormon who was in a house fire and the clothing protected them from burns, these types of stories are common in all types of religions. The reality of the situation with the mormon underwear is based in modest dress. Almost all religions promote or require modesty in clothing to varying degrees. The "magic underwear" you speak of is simply a mechanism for discouraging revealing clothing and other perceived immoral acts.

But I will admit that most people aren't willing to do even that simple research, so they will be swayed by the anti-mormon propaganda.

 

[AK Forty Seven]

Quote from Epic:




The topics you point to about mormons don't fall in that same category. You cite racism, polygamy, and magic underwear.

When the Mormons migrated to Missouri they encountered the pro-slavery sentiments of their neighbors. Joseph Smith, Jr. supported the laws regarding slaves and slaveholders.

Following the death of Joseph Smith, Jr., Mormon leaders beginning with Brigham Young instituted a policy of excluding most people of black African descent (regardless of actual skin color) from Priesthood ordination and from participation in temple ceremonies. These practices continued in The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (LDS Church) until September 30, 1978, when the highest bodies of church leadership lifted the ban after stating they had received a revelation.

---


From 1849 to 1978, The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (LDS Church) had a policy against ordaining black men of African descent to the priesthood. Whereas other churches usually have full-time salaried clergy of whom individual members are often the chief minister to several families, in the LDS Church virtually all male head-of-household church members are part of the priesthood. Under the pre-1978 policy, black men of African descent could not hold the priesthood in this way, and were also prohibited from participating in the temple Endowment and sealings, ordinances that the church teaches are necessary for the highest degree of salvation



Under the racial restrictions that lasted from the presidency of Brigham Young until 1978, persons with any black African ancestry could not hold the priesthood in the LDS Church and could not participate in some temple ordinances, such as the Endowment and celestial marriage.


The racial restriction policy was applied to black Africans, persons of black African descent, and any one with mixed race that included any black African ancestry. The policy was not applied to Native Americans, Hispanics, Melanesians or Polynesians.



















Magic Underwear-According to the LDS Church, the temple garments serve a number of purposes. First, the garment provides the member "a constant reminder" of the covenants they made in the temple. Second, the garment "when properly worn...provides protection against temptation and evil". Wearing the garment is also "an outward expression of an inward commitment" to follow Jesus Christ. General authority Carlos E. Asay adds that the garment "strengthens the wearer to resist temptation, fend off evil influences, and stand firmly for the right.









Polygamy-


NBC's Taibbi Highlights Mitt Romney's Polygamist Ancestor and 'Controversial' Mormon Faith

By: Kyle Drennen
Tuesday, January 10, 2012


In a report on Monday's Rock Center on NBC, correspondent Mike Taibbi described how Mitt Romney's ancestors settled in Mexico during the late 1800's: "Mitt has said and written almost nothing about them over the years. One of his rare quotes, that they left the U.S. to escape persecution for their religious beliefs."

Taibbi then noted: "In fact, Mitt's great-grandfather, Miles Park Romney, led that first expedition to escape not persecution but prosecution for polygamy, what Mormons called 'plural marriage.'" Later, Taibbi cited one of Romney's Mexican cousins on the issue: "Mike, a church school administrator here, says Mitt should just tell the whole story, even about the family's polygamist past that died with the great-grandfather Miles."

Proclaiming that Mitt Romney has "publically ignored" his Mexican roots, Taibbi further asserted: "It's the Romney family's roots in the Mormon religion that remain controversial in Mexico, as in the U.S."

Taibbi observed: "Those strong and persistent anti-Mormon sentiments led to Mitt Romney's "Faith in America" address during his first presidential run four years ago....But for the most part, he hasn't publically discussed his religion in detail."

 

[AK Forty Seven]

General authority Carlos E. Asay adds that the garment "strengthens the wearer to resist temptation, fend off evil influences, and stand firmly for the right.

Its not much of a stretch to call underwear that fends off evil magic imo

 

[Epic]

Quote from AK Forty Seven:

When the Mormons migrated ....

You didn't really counter anything I said. As usual, the propaganda using words like racism and magic underwear, sounds much worse to people than the reality. It would be nice if one day in America we wouldn't have to try to manipulate people though this type of garbage.

"Romney is a polygamist!" -- Actually anyone in his church who engages in polygamy is excommunicated. Ironically, it is my understanding that the mormon states (particularly UT, ID, and AZ) are the only ones prohibiting any form of marriage other than one-man and one-woman in the state constitution, and that this clause is generally irrevocable unless all other states agree to change the federal definition of marriage. So the state of UT cannot even allow same-sex marriage unless there is a federal amendment to allow it, and that was imposed on them as a condition of statehood.

"Romney wears magic underwear!" -- Actually that clothing serves the purpose of promoting modest dress and reminding him of his commitments to Christ.

"Mormons are racist!" -- True, the mormon church didn't allow black men to "receive the priesthood" until about 40 years ago. Actually to get technical, according to the bible only the direct descendants of Aaron were to become priests which excludes all other racial groups. Also, did you know that over 90% of churches in America today are segregated? Did you also know that the mormon church does not allow segregation?

 

[Epic]

Quote from AK Forty Seven:

Its not much of a stretch to call underwear that fends off evil magic imo

Your interpretation of that statement it would seem. He didn't say the clothing fends off evil, but that it acts as a reminder to the wearer of commitment to god, and strengthens to wearer to fend off (or resist) evil.

Like I said, it is really easy to try to twist it into some crazy cult thing, but it isn't really any different than others christians wearing a cross, catholics with beads, jews with a yamaka, or muslims with a turban.

In any case, talk to a couple mormons. The modesty thing is a really large part of it.

 

[AK Forty Seven]

Quote from Epic:

You didn't really counter anything I said. As usual, the propaganda using words like racism and magic underwear, sounds much worse to people than the reality. It would be nice if one day in America we wouldn't have to try to manipulate people though this type of garbage.

"Romney is a polygamist!" -- Actually anyone in his church who engages in polygamy is excommunicated. Ironically, it is my understanding that the mormon states (particularly UT, ID, and AZ) are the only ones prohibiting any form of marriage other than one-man and one-woman in the state constitution, and that this clause is generally irrevocable unless all other states agree to change the federal definition of marriage. So the state of UT cannot even allow same-sex marriage unless there is a federal amendment to allow it, and that was imposed on them as a condition of statehood.

"Romney wears magic underwear!" -- Actually that clothing serves the purpose of promoting modest dress and reminding him of his commitments to Christ.

"Mormons are racist!" -- True, the mormon church didn't allow black men to "receive the priesthood" until about 40 years ago. Actually to get technical, according to the bible only the direct descendants of Aaron were to become priests which excludes all other racial groups. Also, did you know that over 90% of churches in America today are segregated? Did you also know that the mormon church does not allow segregation?

I never said Romney himself was a polygamist,but his great grandfather had 5 wives

1977 is still pretty recent to be discriminating against African Americans

The underwear also serves the purpose of fending off evil.Underwear that fends off evil can be considered magic underwear imo

 

[Epic]

AK, we have had presidents in this country from all sorts of religious affiliations. You would probably argue that JFK was a great president. He was a catholic and at the time "nobody would ever vote for a catholic". Anything you can dig up about mormons, you'll find the same throughout the rest of christian history.

Romney is a mormon republican. Harry Reid is a mormon democrat. Huntsman is a mormon fence sitter.

When it comes down to it, the only reason the mormon thing is an issue is because people like you with a slanted prejudice against it. When in reality it is about as relevant as JFKs catholicism, Ronald Reagan as a Presbyterian, or Bill Clinton as a baptist.