Are you sure ?
The Movie Thread
- Thread starter hcour
- Start date
Actually, I should have written "Kill Bill is the best I've ever seen." I enjoy the genre but I'm certainly no authority. As for ETD, I saw it long ago and don't really remember much about it. Though I remember thinking even then that it seemed dated. Nice action but cheesy production. Direction, plot, acting, all second-rate.
I know it was a breakthrough film at the time but sometimes they just don't hold up. Easy Rider was also a breakthrough film, but if you watch it today, it sucks large.
H
Yes, the kill bill films were , somehow, in the form of their OWN genre though.
David Carradine was a truly vicious, rotten , murdering, unscrupulous bastard in this film, perhaps his best, and most meaningful role, given his career has been mostly pathetic grasshopper schlock.
The fact is it was a love story of sorts, i just felt the subplot of romance was somehow superfluous to the action.
You have to admit, given the dynamic chemistry of the final scenes, that it might have been better to run with that to a greater degree throughout the film-
The audacity of two protaganists, very much in love, and hell bent on killing one another, on principle, i dont think has been used in that manner before, and there are unique aspect's to the kill bill movie's beyond that.
Sardonic irony may be tarantino's take of what may constitute a martial arts film sub-plot, but not mine.
Uh, sure, the ong -bak protaganist was crushed by an object he tried to steal, but thats not the point.
Enter the dragon is sorely dated, sure, the only real issue involved was whether or not the "actor" involved actually knew what they were doing, or could, potentially punch above their weight in any regard, in real life.
This is the kind of movie, Lee would have liked to have made, of that im sure-he was limited by technology, film-making expertise, and as it turned out, his lifespan, god rest his soul.
If you'd seen the out takes, the making of ong bak, then, its serious gear, and i love how the director's approach, to health and safety involved a couple of gym mat's, and slightly padded shoes, and that really shows in the film-just as many of lee's hits were "accidentally" far more real than intended.
And forget quibbling about styles, their all basically the same, just on film, whether something can be represented in a manner, familiar enough to exponents for them to recognise their own methods, things they have experienced, is enough.
This is where jackie chan comes in , unlike so many, he attempts to show pain in his movies; unfortunately or fortunately, he abandon's that realism for pure benny -hill runaway escapism, that to a degree, i think insults a lot of veiwers.
Yup.
Best ever.
The merits of the toilet fight scene in Unleashed have been discussed, and Hoskins was scorching in his role, but as has been pointed out, the plot and characters sucked big time.
Even the bourne identity, ripping fight scenes, but again, in essence, the film wasnt actually about martial arts, and that, perhaps is the downfall of so many films in this genre.
The martial arts are "fitted" into the movie, invariably a shithouse plot, acting, and dialogue.
This movie is different, it "fitted" shithouse plot, bad dialogue and poor acting AROUND the central theme of KICK-ASS, akin to Enter the dragon in that respect.
So absolutely, i'll stand by that critique, best martial arts film ever.
Just swordfighting, ie, kill bill etc, is so cliched, so.........temporal.
The Kill Bill films are derivative of 1970s EuroTrash, Italian Western, and Martial Arts Films. These have always been films that Tarantino has taken ideas from. He just simply repackaged the ideas from these movies and "created" his own style. The Daryl Hannah character is a complete ripoff of the protagonist from the Swedish film "They Call Her One Eye." (great movie -- see pics) Pai Mei is representative of all the elderly martial arts masters in low budget films from the 1970s. The over-the-top action sequences are similar to those found in Shaw Bros. films from the 1970s. Many songs from the soundtrack are from well-known Italian westerns. There are dozens of other examples you can find where Tarantino took ideas from other movies. The Kill Bill movies were certainly nothing new.
<br>
<br>
Yeah, but tarantino said that much himself, in fact has revelled in the fact he was in a position to do so, the difference is he makes films because of his love of cinema, not in spite of it.
And with regard to kill bill's, resoirvoir dogs, heck, all of them, pulp fiction-
All great movies in their own right, except FOR that very fact.
If you happen to be a movie fan, let alone watched any number of foreign films, i think it becomes difficult to look at tarantino as much more than a very slick movie hack, despite his enthusiasm.
Before i get busted down here, i will say i loved his movies, each of them bring something special to the table, strokes of genius, no question;
But like seinfelds "show about nothing",
the minutia of dialogue, ends up being the saving grace in his films, which is great-just not in a real martial arts film, where kick-ass is actually kick-ass.
JMO.
I completely agree. I always liked his films but people need to realize that he isn't some cinema god. As you say, he is a big movie fan and he likes to pay homage to those films he loves. In the end, that makes his movies more enjoyable. He has helped highlight movies that most of the general public have not seen. A few years ago, he and Grindhouse released The Beyond in various small theaters. Probably most people who saw the film had never heard of Lucio Fulci and the Italian horror subgenre. That is just one example that shows how much he loves obscure cult movies. Hopefully, fans who enjoy his movies will seek out these obscure films. They may be suprised how much they enjoy movies considered by most to be trash.
Absolutely agree. This is probably the best in its class, even nearly 20 years later. Killer soundtrack too if you like that kind of deep space electronic music vibe. Richard Gere was an amazing bad dude in that movie while Garcia was so intense. Some great great movie lines and at that time cutting edge style classic scenes.