The categorical imperative

[nitro]

Do you adhere to it?

For those that don't know what it is, here is a simple situation:

You have a friend, let's call him Bob, whose location at this exact moment you know. Another random person, call him Billy, comes up to you and says he wants to kill Bob and demands that you tell him where he is. If you tell Billy where Bob is, he is 100 delta to die. If not, Bob forever goes unharmed. Do you tell the truth to Billy?

Not lying, according to Kant, is a fundamental principle of morality, or the 'categorical imperative'.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Categorical_imperative

 

[dtrader98]

After studying many philosophers and their works over the years, I've come to the conclusion that the far majority draw subjective and incomplete conclusions based on notions of some underlying absolute order to things. The ones that approach closer to the truth are the ones that refute any such notions (existentialism, Derrida, etc.).

For example, take something seemingly objective like logic itself, then go look up Bertrand Russell's paradox.

 

[TheFinn]

Without a God, all so-called 'morality' are purely subjective judgements of human actions. There is no 'right' or 'wrong' in any objective sense in a Godless world.

^This

 

[stu]

Quote from nitro:

Do you adhere to it?

For those that don't know what it is, here is a simple situation:

You have a friend, let's call him Bob, whose location at this exact moment you know. Another random person, call him Billy, comes up to you and says he wants to kill Bob and demands that you tell him where he is. If you tell Billy where Bob is, he is 100 delta to die. If not, Bob forever goes unharmed. Do you tell the truth to Billy?

Not lying, according to Kant, is a fundamental principle of morality, or the 'categorical imperative'.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Categorical_imperative

Kant would be torn to shreds these days.
Do you think it moral to tell a murderer where his target is because it is God's Law that you tell the truth when asked.

The dude was certainly not before his time.

 

[TGregg]

Quote from nitro:

You have a friend, let's call him Bob, whose location at this exact moment you know. Another random person, call him Billy, comes up to you and says he wants to kill Bob and demands that you tell him where he is. If you tell Billy where Bob is, he is 100 delta to die. If not, Bob forever goes unharmed. Do you tell the truth to Billy?

It might depend upon why Billy was going to bust a cap in Bob's @$$. But I presume from the question that it is a poor reason. Fortunately the choice is not binary (ie to tell the truth or lie).

I'd tell Billy to go pound sand.

 

[Free Thinker]

Quote from TheFinn:

Without a God, all so-called 'morality' are purely subjective judgements of human actions. There is no 'right' or 'wrong' in any objective sense in a Godless world.

^This

in the christian religion a person that tells a white lie to save a friend is subjected to the same eternal torture in hell as the worst murderer. is that moral?

 

[TheFinn]

Quote from vhehn:

in the christian religion a person that tells a white lie to save a friend is subjected to the same eternal torture in hell as the worst murderer. is that moral?

You mean, 'does God consider that be morally acceptable?' I don't know for sure, but I'd say that's ok to lie sometimes. I think it's about intent, not the actually lying part.

 

[stu]

Quote from TGregg:

It might depend upon why Billy was going to bust a cap in Bob's @$$. But I presume from the question that it is a poor reason. Fortunately the choice is not binary (ie to tell the truth or lie).

I'd tell Billy to go pound sand.

According to what Kant says it is binary or "priori" and its' God's law.

Finn appears to agree...
So Without a God, all so-called 'morality' are purely subjective judgments of human actions.

and then like Kant also did , when he actually thought about it, must recant ...
I'd say that's ok to lie sometimes. I think it's about intent, not the actually lying part.

 

[drsteph]

Kant's Moral and Categorical Imperative is real.

You know it when you see it - it hits you like a ton of bricks and you are forced to action. To paraphrase Kant, when you are confronted with circumstances where the moral choice is so clearly obvious and without any controversion, you are compelled to follow it. (or reject it and be a shmuck, a destroyer, a sociopath, etc.)

The Kantian Categorical Imperative is not a small thing - its realization compells you to action. Of course, if you are living an unrealized life, that's another story. I think its a lot like a religious epiphany, minus the religion.

I've had my moment, and it was life-altering. I don't regret that choice. And it was Kant's words that I recalled as I felt compelled to act.

 

[drjekyllus]

Quote from vhehn:

in the christian religion a person that tells a white lie to save a friend is subjected to the same eternal torture in hell as the worst murderer. is that moral?

You are completely wrong.