The BS sim journal...Add your own BS!

[wrbtrader]

I remember a video posted on Youtube many years ago by someone about this issue with Ninjatrader...the guy was comparing the program with another program (I can't remember the name of the other program) but he notice the same discrepancies involving timestamp trade fills versus the chart.

It didn't happen every single trade but it was enough to prompt him to post a recorded video of it and he recommended others to do the same and then forward the video to the technical support of Ninjatrader.

Regardless, this is normal in my opinion even when comparing different data vendors.

I use TOS, eSignal, TradeStation and broker charts...I see discrepancies between the three almost every trading day. I truly believe its the norm even for well known trading products like Emini NQ futures.

You will go crazy trying to determine why such is happening and the funny thing is that these data vendors will often "auto correct" their data...hours later, days later or even weeks later.

For example, the high of an particular interval (1min chart) @ 1000am is at 6780.00 and your timestamp trade fill @ 6780.25 for the exact same interval...a month from now when you review that same chart...its been auto corrected to 6780.50 while at another data vendor it remains @ 6780.25 and another @ 6779.75

These types of discrepancies are normal among so many different types of data vendors and even within the same data vendor when comparing their charts to their timestamp trade fills (simulator or real money).

I use to discuss these flaws frequently between 2005 - 2010 with my data vendors along with comparing charts with other traders...it was comical especially when the technical department of these chart programs usually blame the other for flaw/error data or will just brush me off when the discrepancy was with their own charts in comparison to the timestamp trade fills for the same broker.

It will never be fixed nor should you be too concerned about it nor put much weight into when you see these types of discrepancies. Simply, you just gotta get use to it but I do recommend if its an issue for the trader with the timestamp trade fills...make recorded videos of the charts and trade fills as the trades were made in realtime for your own personal reference.

You can then have fun with all kinds of conspiracy therories about how the markets are manipulated.

wrbtrader

 

[Gotcha]

You can then have fun with all kinds of conspiracy therories about how the markets are manipulated.

I think overnight has an incredible edge and unfair advantage here. You can clearly see how after price hit 6759 and didn't go any higher, he had some time to make up his mind, and decide to sell way after the drop but still get a fill that was much higher up! He is therefore able to see what happens, and then make up his mind if he should have gotten out 20 seconds ago and get a fill from that same time period! I wish my broker let me do that!

 

[Overnight]

I think overnight has an incredible edge and unfair advantage here. You can clearly see how after price hit 6759 and didn't go any higher, he had some time to make up his mind, and decide to sell way after the drop but still get a fill that was much higher up! He is therefore able to see what happens, and then make up his mind if he should have gotten out 20 seconds ago and get a fill from that same time period! I wish my broker let me do that!

Lol, now you're just being cheeky. If I could actually encapsulate that action into a predictive indicator, I'd sell it online for $0.10 USD per download. Why not more? Because it would be downloaded billions of times and I'd be able to retire. haha!

 

[Overnight]

Oh I doubt the CME will talk to you. I would imagine that if you dig deep enough, there must be some sort of a statement from the broker that has this information.

I like going to the source, in this case, the company who I am a customer of, which is the CME. And yes, they have spoken with me before, on many occasions. They are a cool bunch of peeps over there. Anyone can call them and get info. They are not some secretive cabal, you silly lad.

I honestly don't know what the problem can be though...

So I would say the time stamps for some reason in Ninja are off. I don't know how this could be, but there is no way for you to get an actual fill at 14:48:59 when the last time price was there was 14:48:37.

Yes, I am darned sure it is NT that is off on printing the proper time stamps. I have suspected this ever since in my live trading the live journal showed a double trade that never happened a year ago. I know that extra trade never happened because I would have known in my capital account, big time. Trust me on that.

I'm one of those folks that likes to dig a bit into these issues merely for information. It doesn't affect the live trading, so I shrug it off and file it into the back of my mind for exploration later.

Your chart plotting has brought it back up to the surface Gotcha. Thanks again, I had been meaning to revisit the issue.

 

[wrbtrader]

I believe Overnight has something too but there's an issue (psychological) about traversing that edge into real money trading from simulator trading so that he's profitable most trading days in real money trading instead of being profitable most trading days in simulation trading.

Funny thing is that we all know that if he rarely has any losing trading days in simulation trading...he could not possibly do that in real money trading. Therefore, we trick ourself into to believing it can not be accomplish in real money trading...resulting in just the opposite in real money trading.

Its the reason why this thread is started in the psychological section and about the B.S. of simulation trading...its ability to prepare a trader for real money trading.

In my opinion, simulation trading all by itself does not prepare a trader for real money trading. Its just a piece of the puzzle and the rest (responsibility) is on the trader to transcribe the simulator trading into real money trading.

The real question is how to do such so that the results in the real money trading is similar like to the results in the simulator trading ?

The statistics can help but its not the only answer especially if the shown stats are not useful in moving that edge into real money trading.

I myself saw this problem many many years ago (stats provided by the broker or trade execution platform). I had to start keeping a set of stats on my own that helped give me confidence in my real money trading.

We just need to be very careful in trying to use simulation trading to give us confidence to trade real money on the same level as the simulation trading.

Its a complicated psychological game that most can't figure out and can only be done on your own unless you're lucky enough to be able to afford a psycho therapist & psychologist to work with you during your traversing from simulation to real money...even monitoring you during the trading session...

Most don't have the resources to do such with is why we're really on our own to make that critical connection between simulator trading to real money trading.

At least Overnight is going in the right direction in questioning the merits of simulation trading in preparing us for real money trading. Yet, the discrepancies between what the charts versus timestamp trade fills may not be that important unless those discrepancies are at unacceptable levels and/or makes it too difficult to review one's own trading involving any trade day in the past.

Reviewing trades for any prior trading day in the past via only stats alone or via timestamp trade fills alone is not as helpful when timestamp trade fills/stats/charts are viewed together to give a better "visual picture" of the trading although it may/may not impact the transition from simulator to real money trading.

I use to talk alot about the importance of psycho therapy in trading via what others had experience until an illness forced me into my own evaluation of the importance of simulation trading versus real money trading.

Simulation trading could not do it on its own when I tried to return back to trading...I had to get help from a psycho therapist because things changes the trading, changes the confidence level especially if those things involved a traumatic event that causes you to question the merits of life itself. You really gotta search hard to find the right professional to help you find your way back to the surface so that your real money trading is similar like to your simulation trading.

I'm not going to recommend a psycho therapist for every trader but if someone has had a traumatic event in their life and they believe its impacting their trading (e.g. confidence, discipline or whatever)...simulation trading may just feel like you're swimming underneath the water trying to get to the surface but you just can't get there while knowing you're running out of oxygen.

You gotta find something to help you get to the surface and to just breathe... help the results of simulation trading to occur the same (similar like) in real money trading.

Vous êtes votre seule limite.

wrbtrader

 

[Overnight]

...

Funny thing is that we all know that if he rarely has any losing trading days in simulation trading...he could not possibly do that in real money trading. Therefore, we trick ourself into to believing it can not be accomplish in real money trading...resulting in just the opposite in real money trading.

Exactly. It is why I have stayed out of live after my live failures in February and October. I keep believing I cannot do anything right. I have deep psych issues with my style I am trying to work through. And it all has to do with the swing/day-trading dichotomy. It is effectively, self-sabotage.

Its the reason why this thread is started in the psychological section and about the B.S. of simulation trading...its ability to prepare a trader for real money trading...

No, this thread was started in the journal section, and I requested the mods move it to the Psychology section, because an astute user pointed out to me that it was inappropriate to have it in the journal section, since it is not a REAL journal. And I will not pollute my REAL journal, or the journal section, with the sim silliness.

It's complicated, man. lol

 

[wrbtrader]

...No, this thread was started in the journal section, and I requested the mods move it to the Psychology section, because an astute user pointed out to me that it was inappropriate to have it in the journal section, since it is not a REAL journal. And I will not pollute my REAL journal, or the journal section, with the sim silliness.

It's complicated, man. lol

Interesting, I was not aware of the threads initial location. Yet, I was under the impression that most trade journals in the Journal section were simulation trade journals or contain no timestamp trade fills of trades (simulator or real money).

Regardless, the psychology section here is a good place for this trade journal to question the merits of simulation trading so that it will not discourage others from using a simulator prior to traversing into real money trading.

Yet, the fact that you include your real money trades within your broker timestamp trade fills still makes it a "real journal" because the real trades are shown too.

wrbtrader

 

[Overnight]

Been quite a while on this thing, but today on GC sim felt incredible after a thrumming in live YM yesterday.

I used proper 1:1 RR on all the trades except trades #6 and 8. Didn't have stops in place there, but the action looked good for it.

As for the rest? Hah! Pointless to post them as the trade entries are FUBAR in NT7's journaling system.

Here's the individual sim account profit list for today.

Yeah, right. WhatEVER!

 

[wrbtrader]

Overnight,

I'm glad you restarted your journal...it was starting to get boring here at ET.

Out of curiousity, did yesterday's crazy market movement light a fire and get you back into your trade journal ?

wrbtrader

 

[destriero]

Fvck this sim sh!t! Die!

GL Bro, I just found this thread.