The best traders in ET

Quote from GloriaBrown:

for me, trading with "art" means trading with feeling. There may be very few people who can "feel" what will happen in the market, that is kind of supernatural ability. I am not one of these few people in the world so I believe in math+stats trading system way.
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Ok, do not believe in "supernatural", I also do not believe in ghosts or the tooth fairy.

But, I do believe in developing ability from experience. Is it not true that great ball players in soccer, hockey, baseball etc, etc have a DEVELOPED ability to anticipate where the ball will go before the ball itself? Their shots, swings, kicks etc are not always going to score points for the team but they believe in their ability to at least take the shot.

Can you imagine a soccer game for 90 minutes where no one had the guts to even take a shot?



:eek:
 
Quote from electron:

Yep, statements from the broker and the consistency confirmed by them is what I am after too. No such thing and you simply do not qualify.

The best trader I personally know and could attest to the fact that he is really good used to hang out on this forum some 10 years ago, then quit it and never looked back, but he introduced me to the forum.

He likes to say that "traders trade and BS artists hang out on trading forums" and there is a lot of truth to it.
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Actually a better description than "bs artists" would be "frustrated disbelievers" they are frustrated because they KNOW something is possible but they can not get a handle on why it is not happening for them.

The opposite of frustrated bitching is willing to share by giving back.

Giving back is gratitude. Think of it all like this, if you insist on pre-conditions such as statements from the IRS, their mother-in-law or some bogus brokers statement as solid proof to you about their ability to make money...... The question must be asked: What are you really seeking? Why not ask them to PAY YOU so you will take their advice, surely that would make it all easier for you to swallow and they would feel warm and fuzzy that you finally might be thankful for advice.

Short story about caring/giving back without money to be made. http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-...in-597-million-blowing-whistle-on-scheme.html
 
Quote from galvinlee888:

Oh yeah, "Art", while most of the TA here claim the "high probability" setup in S/R which refer to Math&Science, you are saying it is "Art" ?

"Art" is something " it will different from case to case basic, ..yesterday I think this setup is ok but not for today because I don't feel right.. I don't trade today because I don't like the chart today.." "Art" is based on the personal feeling, "luck" or aka "gambling" without any scientific data.

If you are the real expect in TA, why you ask the fundamental question in this thread ?
http://elitetrader.com/vb/showthread.php?threadid=277421
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1. Never get too smart to learn from others.
2. Never think you can learn it all from a book. There are books on golf. So you think you can read them and be Tiger Woods? All the other things that you lack that come from years of experience are what I call the "art" of the trade. Not trading on a whim.
3. Me, an "expert".? I'm just the average brick in the wall, nothing more. A slow ugly brick at that.

:p
 
Quote from bwolinsky:

Subs not all to himself. Large AUM in a way. Only sells automated versions of his former system.
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Just so I'm clear -- Prof himself is a billionaire, or PRICEphysics™ subscribers in aggregate are -- or both? :confused:
 
Quote from bighog:

Ok, do not believe in "supernatural", I also do not believe in ghosts or the tooth fairy.

But, I do believe in developing ability from experience. Is it not true that great ball players in soccer, hockey, baseball etc, etc have a DEVELOPED ability to anticipate where the ball will go before the ball itself? Their shots, swings, kicks etc are not always going to score points for the team but they believe in their ability to at least take the shot.

Can you imagine a soccer game for 90 minutes where no one had the guts to even take a shot?



:eek:
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Trading is very different from sport:

1. In most of the sports, like tennis single game, you are 50% of the game, you can totally change the game by your own effect. Only single main investment bank has this kind of power but still far from 50%, and any single human like you and I would not be nothing. So for trading, we are really "predicting" something we have totally no control of.

2. the ball is always the same, and the court is always the same, skill can be improved by repetition. Feeling is subjective and hard to apply the same thing especially the concept is very abstract. Systemic trading way with math and stats can get that abstract part out and apply it in future without your feeling. Your feeling cannot tell what is the real abstract concept inside a lot of noise.
 
Quote from GloriaBrown:

Trading is very different from sport:

1. In most of the sports, like tennis single game, you are 50% of the game, you can totally change the game by your own effect. Only single main investment bank has this kind of power but still far from 50%, and any single human like you and I would not be nothing. So for trading, we are really "predicting" something we have totally no control of.

2. the ball is always the same, and the court is always the same, skill can be improved by repetition. Feeling is subjective and hard to apply the same thing especially the concept is very abstract. Systemic trading way with math and stats can get that abstract part out and apply it in future without your feeling. Your feeling cannot tell what is the real abstract concept inside a lot of noise.
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Forget all the abstract stuff. In trading you actually are 100% of the game. As in tennis, unforced errors will ruin the best of games. Listen to Chrissy, MaryJo, Pam and the other gals that were great in the day, they never say: "the court is ruining their game, the ump is giving her bad calls, etc, etc, etc. The court is NOT always the same, hard court, clay, grass. tightness of the strings matter, the variable's are many.

What you here is: "her game is a mess, she is a mental wreck", "she needs to get aggressive like she was in the prior match, timid will not get her past this gal".

Math is useless, stats will do no more than allow you to place odds on a particular pattern, idea etc.

What works is a process of elimination, discard what does not work and develop a METHOD that is for your game.

Tennis is an individual sport, so is trading, they both are "you against everything the competition throws at you"

If math and science were useful, there would be no game, cut and dried answers are for rocket scientists.

"she needs to come to the net more" "she forgot to bring her game today"

Yes, we are predicting, but please realize we are NOT guessing, big difference there. We can not control the mkt's but we can control OUR game, we MUST control OUR game or it will be all for naught. :cool:

One more tiny tidbit: Even if automation worked, not saying it does not, you FIRST must learn how to trade before you can ever have even a HOPE of automating anything. Some do it. Simple is best to automate...VERY simple.
 
Friends,

I have to reply to the above as,
In my opinion, it is very bad advice. Math quants have not only taken over the financial markets, they have become the market. Last I checked, over 70% of all volume is from programs. Anyone who tells you that math is not critical in the market is questionable. Traders need to change as the market has changed--- this is not my idea -- it's a fact. Get a mentor who is verifiably profitable or join a prop firm to learn what's working now. Exercise caution listening to those who seem not to recognize that we are no longer living in the pre-auto era. Good luck! surf
 
Quote from marketsurfer:

Friends,

I have to reply to the above as,
In my opinion, it is very bad advice. Math quants have not only taken over the financial markets, they have become the market. Last I checked, over 70% of all volume is from programs. Anyone who tells you that math is not critical in the market is questionable. Traders need to change as the market has changed--- this is not my idea -- it's a fact. Get a mentor who is verifiably profitable or join a prop firm to learn what's working now. Exercise caution listening to those who seem not to recognize that we are no longer living in the pre-auto era. Good luck! surf
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Technically speaking, a pension/private/mutual/active/value/etc.. fund running a TWAP or VWAP algo to accumulate or distribute shares for their long term holdings is "program" trading.

They've employed various techniques to "mix it up" from the standard TWAP or VWAP algos, specifically to reduce signaling risk, but ultimately they are not short term, intraday, or HFT "Programs".

The shift to this method was based on price (stock) and cost (salary) efficiency vs hiring a floor of buy side traders to do order execution all day long.

A huge component of daily transaction volume is made up of firms doing this. Again, they are not quant shops with math PHDs trying to game short term movements.

Seriously speaking, I find your presentation of (at best) anecdotal evidence as if it was hard fact (like this case for instance) without having the depth of understanding required to qualify your statements to be the most frustrating and annoying aspect of your presence on this forum.

In another thread you suggested that if you and your "friends" stopped posting, ET would die out, but have you ever considered that the current state of the forum might be related to the quality of its most active members?
 
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