The 1 ES Point REALITY

Quote from Thunderdog:

Really? Just for the sake of argument, let us suppose that a person wishes to maximize the use of leverage. Intraday margins are now about $500 or so. If you could net 1 point a day after expenses, then that amounts to a 10% return. Daily! Too much leverage? OK, then how about 1 contract for every, say, $3k in equity? That's still over 1.5% per day on account equity. Assuming a scalable strategy in a liquid market such as ES, 1.5% daily compounding brings the annual return to just over 4,000% (assuming about 250 trading days per year). Of course, you can continue to scale back the leverage until you feel more comfortable. Regardless, netting 1 point per contract per day is not to be sneezed at.
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PERFECT Post T-Dog...this is EXACTLY the point I was trying to bring...thanks!!!
 
Quote from Pekelo:

Really? That is 250 points a year, depending on the leverage used, let's say a conservative 10K for each contract, that is a 125% return annually.

You clearly don't understand the power of exponential growth. Do the math, start out with 1 contract and 2K and add an extra contract traded for each additional 2K gained. I think it goes over 200K by year's end...
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Again, another PERFECT reply!!
 
again, typical posts by retail traders.

ANYBODY can make 1 es point. the issue is - WITH HOW MUCH RISK.

professional traders manage risk. retail traders just think about how much they can make.

it is a complete loser mindset to think this way. and that's why professionals take money from retail.
 
Quote from whitster:

again, typical posts by retail traders.

ANYBODY can make 1 es point. the issue is - WITH HOW MUCH RISK.

professional traders manage risk. retail traders just think about how much they can make.

it is a complete loser mindset to think this way. and that's why professionals take money from retail.
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I do not understand your reply...if everyone could make 1 ES point per day...they would be retired at 41 and sipping "starbucks" at a resort...1 ES point can literally lead to $$$ millions...this is very serious and nothing light...please clarify...MANY would love to be making 1 ES point per day...
 
Quote from increasenow:

I do not understand your reply...if everyone could make 1 ES point per day...they would be retired at 41 and sipping "starbucks" at a resort...1 ES point can literally lead to $$$ millions...this is very serious and nothing light...please clarify...MANY would love to be making 1 ES point per day...
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You're looking at absolute $ won, which is not the issue. You need to look at the risk-adjusted return; Sharpe, Sortino, average profit to DD, etc... How much is at risk to earn the one ES point? I can fathom any trader entertaining a profit objective at twice the vig on spot, which is exactly what you propose. Pure insanity.
 
Just a point of clarification, if I may. My response was to B1S2's remark that 1 point per day per contract would be a very disappointing return. I was pointing out that averaging 1 point net per day is not a disappointing return. Obviously risk has to be accounted for in making that return or any other, however, that was not the point of contention, at least not in my exchange. As I saw it, B1S2's position was that averaging a net of 1 point per contract per day was simply not an acceptable result quite apart from any risk considerations because he did not raise the issue of risk. Further, and to put a finer point on it, I did not discuss a profit objective per se, but rather an average net result.
 
What if you just don't have drawdowns with your trading scheme, say 75% win ratio and reward to risk of 2:1 on about 20 trades all day every day.... do you worry about a black swan then? What happens if I am leveraged to the hilt on the ES or YM and it goes the wrong way very suddenly and very badly, so bad that my stop market orders get filled way off the mark and I lose more than what is in the account.. can they really collect from me or will I be able to go with another firm and get back in the saddle right away? Will the broker have a way to liquidate my account before it is upside down or shortly after it is?
 
can they collect from you?

of course.

if you are not severely overleveraged, i doubt you are gonna get TOO much slippage to wipe you out, ASSUMING you are not overleveraged.
 
but, bottomline is...if you CAN get at least 1 ES point...you can make $$$ millions...forget anything else...you develop a proprietary system that kicks out 1 ES point per day and $$$
 
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