TF & ES short term

I know a couple traders on here and myself as well gauge performance based on percentage of total daily points/ticks taken.

For instance in CL , using a min of 40 pts per swing to define a swing, you would measure what percentage of the total daily points taken were . .... per contract

For instance if there were 1000 pts offered that day with 14 swings and avg swing being 71 pts ...

experts take 40%-75% of daily points offered per contract
really good 25-40%
good 10-25%

just another way of looking at performance.
 
Just so we're all on the same page. I'm referring to ticks as the smallest incremental movement of any market.

I'm not talking about looking at 1minute charts vs 1tick charts. A 5 tick move is the same on any chart you look at.
 
Quote from Zr1Trader:

I know a couple traders on here and myself as well gauge performance based on percentage of total daily points/ticks taken.

For instance in CL , using a min of 40 pts per swing to define a swing, you would measure what percentage of the total daily points taken were . .... per contract

For instance if there were 1000 pts offered that day with 14 swings and avg swing being 71 pts .

experts take 40%-75% of daily points offered per contract
really good 25-40%
good 10-25%

just another way of looking at performance.

That is a very valid measure of performance.

I can see how it would cause problems for my emotional balance though! I would over-trade because I wanted to be a part of every swing of the market.

I think this is key. Regardless of how anyone measures performance, make sure it's the best thing YOU can measure to make you perform best, be emotionally stable, and in the very best mindset for YOUR personality.

Good stuff guys, keep it coming.
 
Indextrader...

Thanks for starting a good thread. A couple of questions:

1. is that tradestation you are using?

2. are the s/r lines you show standard daily pivots

3. if the s/r lines are pivots, then are they calculated using a 24 hours or just usa open hours

4. i assume your trades are not automated and your entries are based on your review of the chart in real time... do you add contracts if the trade is profitable as well as if the trade goes against you.

5. do you use targets for exits or are exits based on your review of the chart in real time

cheers

toucan
 
Quote from indextrader7:

Hey, thanks for the post and sharing your ideas!

I'm pretty sure...High winning percentage = low losing percentage. Same thing right?

When you speak of..."Average down on each level" Are you talking about doubling down on losing positions? The only time I do this is when I'm trading bad, and when I do it, I consider it a major trading mistake for me. Too risky imho. There will be times, for certain, where the market does not come back to breakeven on the original entry, and you can get burned. Even if your losing percentage is only 0.000001%

I'm not consistent in my position sizes, so my trading stats would be flawed (from a pure trading perspective) if I mainly looked at dollars (versus ticks/points). I monitor dollar p/l of course, but the significance is that it is not MY FOCUS. How good would a doctor be if his main focus through the day was on dollars, an attorney, any professional? I feel a strong need to focus on PROCESS, and to me ticks are much more pure and the same for everyone, than dollars are.

I've had a few days over the past two months where I've made really good profits for the day...that is looking at dollars. BUT if I look at how many ticks I took from the market that day, it's pretty bad (or even negative!) This usually means those "nice" dollar returns I made for the day, turn out to be very poor on a risk-adjusted basis.

My main daily measure of performance is what I call daily PMR. That is Profits to Max Risk. (Daily P/L compared to the largest risk I took that day) If this PMR isn't greater than 1, I'm not happy with my performance.

Just the way I think about things. Thanks again for sharing!

This past week I had 27.9% one tick winners, 65.2% of 2-12 tick winners and 6.9% losers from 1-6 ticks. Even though I had many one tick trades, cause of the averaging down, this becomes huge profitable trades over all.
I don't double up as you think but if I went long 20 @ 1372.50, 20 @ 1372.25, 20 @ 1372.00 etc to a total of 13 levels, this including original signal entry, and exited all at or within one tick of plus one tick of original which would be 1372.75, it is good money trade on a one tick trade. Had one trade this past week where I got out of last position placed of 12 ticks.

Now of course, there are times when I lose AND it is first thing in morning and have not reach my daily goal of 2-4.00pts on ES based on one lots, volume I trade will be staggering loss, but always made up in a few days if it is just one loss. The only reason I can trade this way is cause of all the backtesting of ten years and trading of two years, knowing inside and out what the method performs as far as drawdowns, losses in a row and my emotional state of mind. All the losses I had this week were due to reverses, so losses were minimal. And after I reach my daily goal, I cut back size 80%. The hours I normally trade are first 30 minutes of day session and last two hours, and testing based on this shows only three losses in a row max, so to a degree, on third trade, I do double up size on each level, but never more than that.

I concentrate on dollars but always based on one lot on the original entry signal, the add-ons stats are seperate and monitored weekly.

I don't use protective stops at all, my testing of ES has proven to me for the way I trade, not to use them. I don't alter contract size, it is always the same till I reach my goal and always the same after. Has nothing to do with acct equity, more like how much I can stomach.

I know I can get more bang for the buck in Crude oil, but I am married to the ES as all my experience since 1985 is in this market starting with full contract of S&P500. I have been on wrong side of HFT in Crude oil and my heart skips beats, LOL.

I think those who can trade Russell well probably could trade Crude oil well as they seem to have same movements, but Crude oil has much more truer sense of Support/resistance at horizontal levels and less of angled trendlines on 60 minute charts of both of 24 hour and day session, also much less of retracements back to a trendline on five minute charts, punches thru and doesn't come back, whereas ES is a sloppy market and is much more easier to get out of a trade that stagnates.
 
Quote from toucan:

Indextrader...

Thanks for starting a good thread. A couple of questions:

1. is that tradestation you are using?


Yes.

2. are the s/r lines you show standard daily pivots

No, I draw my own S/R based on price action.

3. if the s/r lines are pivots, then are they calculated using a 24 hours or just usa open hours

Interesting you ask, I have no real preference. I think I currently have my charts to show me a bit of premarket (from like 5am? and then they stop at market close) Not a huge issue either way.

4. i assume your trades are not automated and your entries are based on your review of the chart in real time... do you add contracts if the trade is profitable as well as if the trade goes against you.

Correct, no automation here. I have no strict rules for adding to any winning/losing position. I do know that I am in a bad emotional state if I find myself adding to a losing position. Often times I am able to get away with it, but I hate myself for it.

5. do you use targets for exits or are exits based on your review of the chart in real time

I have a target in mind most of the time. Notice I tend to frequently take profits when we reach a previous swing high/swing low.

cheers

toucan

Thanks for bringing questions/comments to the thread that are exactly what it should be about. Not arguing over what a good trader takes out of CL daily.

I would very much appreciate arguments that don't relate to the thread to be kept to PM's.
 
indextrader7,

Discretionary trading of Emini TF and Emini ES futures within a rule-base (objective) trading plan...

I like it.
 
indextrader7...

Thanks for the reply.

I use tradestation, daily pivots on 24 hour tick charts, enter once and have 2 profit targets, never add contracts and am semi automated.


I look forward to your thread.


cheers

toucan
 
Quote from wrbtrader:

indextrader7,

Discretionary trading of Emini TF and Emini ES futures within a rule-base (objective) trading plan...

I like it.

+ 1

Awesome thread. Already better than most on ET.

Best of luck indextrader7.

I am also focused on ES and TF, though predominately ES.
(some ETFs on the side for longer term hold).
 
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