Tesla 2024

longandshort said:
If TSLA performs like a regular EV firm then it should be valued as one, right? Why should it deserve a premium to peers if it’s not delivering better results?

I’m not saying that Elon and Tesla did a fantastic job of growing output and deliveries over the past five years. But stocks are valued on future cash flows…
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Tesla isn't "just" a car manufacturer. Tesla also:
Makes a truck
Makes batteries
Makes a computer chip (Dojo)
Makes autonomous driving software (FSD)
Makes solar panels
Makes batteries for the home (Powerwall)
Makes power grid batteries (Megapacks)
Makes an energy management system (Autonomous Control)
https://www.tesla.com/support/energy/tesla-software
Tesla also owns and runs a lithium refining plant
Makes a bot (Optimus)

Tesla is also
The world's most efficient auto manufacturer
Makes giga casts for greater stiffness, security and manufacturing efficiency
Has the highest profit margin of all auto manufacturers of its size or bigger.

I'm sure I'm forgetting something but you get my point.
 
VicBee said:
Tesla isn't "just" a car manufacturer. Tesla also:
Makes a truck
Makes ....

I'm sure I'm forgetting something but you get my point.
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If that you are impressed that Tesla makes a lot of stuff, yes point made.

But the number of patents and number of widgets made are not the numbers investors truly care about. Its the numbers that hit the bottom line.
 
VicBee said:
Tesla isn't "just" a car manufacturer. Tesla also:
Makes a truck
Makes batteries
Makes a computer chip (Dojo)
Makes autonomous driving software (FSD)
Makes solar panels
Makes batteries for the home (Powerwall)
Makes power grid batteries (Megapacks)
Makes an energy management system (Autonomous Control)
https://www.tesla.com/support/energy/tesla-software
Tesla also owns and runs a lithium refining plant
Makes a bot (Optimus)

Tesla is also
The world's most efficient auto manufacturer
Makes giga casts for greater stiffness, security and manufacturing efficiency
Has the highest profit margin of all auto manufacturers of its size or bigger.

I'm sure I'm forgetting something but you get my point.
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This is already known. Most of their competitors do the same. What you don’t seem to know is that their profit margins are being squeezed and we’re entering a new normal where Chinese EVs are far cheaper yet at similar feature parity.

A note from Wells recently:
 

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SunTrader said:
If that you are impressed that Tesla makes a lot of stuff, yes point made.

But the number of patents and number of widgets made are not the numbers investors truly care about. Its the numbers that hit the bottom line.
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You want real data? There you go:
https://www.macrotrends.net/stocks/charts/TSLA/tesla/revenue

You like to switch points every time you're faced with facts that don't suit your narrative.
For years it was Tesla couldn't possibly compete with other US auto manufacturers.
Then it was profit margins wouldn't beat other car manufacturers.
Then it was Tesla isn't a traditional car manufacturer so it must be measured against tech.

You clearly can no longer FUD Tesla against other car makers on any conceivable metrics; that ship has sailed.
So you're going after revenue and margins. But revenues are growing (and Energy is growing as%) and margins are still among the highest in the industry (albeit lower than past).
And if you want to see the effects of patents, vertical integration and diversification, you're gonna have to wait.
 
VicBee said:
You want real data? There you go:
https://www.macrotrends.net/stocks/charts/TSLA/tesla/revenue

You like to switch points every time you're faced with facts that don't suit your narrative.
For years it was Tesla couldn't possibly compete with other US auto manufacturers.
Then it was profit margins wouldn't beat other car manufacturers.
Then it was Tesla isn't a traditional car manufacturer so it must be measured against tech.

You clearly can no longer FUD Tesla against other car makers on any conceivable metrics; that ship has sailed.
So you're going after revenue and margins. But revenues are growing (and Energy is growing as%) and margins are still among the highest in the industry (albeit lower than past).
And if you want to see the effects of patents, vertical integration and diversification, you're gonna have to wait.
More...
You're a hopeless, delusional musky fan boi.

It's all about margins, margins, margins.

Oh I forgot to mention ... margins.
 
SunTrader said:
You're a hopeless, delusional musky fan boi.

It's all about margins, margins, margins.

Oh I forgot to mention ... margins.
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No, it's margins against other companies margins. Tesla just happens to have the highest in its business.
 
VicBee said:
No, it's margins against other companies margins. Tesla just happens to have the highest in its business.
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YOU want it both ways. Claim leadership status (rightfully so BTW) then want to compare against other companies. Which is it?

EV sales growth rates industry-wide are slowing. Read that again groooowth rates. Not pure numbers. That is the other thing you do. Talk about growth rates, then since they've slowed, switch to talking about pure numbers.

Talk about anything but what really matters to investors who have a clue ... margins.

Have you really asked yourself one simple question the past two years - why has the stock price dropped in half and stayed ,for the most part, down at these levels? All the while the NASDAQ Mega-Caps (MAG 7 make that MAG 6) all went higher, higher and higher.

It must be because little ole me has been bad-mouthing it huh?
 
SunTrader said:
YOU want it both ways. Claim leadership status (rightfully so BTW) then want to compare against other companies. Which is it?

EV sales growth rates industry-wide are slowing. Read that again groooowth rates. Not pure numbers. That is the other thing you do. Talk about growth rates, then since they've slowed, switch to talking about pure numbers.

Talk about anything but what really matters to investors who have a clue ... margins.

Have you really asked yourself one simple question the past two years - why has the stock price dropped in half and stayed ,for the most part, down at these levels? All the while the NASDAQ Mega-Caps (MAG 7 make that MAG 6) all went higher, higher and higher.

It must be because little ole me has been bad-mouthing it huh?
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Maybe it's your neverending bearish spin on Tesla since I joined 4 years ago?

"EV sales growth rates industry-wide are slowing". You said it, not me. Slowing doesn't mean stopping or dropping, and it's not unique to Tesla, but industry wide.

Everytime you say margin I say Tesla has the industry's highest margins but you ignore the fact.

Wrong, Tesla dropped in 2022 but did just fine in 2023 if you traded it, like I did for a small portion of my holdings. 2024 is shit but fundamentally Tesla has much more to offer than any other car manufacturer out there.

Comparing Tesla to NASDAQ Mega Caps? Setting the bar high to prove your point?
 
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