Techniques for Day Trading the ES, NQ, YM, MES, MNQ, and MYM

I am having a problem with waiting too long to get in. I got in the wick of the down candle and got stopped out. I have only been wrong on direction once in the last few weeks, but I am getting in too late to take advantage.
Was your INITIAL entry a long entry at the top of the wick? That is, at the blue triangle this is your long initial entry OR is the blue triangle an initial short entry? You have it labeled as a sell or a short. Please clarify. Your platform is a bit confusing (at least to me).

However, for you to have incurred a loss I assume you entered long at the blue triangle at 4410.75 and got stopped out with a loss at 4407.75. Have I assumed correctly?

I want to make some comments this weekend if you will clarify this soon. You said you are having a problem getting in too late on a move.

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Was your INITIAL entry a long entry at the top of the wick? That is, at the blue triangle this is your long initial entry OR is the blue triangle an initial short entry? You have it labeled as a sell or a short. Please clarify. Your platform is a bit confusing (at least to me).

However, for you to have incurred a loss I assume you entered long at the blue triangle at 4410.75 and got stopped out with a loss at 4407.75. Have I assumed correctly?

I want to make some comments this weekend if you will clarify this soon. You said you are having a problem getting in too late on a move.

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You are correct. Long entry at the top of the bar.
 
This is a long post but I have several things I wanted to explain here. Sorry about that but hope you get some good ideas and the post is instructive and helpful.

A note: to see the 24 hour chart version and see the range phase BEFORE to opening of today you can look at my post #1405 (the first chart in that post) for a 24 hour chart view of the Gap up open that shows up on the two RTH's charts below.

Ok I am back. Laid down and rested between trades 6 and 7. Feel a little better. I know the chart looks "busy" with all the annotations but I wanted to post it and so folks could see the bigger picture and all the trades. Again, this SIM but live and it will serve to drive home some concepts. This is 5 min RTH's.

Concepts:
It is almost imperative to be a successful scalper of 1 to 8 points in the ES I have to maintain a high win rate. Here I took 8 trades. 7 Winners and 1 loser.

a) Trade# 1 in a gap open BO (it broke out of something you can be sure of that even though the chart doesn't show what from the left). Trade #1 I took a long position on the third bar around the time of it's close. I then added more as price went against me. The correct PA SL is either at the bottom of the Opening bar. Depending on what day it ends up being there can be deep PB's on a Gap up open day. So, anytime the market is in a hurry wide SL's are correct. Otherwise, in the rush of things my SL can be hit before I see a favorable move to get me into profit.

So I am long, then add more, then exit when both entries are in profit. What counts in SL's isn't my initial SL but my actual risk. How far the market went against me before it gave me my profit. Even though I often use a wide initial SL when I go to figure RR after the trade ends (which I usually don't) I use MAE "what the trade actually went against me" plus 1 tick before it went in my favor. As far as I am concerned that was the only risk I incurred.

The wide stop loss is there as a PA SL in the appropriate place even if wide because of the uncertainly of the markets (it's nature!). It doesn't mean I will allow price to hit my wide SL. I will likely exit before that happens, if I deem PA is proving my premise to be wrong. But a PA stop needs to be wide enough to keep me in the trade while price moves probing back and forth. Then there is the concept of having a SL in place on a server in the event that trading goes down at the broker or data feed. At least there will be a SL to protect oneself even if wide. You will see what I am talking about in trade#4.

b)Trade#2 BO continues so I get back in long, average down again with a 2nd entry and exit when both are in profit. You may ask why not "hold". Well, because one does not know how far the BO will go until there is an actual PB that puts price in a range. So again, I lock in profits.

c)Trade#3 Another long just a straight scalp. We are 8 bars up since the open. 7 bull bars and 1 bear. No actual PB's. Only an implied PB. It is likely we will get an actual PB then price will go into a bull channel and the channel will morph into that some sort of range. That is what is expected at this point and time on the trade#3 bar. But that didn't happen and we see that the market did the unexpected in trade #4. Remember, in the markets we are playing in a band of 60/40. And at times 70/30, in some circumstances and in very rare occasions 90/10. That means we can be wrong 40%, 30%, 10% of the time. And I have to know "what" to do when the unexpected happens. That leads us to Trade#4.

d) Trade#4 On the 9th bar from the open we get an actual PB. I am expecting a bull channel next but instead on the 10th bar we get a reversal BO south of the previous bull trendline. But too late, I am already averaging down on bar 10. I expect price to recover and the channel to start. So I make an initial long entry on that bear bar (10th bar from open). As price moves against me I add more on the same bar. As it keeps moving against me I add a third entry long on the same bear bar. So now I am averaged down waiting for the move back up.

But it ain't going back up. So what do I do? I draw in the 50% retracement (pink or magenta lines) to see just where price is at, in the retracement, in terms of that total bull move since the open. After my third entry on bar 10 from the open I see that by bar 12 price has gone south of that 50% retracement. That my friends is NOT a good sign. Especially, when I am averaged down. I may lose the wife's visit to Dillards and my shirt too unless I am thinking strongly about mitigating this damage.

So I decide I will let it go a bit more against me but if it reaches close to 70% retracement, I am dumping this position. By bar 12 (that second bear bar of the reversal) price has breached the 50% retracement line. It is headed towards a 60% to 70% retracement. The odds are now against me and I am averaged down. I sense I have no choice..not if I want to keep my shirt. So, I dump the position losing all the profit from trades 1 through 3 and even more. So here I sit a the end of trade #4 with a loss (not too big but still a loss on my hands). That leads me to trade #5.

e) Trade#5 By my exit time (bar 12...lower red triangle) I had deemed that my original premise was wrong. Instead of a bull channel after that bull move from the open, the unexpected happened. I am on the wrong side of PA. Nothing to do but get on the right side and double-up on my position size to recuperate my loss, and maybe, get me back into profit on a smaller move south than the move that socked me with the loss (because I am doubling up on my position size).

So, on bar 12 after a bounce back up on that same bar I initiate a multi-contract entry. It moves against me and on bar 15 I add a second entry. At this point I am almost double-up on my previous position size I had when I suffered the loss. Now I have the odds back in my favor that the bull bars (14 and 15) are just a PB and price south will continue and rescue me out of this mess. My SL is at the top of that big bear bar that started the darned slide down. It has to be to allow for more averaging down if needed. So I am at almost double the contracts.

Price goes sideways for a few bars (that is good for me) with bear bar..bull bar..bear bar (probing both bulls and bears) bulls want price to head back up. Bears want the slide south to continue. On bar 19 the bears win another good size probe south and I see the opportunity to again do what I preach i.e. "grab that profit", and I do. I exit the entire position (green triangle markers on bar 19.

So, I end trade #5 not only getting back my loss but close to twice the profit I had before the loss of trade #4. That is, nearly twice the amount of profit I had at the end of trade#3. This, my friends, is the power of averaging down, in the right circumstance. The only rule I have as a scalper that I cannot change, it is carved in stone for me, is to follow the market. Probabilities are one thing. Possibilities are many things. It was probable after that opening BO 60% we are going into a bull channel so I averaged down on that big bear bar BUT INSTEAD of the probable happening the "possible" happened. That ended up being the unexpected.

If one is a scalper and that happens one has to act very quickly. A trader can't hope pain away. He can't beg the wind to blow price in the opposite direction. I had no choice but to mitigate the damage done and get the odds back in my favor. Especially, since I was averaged down.

No trader should ever average down unless they know what they will do if things go wrong. I just maintain that concept at that at the forefront of my mind at all times because, the market can at any time, do the exact opposite of what I think it should do. My position cannot and should not be carved in stone. AS A SCALPER IT IS ALWAYS BEST TO FOLLOW THE MARKET, REGARDLESS OF WHAT ONE'S OPINION IS, OR WAS. At least for a scalper!

A scalper has to learn to mitigate and especially so, if averaging down. It takes a lot of practice to trains oneself to mitigate because one's nature is to "hope" the market comes back and renders a profit. But, we scalpers cannot afford to trade on hope. We have to trade with what the market gives us.

An interesting thought. Just suppose, after I averaged down..trade#4.. on that big bear bar (bar 10) price suddenly went in my favor going into a bull channel, as I expected. Would I have not been positioned very well with my averaged down position? Of course. That is the power of averaging down!

d) Trade#6 I had some other things to attend to so while I was now ahead of the game it seemed like a good time to take care of those things. Unfortunately, I haven't been feeling good today and the stress (yes there is stress in trading) of digging out of a hole (trade#4) did not alleviate my physical condition any. Even after getting back in a profit the idea of the loss still lingers. They always eat on me. That I cannot deny. I just deal with it. I just do what I have to do, even when I don't want to do it. Because it is the correct and needful thing to do. The market..that bastard took money (even if play money) from me ...it won a battle but it has not won the war. I retreated a bit to gather myself but as general Douglas MacArthur said "I am came through and I shall return". And as Patton said "we are going to go through him like crap through a goose".

That leads me to trade #6, a short. I took a short entry in the top 1/3 of an established range (gray box) as it was more than 20 bars sideways movement. I added a second entry short as it moved against me. I waited for a probe down and got that 1 bar later or two bars later if you want to look at the bear bar after my exit. This is SIM you know.

Now notice the channel down (the blue lines). We got the reversal that turned into a bear channel at the first PB i.e. bar 15 from the open. I didn't number the bars so you will have to count them from the 8:30 a.m. bar. Remember, an ACTUAL PB's in a strong move is the FIRST sign of a channel.

The reversal acts like a BO but in the opposite direction. The opening BO from an overnight range and was a gap up open therefore it was a bullish BO starting at bar 8:30 a.m. The reversal at bar 10 created a bearish BO. A BO from what? Well, from the previous bull trendline, if one wished to draw it in. Now remember, the market cycle and its phases? Range..trend (trend consisting of the BO and the channel) ...then back to range..then repeat. So we got RANGE-BO-CHANNEL THEN BACK TO RANGE. But instead of a bull channel a bear channel because of the reversal. REMEMBER THIS! RARE IS THE SESSION WE DON'T SEE a clear market cycle.

So, the reversal now serves as a bear BO. What is that likely to lead to? Yes, a bear channel on the first PB. What will the channel then lead to? Yes, a range. Look at the chart do you see it?

So what was I playing in trade#6. Price was in a bear channel. It did not yet have enough sideways motion to call it a range. It was getting there though. In trade #6 I played it as a BO of the top of the bear channel that would likely fail within 5 bars and price would head back down towards the channel, at least enough for a scalp. Count the bars. Fours bars after the BO of the blue channel price was starting to head down. Since I had averaged down, I need price to just move enough for a scalp of 1 to 8 point. IT did on the next two bars and I was out with a profit on both entries of trade #6.

Do you see the power of utilizing averaging down in scalping combined with correlating the larger, intermediate, and immediate contexts? The larger was a channel. The intermediate was the 3 legged trend up that began at bar 10:50 at the bottom of the dark blue channel line and traded up through the top of the channel to my entries. This too was a profitable multipoint scalp. The wound of trade#4 is fading in my mental history LOL... We can see the bear channel has morphed into a range rather quickly. Here is another tidbit. Often times reversals will rather quickly go into a range. The channel if any evolve may not last long. Kind of like in this case. A short channel before the last range of the session. And the latter part of the channel actually becomes the first part of the range (see the range box and channel lines).

I took some meds and lay down for a while then came out of retirement for trade#7 ROFL. By the end of trade #6 we are for sure in a range.

e) Trade#7 Just a straight multi-point scalp initiated in the bottom 1/4 of the now established range. This is again the technique of fading the out edges of a range. It was a several point scalp.

f) Trade#8 was a profit of several points again, utilizing the tactic of fading the outer limit of the range at the bottom 1/4.

I told you I'd be back!

Summary:

8 trades. 7 winners. 1 loser. High win rate! A scalper needs a high win rate. That is why he has to grab them profits. He can always go back in after his exit. If he doesn't, then he more often than not, he will be kissing a paper profit goodbye, as the probing in the markets, by the institutions, hands him a profit (which he refuse to take..guru doctrine LOL) so the market just takes it right back. Wanna make it as a scalper? Grab them profits! Keep a high win rate!

There are scalping opportunities of 1 to 8 points in ES all day long. As long as one's mind can hold up to doing it, without getting weary, there are generally at least 40 good scalps on a 5 minute chart. I may not avail myself of all of them, but they are usually there. Notice price trades right back up to the top of the range just before the close. Range trading.

A trader must also be ready for anything the market throws at him. Remember that bull BO from the open. I expected a bull channel instead we got a reversal or two BO back to back. The second BO was a BO south of the trendline of the first BO. So in a way we can say the larger context starts over with a BO south in the form of a reversal that gives trading opportunities, followed by a channel i.e. that bear channel (blue) morphs into a range (blue or gray box).

So the phases of the cycle give not only channel trading opportunities, but also range trading opportunities and BO trading opportunities. So remember, it still the larger context to look at first. The phases of the cycle just resets when the first opening BO turns into a reversal BO skipping a bull channel. Or you can say it still made a channel just a channel in the opposite direction. Most of the time the order is RANGE to BO to Channel in the same direction as the BO then back into a Range. But there are variations. It really doesn't matter. There are techniques to learn to trade each phase of the cycle. The key is to learn all these techniques, practice them, and to be able to the identify what phase the cycle is in, so one knows what techniques to use.

And have a mechanism in place to rectify things when one gets caught out of sync, like I did today. Today was a SIM. But it doesn't matter the process is the same. SIM or real.

You might want to try this and see. Start your live platform with real trading. Start another instance of it in demo. You may have to get a demo password from your broker and a demo install. Put the two chart windows side by side (demo and live) and prove to yourself they will track precisely together. Any trades you take on the demo you could take on the real account. The only difference is you usually have to trade one tick or more through a demo entry or exit to get filled like in all the cases of the 8 trades except the short exit of trade 6.

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@volpri THANKS, this is an extremely helpful instructional post.
 
Ok cafeole

Another long post ROFLMAO.

You said you are having problems getting in late. Then you get stopped out with a loss. You went long at 4410.75 at the blue triangle marker you said in your chart below (first chart) on that bear doji after the initial BO bar of the open. You got stopped out at 4407.75. A three point SL.

Here is why you got stopped out with a loss. YOUR SL IS TOO TIGHT FOR THIS SORT OF A TRADE. You are probably using a SL of X amount of points or X amount of $$$ i.e. a monetary Stop loss. That is OK but in a BO situation I use a wider SL. Things are moving fast and I could get SL out seconds after entry. To give the trade room to work out there are proper places for a SL in a BO.

I use a PA SL, not a set amount of points or $$, and I will manage it as the trade evolves according to the dynamics at the moment. By dynamics I mean not just the fact that a certain price was made, but "how" it was made. Fast ...slow...hopping...paint drying...etc.

Look now at the next chart down that I have annotated. It is the same 2 min chart just from my platform. And it is from a RTH's view chart. Yours is from a 24 hour chart, it appears.

Notice the opening 2 min bar on my chart. The blue box is the GAP up opening on RTH's chart. The green box is a way of visualizing this gap joined together with the opening first 2 min bar. It is often useful to picture this on gaps. That the gap becomes a part of that bar. I mean viewing the gap and the opening bar as ONE bar. Do you see the SIZE or range of that now combined green bar that is now ONE BAR, and the bullish close of that bar? It is unlikely that entire distance will be lost on the next bar where you placed your trade. Of course it could, but the odds are there will be a second leg up before any reversal. A second leg big enough for a scalp. The problem is this also reflects fast movement and far reaching movement. In short volatility. Things hopping. Back and forth. It is OK to take a late entry like you did on the next bar BUT in BO situations, the correct SL, is my little top horizontal red line I have drawn in. That is the minimum SL I would use. It is a price action SL, not a set amount points SL. nor a monetary SL.

Why is that the minimum SL? Because strong BO's can have deep PB's before the move continues! I know this is counter - intuitive as one would think a strong bull BO = more upside so the SL can be real tight. Wrong! What will happen usually, is what happened to you. A deep enough move south against your entry , even on the same entry bar, to tag your SL and you find yourself out of the trade faster that a speeding bullet (so to speak). Therefore, you have to give the trade room to work. It is such a strong BO it is highly unlikely that a PB will hit a correctly placed SL at the bottom of the BO bar, but it could, and if it did I would certainly want to be taken out, under most conditions unless I had already averaged in and that will be explained later in this post. Suffice to say that I would adjust my SL down wider if I had already averaged in and price was approaching my minimum SL. If I had not average down I would likely just take the minimum SL. But again, it is unlikely price would get to it in such a big BO (think green box as one BO bar).

The bar of your entry is bear doji and it is after that BO bar. There was nothing wrong by entering long late, there at your entry, or even long on the next bar, which was a good size bull bar. But if I did so I would have to place my SL wide enough to keep me in the trade AND give me some room to average down by adding to my position as price moved against me.

The blue box is the gap or what happened overnight as the RTH's opened. Now look at the purple horizontal lines running across the chart. They measure the distance of the GAP plus the range of the opening bar and show where a 50% PB of that total move is at on the chart. That could even be a WIDER SL placement (the middle line i.e. the 50% purple line). I don't use FIBS as many traders do but I do take note of 50% retracements. That is a logical place and is related to a psychological tendency of humans to gauge their confidence or lack of confidence in a move at about halfway point. It is OK too to also place a SL even if a wider SL than the min SL which is at the low of the opening bar.

Look at my little middle orange colored short horizontal line. It represents a 50% PB of the overnight gap. But it also represents around a 65% to 70% retracement of the entire the opening gap overnight move up plus the movement to the top of the opening bar. You can see this when you compare it to the purple horizontal line that run across the chart. This last SL is below that middle purple horizontal line. This is the very biggest SL I would use. Why? because if there is a PB or reversal that goes below 70% of the previous bull move I want out and right away because price has likely reversed. it is no longer a deep PB; it is a reversal. Remember, in PB's the previous trend continues. In reversals the trend reverses.

Some traders would place a max SL at that bottom red horizontal. That is too much for a scalper IMO. Even if I used that 70% mentioned in the paragraph above I likely would not let it get that far. I would just get out. My widest SL would probably be that middle purple long horizontal line. My initial SL would be the bottom of the opening bar (little top red line) but if need be I would adjust it down to a max of that purple line to average in more.


Ok lets look at my bottom chart. Take note of those green horizontal lines running across my chart. They represent my prime and secondary averaging down areas. My prime area is the top half of those greens lines. That is I have no problem averaging down to 50% of that bull bar (middle green line). Why no problem? This is a BO. There is gonna be volatility. It slightly more likely, that price will not even reach the mid point of that bar on any PB even a PB on the same bar (as price moves up and down the bar quickly) or any other PB like the implied PB that was your entry bar. AN implied PB is not an actual PB on the TF you are looking at but on a smaller time frame it is an actual PB. If you were to dial down to a 1 min or 30 second chart you would see that your entry bar is an actual PB on one or both of those TF's. An actual PB is when an opposite move to the trend has a bar that goes below the low of the previous bar. Your entry bar was a bear doji. It was not an actual PB on the 2 min TF as it did not go below the low of the previous bar. But on a smaller TF than your 2 min, it absolutely is an actual PB.

So what would I be doing if I had take your entry. Well I would be happily averaging down anywhere in my prime averaging down area. I would simply be betting that price will continue up on such a strong BO bar (especially if I look at the BO as one bar consisting of the overnight trend represented by the gap and the entire movement of the opening bar (i.e. the green box).

I would even average down in my secondary area which is the bottom half of those green lines. That is getting close to my initial SL (bottom of the opening bar) and if price kept going down and I had been averaging down I would simply adjust my SL to the next wider SL to keep me in the trade and give me more room for even more averaging down, NOT to get me out of a loss. I have already pointed out my very widest SL which is that little orange middle that represents about a 65% to 70% PB. At that point I am dumping any averaged down position, if I had not already dumped it. At that point I would consider PA to now be in a reversal that will likely go in a bear channel.

Finally back to your entries and your loss. What would have happened had you used the min SL as I explained above? Of course, you would have made a good profit even if you didn't average down. Now what would have happened if you had averaged down in the prime area once your entry bar went below the high of the opening bar. A very good profit as the bull moved resumed! As a matter of fact I would have been averaging down BEFORE the prime area was reached (top green line).

Another long post. Hope it makes sense. Bottom line your entry was fine. Your SL was not conducive to BO price action. Wider SL's are needed in BO situations. It is counter-intuitive but it is what works best for myself. Mr. Brooks deals with the whole thing in his books and courses.


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Ok cafeole

You said you are having problems getting in late. Then you get stopped out with a loss. You went long at 4410.75 at the blue triangle marker you said in your chart below (first chart) on that bear doji after the initial BO bar of the open. You got stopped out at 4407.75. A three point SL.

Here is why you got stopped out with a loss. YOUR SL IS TOO TIGHT FOR THIS SORT OF TRADE. You must be using a SL of X amount of points or X amount of $$$ i.e. a monetary Stop loss. That is OK but in a BO situation I use a wider SL. Things are moving fast and I could get SL out seconds after entry. To give the trade room to work out there are proper places for a SL in a BO.

I use a PA SL not a set amount of points or $$ and I will manage it as the trade evolves according to the dynamics at the moment. By dynamics I mean not just the fact that a certain price was made but "how" it was made. Fast ...slow...hopping...paint drying...etc.

Look now at the next chart down that I have annotated. It is the same 2 min chart just from my platform. And it is from a RTH's view chart. Yours is from a 24 hour chart, it appears.

Notice the opening 2 min bar on my chart. The blue box is the GAP up opening on RTH's chart. The green box is a way of visualizing this gap joined together with the opening first 2 min bar. It is often useful to picture this on gaps. That the gap becomes a part of that bar. I mean viewing the gap and the opening bar as ONE bar. Do you see the size or range of that now ONE green bar and the bullish close of that bar? It is unlikely that entire distance will be lost on the next bar where you placed your trade. Of course it could, but the odds are there will be a second leg up before any reversal. A second leg big enough for a scalp. The problem is this also reflects fast movement and far reaching movement. In short volatility. Things hopping. Back and forth. It is OK to take a late entry like you did on the next bar BUT in BO situations the correct SL is my little top horizontal red line I have drawn in. That is the minimum SL I would use. It is a price action SL, not a set amount points SL. nor a monetary SL.

Why is that the min SL? Because strong BO's can have deep PB's before the move continues. I know this is counter - intuitive as one would think a strong bull BO = more upside so the SL can be real tight. Wrong! What will happen usually, is what happened to you. A deep enough move south against your entry even on the same entry bar to tag your SL and you find yourself out of the trade faster that a speeding bullet (so to speak). Therefore, you have to give the trade room to work. It is such a strong BO it is highly unlikely that a PB will hit a correctly placed SL at the bottom of the BO bar, but it could, and if it did I would certainly want to be taken out, under most conditions.

The bar of your entry (bear doji) after that BO bar. There was nothing wrong by entering long late or even long on the next bar which was a good size bull bar. But if I did so I would have to place my SL wide enough to keep me in the trade AND give me some room to average down by adding to my position as price moved against me.

The blue box is the gap or what happened overnight as the RTH's opened. Now look at the purple horizontal lines running across the chart. They measure the distance of the GAP plus the range of the opening bar and show where a 50% PB of that total move is at on the chart. That could even be a WIDER SL placement (the middle line i.e. the 50% purple line). I don't use FIBS as many traders do but I do take note of 50% retracements. That is a logical place and is related to a psychological tendency of humans to gauge their confidence in a move at about halfway point. It is OK too to also place a SL even if a wider SL than the min SL at the low of the opening bar.

Look at my little middle orange colored short horizontal line. It represents a 50% PB of the overnight gap. But it also represents around a 65% to 70% retracement of the entire the opening gap overnight move up plus the movement to the top of the opening bar. You can see this when you compare it to the purple horizontal line that run across the chart. It is below that middle purple horizontal line. This is the very biggest SL I would use. Why? because if there is a PB or reversal that goes below 70% of the previous bull move I want out and right away because price has likely reversed. it is no longer a deep PB; it is a reversal. Remember, in PB's the previous trend continues. In reversals the trend reverses.

Some traders would place a max SL at that bottom red horizontal. That is too much for a scalper IMO. Even if I used that 70% mentioned in the paragraph above I likely would not let it get that far. I would just get out. My widest SL would probably be that middle purple long horizontal line. My initial SL would be the bottom of the opening bar (little top red line) but if need be I would adjust it down to a max of that purple line to average in more.


Ok lets look at my bottom chart. Take note of those green horizontal lines running across my chart. They represent my prime and secondary averaging down areas. My prime area is the top half of those greens. That is I have no problem averaging down to 50% of that bull bar. Why no problem? This is a BO. There is gonna be volatility. It slightly more likely that price will not even reach the mid point of that bar on any PB even a PB on the same bar (as price moves up and down the bar quickly) or any other PB like the implied PB that was your entry bar. AN implied PB is not an actual PB on the TF you are looking at but on a smaller time frame it is an actual PB. If you were to dial down to a 1 min or 30 second chart you would see that your entry bar is an actual PB on one or both of those TF's. An actual PB is when an opposite move to the trend has a bar that goes below the low of the previous bar. Your entry bar was a bear doji. It was not an actual PB on the 2 min TF as it did not go below the low of the previous bar. But on a smaller TF your 2 min doji entry bar would absolutely be an actual PB.

So what would I be doing if I had take your entry. Well I would be happily averaging down anywhere in my prime averaging down area. I would simply be betting that price will continue up on such a strong BO bar (especially if I look at the BO as one bar consisting of the overnight trend represented by the gap and the entire movement of the opening bar).

I would even average down in my secondary area which is the bottom half of those green lines. That is getting close to my initial SL (bottom of the opening bar) and if price kept going down and I had been averaging down I would simply adjust my SL to the next wider SL to keep me in the trade and give me more room for even more averaging down, NOT to get me out of a loss. I have already pointed out my very widest SL which is that little orange middle that represents about a 65% to 70% PB. At that point I am dumping any averaged down position, if I had not already dumped it. At that point I would consider PA to now be in a reversal that will likely go in a bear channel.

Finally back to your entries and your loss. What would have happened had you used the min SL? Of course you would have made a good profit even if you didn't average down. Now what would have happened if you had averaged down in the prime area once your entry bar went below the high of the opening bar. A very good profit as the bull moved resumed! As a matter of fact I would have been averaging down BEFORE the prime area was reached (top green line).

Another long post. Hope it makes sense. Bottom line your entry was fine. Your SL was not conducive to BO price action. Wider SL's are needed in BO situations. It is counter-intuitive but it is what works best for myself. Mr. Brooks deals with the whole thing in his books and courses.


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Thanks for all the info. I believe you are right. I will take that into account in future BO trades. I really appreciate you taking time to do this.
 
You are welcome. TRY IT ON SIM (I REFER YOU TO MY POST #1252) LOL

Actually, I am on sim right now. I want to see consistency in my sim trading before going live. I am using 2 sim accounts - one where I actually measure my performance as if live, the other where I try out different approaches and timeframes.
 
If I may, something else to be looked at...

With the initial risk and a scale-in game plan under control, BO trade or not,
where would the long trade that was taken be closed/exited had it not been stopped?

From a scalping and confidence viewpoint, the concept of R:R may not be applicable. For some, the R:R concept is ingrained, to the point of presenting still more trading issues that need to be tackled.

If not applicable to the discussion or the traders involved, my apologies for mentioning and please continue.
 
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