TAPE READING (chat room cont.)

[Maverick74]

Quote from yip1997:

Maverick,

Sorry for my ignorance. I went over your posts about double prints and tried to see if I could identify it.

How can you tell double prints by looking at the quote window. The quote window just gives you the last price, bid and size. I cannot tell there are two prints with the same size by looking at the quote window.

One more question.
Do you use charts? I don't think there are rooms for 15 charts.

Just the quote window and yes, you need a good eye. Hopefully you have customizable columns that allow you to use colors that are easy to see. I would watch every print very carefully and when there is a double print, it would flash twice. If you think you missed it, you can always briefly put up a time and sales window and double check, but a good tape reader doesn't need to do this. You just need to really pay attention.

No, I never used charts. Not only were they a waste of space, but they distract you. If you are staring at charts, there is no way in hell you can be catching those double prints on the tape, trust me. Besides, all the info you need about the stock is on the tape. Looking at squiggly lines is not going to tell you if there are two or three buyers in the stock, where they are buying and when they get taken out. It simply is a useless distraction.

I did always keep a sp 500 futures quote up though and watched it like a hawk. Very very important to know what the futures are doing.

 

[yip1997]

Quote from Maverick74:

Just the quote window and yes, you need a good eye. Hopefully you have customizable columns that allow you to use colors that are easy to see. I would watch every print very carefully and when there is a double print, it would flash twice. If you think you missed it, you can always briefly put up a time and sales window and double check, but a good tape reader doesn't need to do this. You just need to really pay attention.

No, I never used charts. Not only were they a waste of space, but they distract you. If you are staring at charts, there is no way in hell you can be catching those double prints on the tape, trust me. Besides, all the info you need about the stock is on the tape. Looking at squiggly lines is not going to tell you if there are two or three buyers in the stock, where they are buying and when they get taken out. It simply is a useless distraction.

I did always keep a sp 500 futures quote up though and watched it like a hawk. Very very important to know what the futures are doing.

Maverick,

Thanks a lot. A trader in my firm told me that he thinks the best trader never looks at charts and t&s. He told me to look at the quotes, the p&l, and future index or sector index (if you are playing sector).

The p&l tells you if your selection is right or wrong. Get out if it is wrong, and buy more if it is strong (for example bid up). Using the index to get a feeling where the market is heading to. He sometimes has 30 positions in the same time.

Too bad that he cannot explain clearly to me how he trades. Once more thing: He never looks at the volume - this contradicts with tape reading technique I think. Do you care about the volume?

 

[Maverick74]

Quote from yip1997:

Maverick,

Thanks a lot. A trader in my firm told me that he thinks the best trader never looks at charts and t&s. He told me to look at the quotes, the p&l, and future index or sector index (if you are playing sector).

The p&l tells you if your selection is right or wrong. Get out if it is wrong, and buy more if it is strong (for example bid up). Using the index to get a feeling where the market is heading to. He sometimes has 30 positions in the same time.

Too bad that he cannot explain clearly to me how he trades. Once more thing: He never looks at the volume - this contradicts with tape reading technique I think. Do you care about the volume?

No, volume is meaningless. The volume prints are important as they pertain to pattern recognition. In other words seeing the same 300 shares on the bid, seeing double prints, perfect prints, seeing 100 shares step up to size or offer down into size. This is important. Whether or not the stock is trading less then, at, or more then it's daily avg volume is useless. Although usually news stocks will be trading at greater then it's avg volume.

I knew a guy at my firm that traded like 50 to 100 stocks and he also would just look at his p&l screen and he would buy more shares if they were green and sell the ones that were red. Didn't even look at quotes. Just placed market orders. The guy made about 3 to 5 mil a year and was also our firm's largest MOC trader.

 

[coolweb]

Quote from Maverick74:


I knew a guy at my firm that traded like 50 to 100 stocks and he also would just look at his p&l screen and he would buy more shares if they were green and sell the ones that were red. Didn't even look at quotes. Just placed market orders. The guy made about 3 to 5 mil a year and was also our firm's largest MOC trader.

love.

 

[coolweb]

Quote from Maverick74:



No, I never used charts. Not only were they a waste of space, but they distract you. If you are staring at charts, there is no way in hell you can be catching those double prints on the tape, trust me. Besides, all the info you need about the stock is on the tape. Looking at squiggly lines is not going to tell you if there are two or three buyers in the stock, where they are buying and when they get taken out. It simply is a useless distraction.

Don't agree. Charts are very precise when you know how to use it. You seen me trade before, thats chart trading.

VERY PRECISE.

 

[Maverick74]

Quote from coolweb:

Don't agree. Charts are very precise when you know how to use it. You seen me trade before, thats chart trading.

VERY PRECISE.

Here is the difference. Tape readers get in the stock before the chart guys and get out before the chart guys. Why? Because the chart guy can't react until the chart has been drawn, the tape reader sees the buyer and the seller BEFORE the chart guy does. In this business with it being a game of inches, that is HUGE!

Nothing compares to tape reading in terms of accuracy. I'm not saying chart guys aren't profitable. I'm saying they are no where near as accurate as tape readers.

Coolweb, I have never seen you a trade. I use to sit on a floor with 200 of the best daytraders in the country in NY. Our firm had 800 traders at the time. And let me tell you something, the chart guys didn't hold a candle to the tape readers.

Keep in mind, I am only referring to listed stocks. Not nasdaq and not futures. I could give you so many examples on this thread how a tape reader has a precise advantage over a chart guy, but I've got football to watch!

 

[coolweb]

Maverick74,
You are the same maverick in elitetrader's chatroom who said you can't trade YM With those stops right which I Then proved you wrong easily.

Twice as well.

If not, I have the wrong person then.

about tape reading:

its only for size smaller then 500k
in my opinion.


chart/T&S traders can run games around tape readers in size.

 

[Maverick74]

Quote from coolweb:

Maverick74,
You are the same maverick in elitetrader's chatroom who said you can't trade YM With those stops right which I Then proved you wrong easily.

Twice as well.

If not, I have the wrong person then.

You've got the wrong guy coolweb. I have never in my life said you can tape read YM, ES, or NQ or any other future. Please show me the quote where I made any reference to using tape reading to trading futures. If you can do that, I will pay for a plane ticket for you to fly to Chicago and take you out to a steak dinner at Gibson's. Let's see what you come up with. No risk bet for you.

 

[ilganzo]

Quote from Maverick74:

No, I never used charts. Not only were they a waste of space, but they distract you. If you are staring at charts, there is no way in hell you can be catching those double prints on the tape, trust me. Besides, all the info you need about the stock is on the tape. Looking at squiggly lines is not going to tell you if there are two or three buyers in the stock, where they are buying and when they get taken out. It simply is a useless distraction.

Interesting. So how do you read S/R levels?

 

[Maverick74]

Quote from ilganzo:

Interesting. So how do you read S/R levels?

You don't. You read buyers and sellers. When there is an institutional buyer in a stock, there is no resistance and vice versa.