Takers versus the Makers.

[mrbill]

Quote from Tsing Tao:

First, you can't speak to what Obama wants, nor can I. What we can do is gauge where he's going with his actions. His actions indicate that he's pushing for an entitlement society - there's no question of this.

As for you meaning the longevity of the United States in your "working together" comment, that's exactly what I meant when I said "we're working towards opposite goals". I don't want the United States you're trying to push on me. I want the one the Founders established. So do many other libertarians. What you and the left clearly are pushing for is some sort of entitlement society.

You can (like your pall L-K) say that's not what you want, but you cast a vote to make it happen, so your words are pretty meaningless when they go against your actions.

1. There is always a 'question of this.'

2. I'm not trying to push anything on you. I have not advocated entitlements. I am for workfare, not welfare. Put people to work before they receive any payments. Works better for the workers and the U.S.

3. I simply voted for what I feel is the better choice. Romney was a nightmare. I did not vote for Clinton, for example.

4 The Founders message seems to have been both interpreted and mis-interpreted by many over the centuries. I try to deal with present day situations.

But, thanks for keeping the conversation civil Tsing.

 

[Tsing Tao]

Quote from mrbill:

1. There is always a 'question of this.'

2. I'm not trying to push anything on you. I have not advocated entitlements. I am for workfare, not welfare. Put people to work before they receive any payments. Works better for the workers and the U.S.

3. I simply voted for what I feel is the better choice. Romney was a nightmare. I did not vote for Clinton, for example.

4 The Founders message seems to have been both interpreted and mis-interpreted by many over the centuries. I try to deal with present day situations.

But, thanks for keeping the conversation civil Tsing.

1. What?

2. You claim to not advocate entitlements, yet you cast a vote for an administration that clearly has that at the top of their agenda. Again, actions speak louder than (false) words.

3. Fine, that is certainly your right. And if you had said "you know what? my greatest issue is cutting the military, and Romney does not support that, so I had to vote Obama." I wouldn't be able to argue anything. But here you are claiming to support reforming entitlements and you supported the one candidate most likely to not do it. Sorry.

4. The Constitution is just as applicable now as it was when it was written. In it's framework, it provides a method for amending it, just in case something was not included that needed to be. That has not been used in many cases. Instead, we ignore states rights, and just grow federal, central government. Real world has nothing to do with it. It's a grab for power.

 

[L-Kabong]

Quote from Tsing Tao:


2. You claim to not advocate entitlements, yet you cast a vote for an administration that clearly has that at the top of their agenda.

At this moment in history, entitlements should be at the top of a President's agenda. Obama is the first President to attempt to reform the cost of entitlements. Like CaptainObvious said, he's paid into the system for 40 years, he is entitled to get something back now that he is approaching his later years (apologies for the phrasing CO). So you have to do it right and not throw a whole generation under the bus.

Second, you seem to have been infected with the hogwash peddled by people like Gingrich who called Obama "The Foodstamp President". Would you prefer a President's actions in a severe recession earn him the moniker "The Let Them Eat Cake President"?

Any idiot can argue that the welfare state is oversized, but the rap you give on Obama on its present condition is a canard that fragile fringe people like yourself promote to soften the ego blow delivered by the reality of the presidential election. Your hopes for an Ayn Rand utopia have been relegated to the pages of fiction, from whence they sprang and where they will ultimately end. The pages of history are turning, and for you, Lucrum, and the other angry sad sacks here who rant in solidarity with you, you simply cannot accept that. But worst of all, your fate is already etched into fabric of reality, for in the future, your brethren and their ideas will be remembered as a misguided but quaint yearning for the yeoman days so long ago envisioned by Jefferson.

 

[bigarrow]

"Commonwealth of Pennsylvania (a state best known for its broke capital Harrisburg). "

Really that's what Pennsylvania is best known for? First thing that came in my mind was Ben Franklin, the liberty bell, the Steelers. But none of those are what Pennsylvania is best known for.... Really...

 

[denner]

Quote from L-Kabong:

At this moment in history, entitlements should be at the top of a President's agenda. Obama is the first President to attempt to reform the cost of entitlements. Like CaptainObvious said, he's paid into the system for 40 years, he is entitled to get something back now that he is approaching his later years (apologies for the phrasing CO). So you have to do it right and not throw a whole generation under the bus.

Second, you seem to have been infected with the hogwash peddled by people like Gingrich who called Obama "The Foodstamp President". Would you prefer a President's actions in a severe recession earn him the moniker "The Let Them Eat Cake President"?

Any idiot can argue that the welfare state is oversized, but the rap you give on Obama on its present condition is a canard that fragile fringe people like yourself promote to soften the ego blow delivered by the reality of the presidential election. Your hopes for an Ayn Rand utopia have been relegated to the pages of fiction, from whence they sprang and where they will ultimately end. The pages of history are turning, and for you, Lucrum, and the other angry sad sacks here who rant in solidarity with you, you simply cannot accept that. But worst of all, your fate is already etched into fabric of reality, for in the future, your brethren and their ideas will be remembered as a misguided but quaint yearning for the yoeman days so long ago envisioned by Jefferson.

So entitlement reform turns into another paranoid rant about all "you angry,white Republicans".

 

[L-Kabong]

Quote from denner:

So entitlement reform turns into another paranoid rant about all "you angry,white Republicans".

Why would anyone have a smidgeon of paranoia over such an impotent and passe group?

 

[denner]

Quote from L-Kabong:

Why would anyone have a smidgeon of paranoia over such an impotent and passe group?

I'm just having a hard time wrapping my head around the notion of a middle aged white guy living in Fairfield County, CT acting like a community organizer in some inner city.

Was it some sort of "guilt" after you realized you might have crossed the bounds talking about entitlement reform?

Or are you just another typical limousine liberal?

 

[L-Kabong]

Quote from denner:

I'm just having a hard time wrapping my head around the notion of a middle aged white guy living in Fairfield County, CT acting like a community organizer in some inner city.

Was it some sort of "guilt" after you realized you might have crossed the bounds talking about entitlement reform?

Or are you just another typical limousine liberal?

Sorry. None of the above. Ain't that interested in the inner city.

When are you guys going to get it? You can be rich and a be a liberal and be content. It's the thwarted wannabes that think the deck is stacked against them.

Go out there and be a big time maker. If you can't, it isn't the taker's fault.

Brutus, it's not in the stars.

 

[Tsing Tao]

Quote from L-Kabong:

At this moment in history, entitlements should be at the top of a President's agenda. Obama is the first President to attempt to reform the cost of entitlements.

Please backup your claim with just what the President has done to attempt reforming the cost of entitlements. Just be warned, if you use Obamacare as the crux of your argument, an act which adds to the overall cost of entitlements, I'm just going to laugh at you and ignore you.

However, if you have proof of some other stealth actions where Obama has done that is serious to reform entitlements, please post away.

 

[Tsing Tao]

Quote from L-Kabong:

Why would anyone have a smidgeon of paranoia over such an impotent and passe group?

If they were so impotent as you claim, why are all the news channels so obsessed with them and the fiscal cliff?