TA - Objective or Psychological Skill?

[jem]

in the end that is the whole point of it a good entry at a point that might not be noise.

even the Fed said their paper found that currencies bounce at round numbers.

its absurd to claim the markets don't respond to some numbers non randomly.

Quote from cornix:

Alright, but no different in uselessness or usefulness?

P. S. That's how I tested TA vs. random entries. It's easy for me cause I already have a working TA approach. I simply took all the same trade management tricks and nuances of my TA entries and applied them to random entries. According to your and Dr. Maestro's hypothesis result should be the same as success is to be attributed to trade management and not the entry. But results were MUCH different. Which tells me there's still some difference and entries do matter.

 

[cornix]

Quote from jem:

in the end that is the whole point of it a good entry at a point that might not be noise.

even the Fed said their paper found that currencies bounce at round numbers.

its absurd to claim the markets don't respond to some numbers non randomly.

Yea, but somehow certain "academics" disagree. I wonder what's their methodology of testing they don't see the obvious.

 

[tobbe]

Quote from wrbtrader:
I don't know how NoDoji, Cornix and others define "Objective TA" (e.g. buy if today's volume > yesterday's volume). Yet, I do know there's also "subjective TA" (e.g. trendlines).

Trendlines are not necessarily subjective. For an objective definition, see DeMarks New Market Timing Techniques. Or if you prefer to have someone decipher that into plain english, check out the same definition in Schwagers On Futures: Technical Analysis, chapter 3, Trends. I think that everyone I know draw trendlines the same way. No subjectivity.

Quote from wrbtrader:
Too many problems with the semantics of these debates. Folks don't define what they call TA, pure TA, objective TA, subjective TA, discretionary, automation and then if they do define such...others don't agree with the definition. That's probably why these TA debates have continued for +20 years and will continue for as long as there are markets due to the fact most can't agree on the definitions.

It's also a major source of all the joy and entertainment on this site so lets hope it stays this way.

 

[kut2k2]

Quote from marketsurfer:

Ok, thanks. Care to share your discovery? Surely a money management angle could be shared without diminishing its value. surf

Yeah but since it works, why not sell it and make money instead of giving it away? I've made a lot of good contributions here in ET that have mostly met with yawns or even troll attacks. No more. If folks wanna know what I've figured out, they can either pay for it or figure it out themselves.

 

[outsource100]

Quote from wrbtrader:

Simply, I don't believe anyone that's a "discretionary trader" saying they only use "objective TA" especially when they are already on record saying there are other components in their trading plan that's important to them.

But NON-discretionary traders DO use "objective TA".Your problem is in terms.As for ND,Cornix and the other ET "TA gang",they do not approach the market from a scientific viewpoint in the first place.They discretionary use poor TA objects incoherently,keep being frustrated on a daily basis .

 

[cornix]

Quote from outsource100:

But NON-discretionary traders DO use "objective TA".Your problem is in terms.As for ND,Cornix and the other ET "TA gang",they do not approach the market from a scientific viewpoint in the first place.They discretionary use poor TA objects incoherently,keep being frustrated on a daily basis .

Oh really?

 

[smallStops]

this is first class entertainment : TA or no TA.

 

[cornix]

Quote from tobbe:
Trendlines are not necessarily subjective.

Yep. Trendlines are absolutely objective among those people who agree about certain rules to construct them.

 

[ammo]

Quote from cornix:

Yep. Trendlines are absolutely objective among those people who agree about certain rules to construct them.

everyone has there own rules and the mention of someday the programmers will figure this out suggests programming or the programs begin subjectively so all the talk of subjective objective is nothing more than a logic switch going on/off on/off and t analysis or ta is subjective as it changes with every add/delete of data

 

[wrbtrader]

Quote from tobbe:

Trendlines are not necessarily subjective. For an objective definition, see DeMarks New Market Timing Techniques. Or if you prefer to have someone decipher that into plain english, check out the same definition in Schwagers On Futures: Technical Analysis, chapter 3, Trends. I think that everyone I know draw trendlines the same way. No subjectivity...

I'm not talking about the definition as being subjective. Of course one can mathematically compute trendlines and/or define such objectively. Also, there's available software programs that auto draw trendlines.

I'm talking about how traders apply the trendlines. They can not agree upon which trendlines on the exact same chart are important let alone how to use them the same within a trade strategy. Thus, the application process is subjective due to the fact its being used by "discretionary traders". In contrast, this is less of an issue for "automation traders" or traders using the exact same auto generating trendline software.

Too many threads here at ET where a newbie trader ask for help about where to place his/her trendlines and which ones are important. You eventually lose count at all the different traders that have different answers or annotate the chart differently.

Just the same, compare different software that auto generate trendlines on the same chart...you get different trendlines. There's a thread over at ForexFactory.com a few years back where someone ask for traders using automated trendline programs to post charts of GBPUSD on the hourly time frame. I was very surprise by how many automated trendline programs would draw the trendlines differently in comparison to each other (e.g. Ninjatrader, linnsoft, Metatrader, Ensign, ProRealtime and many traders with their own customized trendline code).

So yeah, one can easily objectively define a trendline. :eek: