Swing Trading VS. Day Trading

[oshjdf]

No, this was I realisation I had when I was younger and somewhat more naive than now. I had quitted my job to go for daytrading. My friends slowly climbed the corporate ladder and bought bigger and bigger homes, while I was stuck and had to admit I failed. I also realized that trading needed a much higher return, eg a minimum of 600k p/a to become somewhat comparable with a 'riskless' job. Suppose you pass 40 and the last 8 years on the resume are daytrading, it is somewhat difficult to explain. Possible yes, but difficult.

May I know your stats (win rate, average RR, trade frequency per month, current capital)? Have you ever considered what you're capable of doing with what your trading activity provides that your employed friends not capable of doing?

 

[oshjdf]

I don't known, but to me it seems as the if the author of the article doesn't have his own stuff together. If one cannot sleep during nights, then it's due to excessive position sizing or due "control issues" or stuff like that. I think those issues with swing trades will also manifest in intraday trading, but in different forms.


One way to assess the effectiveness of day trading strategies is by how much of the available “daily travel range” a strategy is able to capture each day in combination with reasonable R/R (other variables need to be removed). Unfortunately, most index scalping / intraday trading strategies fail miserably in this regard. Obviously, there are exceptions, but those are rather rare.


The way I see things is that the definition of day trading is being flat overnight. It has nothing to do with trade frequency. No one needs to be married to a monitor and react to every price wiggle and riding the emotional roller coaster while formulating their trading plan in the heat of the moment.

Many index traders keep on spinning the wheels because the indices don’t present that many quality setups as a universe of big cap stocks does, therefore most index traders take sub-optimal trades on very low TFs (in attempt to increase opportunities), and it often becomes a never-ending struggle for some of them.

However, if an intraday trader trades a universe of big cap stock, he then can choose explosive setups that capture ¾ of the available daily range (if one is good at identifying stocks that are being bought/sold by institutions). That's one way to create a "leverage".

At the end of the day if there is still institutional buying/selling pressure in that stock, then the profit can be used to buy an option and turn it into a swing trade (with defined risk). With trades like this, the R/R can be very high, providing the initial risk was defined on a M5 TF in the morning.

The above is just one method of many on how to swing trade with very limited risk in stocks that are being chased / sold by institutions. They’re big elephants, they cannot hide.

Intraday trading can be used to fine tune entries and to limit risk, and not as the only way to trade full time. There are many ways to trade the market.

This is great summary of day trading. Take A+ setup on multiple symbols.

In the old days, I trade futures using strategy that works on multiple symbols but only trade a single symbol due to high trade frequency (min 2 per days) and fast action needed.

Nowadays, a different strategy that works in multiple symbols (including stocks and cryptos but only swing), trade multiple symbols intraday due to automation of the analysis (yet to fully automate until order execution level even though theoretically achievable ~ only capable coding pinescript) and less trade frequency per symbol (2-3 per week). The stats is awesome.

 

[wxytrader]

@destriero, @taowave, @newwurldmn.... and the other professionals must be losers?

I've read Natenburgs Options volatility and pricing so that's basically the depths of their knowledge.

Anyway they're not making any money worth mentioning. Option strategies are just playing both sides of the fence.You don't get rewarded for not taking risk.

That's why they blocked me because I'm the one driving a (2008) Lambo and all their knowledge doesn't help them. Trading is a futile endeavour if you can't get direction right.

 

[Zwaen]

May I know your stats (win rate, average RR, trade frequency per month, current capital)? Have you ever considered what you're capable of doing with what your trading activity provides that your employed friends not capable of doing?

You are asking for stats on some trading start about a decade ago In the end I didn’t loose too much because the EV<0 withheld me from trading too much. But ya know, living expenses didn’t paused either.

What do you exactly mean by your last question?

 

[oshjdf]

You are asking for stats on some trading start about a decade ago In the end I didn’t loose too much because the EV<0 withheld me from trading too much. But ya know, living expenses didn’t paused either.

What do you exactly mean by your last question?

The last question is assuming you did great in day trading until today. Nevermind. All of us did what is best to us. I wish you do great for whatever path you take.

 

[taowave]

LOL,from a pure $$$$$ perspective leaving the IB world was definitely not the best for me....

Live and learn

The last question is assuming you did great in day trading until today. Nevermind. All of us did what is best to us. I wish you do great for whatever path you take.

 

[oshjdf]

LOL,from a pure $$$$$ perspective leaving the IB world was definitely not the best for me....

Live and learn

If one has high salary job (obviously good career path/growth), there is no incentive to pursuit full time trading. Unless being naive (possible with the current state of social medias). If mistake made, accept, scratch, move forward. We still have to live. You did great.

 

[taowave]

Not only cant you go back in time,but one has no idea how life would have turned out if one remained on the same path..

Easy to second guess,a bit more difficult to be appreciative for what we have in the moment

If one has high salary job (obviously good career path/growth), there is no incentive to pursuit full time trading. Unless being naive (possible with the current state of social medias). If mistake made, accept, scratch, move forward. We still have to live. You did great.

 

[schizo]

Do you think hedge funds use stop losses lol. Stop losses were invented to sucker retail into creating liquidity for big money.

Yes, they do. Take these to heart, ya silly!

1. "Learn to take losses. The most important thing in making money is not letting your losses get out of hand." - Marty Schwartz
2. "The elements of good trading are: (1) cutting losses, (2) cutting losses, and (3) cutting losses. If you can follow these three rules, you may have a chance." — Ed Seykota
   
3. "The most important rule of trading is to play great defense, not great offense." — Paul Tudor Jones
4. "It’s not whether you’re right or wrong that’s important, but how much money you make when you’re right and how much you lose when you’re wrong." — George Soros
5. "In trading, you have to be defensive and aggressive at the same time. If you are not aggressive, you are not going to make money, and if you are not defensive, you are not going to keep money." — Ray Dalio

 

[ironchef]

I hope so,he was a really good guy...

Like @wxytrader?