Stupidist decision I ever made.

[spect8or]

Has anyone really defended the decision to day trade as a 'wise' choice, yet? What do you think?

I mean, you 'love the markets', cool (so do I!), but why day trade? On what basis is a better choice than longer term trading?

I can't think of any. (I can think of plenty that I used to tell myself, but now that I'm looking at it with my head rather than my heart, those reasons don't fly at all.)

 

[ig0r]

Quote from NasdaqTrader:

If 70% lose money,perhaps they should just start doing the opposite(going long when they think they should go short and going short when they think they should go long).Patience is another good virtue to possess when it comes to trading.Searching for perfect setups will lead to better results than overtrading and just paying commissions.

not so simple, it's usually the exit that is the problem, not the entry. emotions kill ya :eek:

 

[Virtuoso]

Quote from spect8or:

Has anyone really defended the decision to day trade as a 'wise' choice, yet? What do you think?

I mean, you 'love the markets', cool (so do I!), but why day trade? On what basis is a better choice than longer term trading?

I can't think of any. (I can think of plenty that I used to tell myself, but now that I'm looking at it with my head rather than my heart, those reasons don't fly at all.)

Danny,

I am somewhat unique in that when I started in 97' I had absolutely no intentions whatsoever to "day-trade". All I knew was that I had made alot (for me then) of money swing/position trading from 93 to 97 and when I couldn't get my business plan financed (best thing that ever happened to me ) I figured I would just live off of my account and continue to trade (equities weeks to months and in some unique cases -- US Robotix and Mcafee Software to name two, years) until I had made the capital I needed to start the biz. Nine months and 75k later when I had the money made I was having soooo much fun getting stoned and researching stocks all day that it seemed ridiculous to do what I had initially intended to. I guess my point is that I am not a "day-trader". I have never been interested in nickel and diming the market. There are people out there Danny who do what a lot of part-time swing and position traders do, but just without that other thing called a 'day-job'.

All that said, I think if someone has the proper experience, is well capped (min 100k - pref 200k), and comes in with reasonable expectations, this is about as smart a risk as any of the myraid of businesses you can choose to start.

I am truly sorry that you didn't cut it, because I genuinely like you. But I have to say that in your case it was probably 1/3 stupidity (for thinking you could make a living on 30k), 1/3 not enough experience/skills, and 1/3 you simply didn't have enough heart for what you were doing.

Anyway I wish you all the luck in the world with whatever it is you choose to do with yourself.

PEACE,
Commisso

 

[DTK]

Quote from ig0r:

not so simple, it's usually the exit that is the problem, not the entry. emotions kill ya :eek:

Exactly!

 

[BSAM]

Quote from spect8or:

Has anyone really defended the decision to day trade as a 'wise' choice, yet? What do you think?

I mean, you 'love the markets', cool (so do I!), but why day trade? On what basis is a better choice than longer term trading?

I can't think of any. (I can think of plenty that I used to tell myself, but now that I'm looking at it with my head rather than my heart, those reasons don't fly at all.)

spect.....

I haven't read all the thread, but have you considered a combination of day trading and swing trading?

 

[BSAM]

Quote from Osman:

whatever happened to the 'can do' spirit?

If you're not making money, go to someone who is. When in a conversation with people dumping on trading, go to people who are pumped up about trading.

This whole career is mental, talk positively to yourself and others.

Time is better spent thinking about how to find better entries, better targets, better ways to scan, better rules to follow and on and on, than thinking about how big of a mistake you made.

Osman.....

I'm just going to give you a warning this time. Positive thinking/comments are generally not allowed around here!!!;-)

 

[lilboy716]

Quote from pepper_john:

Is it true that 70 % of day traders loss money???

On the other hand, 30 % of day traders make money, possibly from those losers.

trading is a zero sum game. if you loose, someone else ought to win.

 

[lilboy716]

lack business planning is the main cost of business failures. that leads to lack of capitalization.

most people think they can make money when they started. this is especially not true for businesses, because they need a good period of time to be known to the public and a chance to gain loyal/repeat customers. it usually takes more than a year. most sucessful business have planed (enough cash) to stay open (unprofitable) for more than a year.

it is somewhat analogous to trading. people think they can make money immediately. but not knowing that the learning curve is very high. and it requires hard work. hard work is not most day trader came to do! thats the attractiveness of day trading in the first place. quick money!!! they learn it the hard way, and the big boys on wallstreet are not affraid to take the cash.

Quote from gwb-trading:

Keep in mind that 4 out of 5 small businesses fail in the United States during their initial years of operations. This statistic is no different for traders who are effectively a small business. Some past studies have indicated that 10-20% of traders are at least moderately profitable. This means that 80-90% lose money.

Trading "businesses" fail for the same reasons as other endeavors... namely:

- Lack of adequate capitalization (Burning through your cash / account)

- Lack of business planning (no systematic trading plan)

- Improper skill set of the owners (the trader needs more education to be successful).


Keep it all in mind....

- Greg

 

[lilboy716]

"coulda...shouda...woulda...only if.....etc..etc..."

these string of words used very frequently in the dating scene. i could've done this, that, blah blah blah. loser talk.

the same goes for trading. decisions were made, i lost. what happend? why did i do this?

i swing trade. it is very hard to look back at my trading mistakes in the beginning. it hurts. it hurt even more after i made a string of mistakes. but its something i starting to get used to inorder to learn much more from it. to learn about the self, learn about why i did it.

after many careful studies, i can spot the coulda... shoulda situations. but when i cover up the chart back in to to the position where i actually made the decision, i can see the subtle details that suggested i violated my trading rules.


i think most traders are soo pumped up that they cannot face their mistake, therefore, never learn from it.

any thoughts on that one?

Quote from drprotrader:

You could easily substitute the title of why face off with the odds in daytrading to: why face off with the odds with respect to possible success...applicable to "all small entrepreneurial businesses in general"...all professional actors..sports....etc..etc...

The masses in each category mostly speak about:

coulda...shouda...woulda...only if.....etc..etc...


Thank goodness some people are crazy enough to try...

or else no music..movies..hedge fund winners....football...etc....

At least you are not restricted from trying..albeit the probabilities stack up like a horse race...

 

[benysl]

I believe that when one decide to trade for a living he should first ask himself how much he wanted to make every month.

Most of the people I know when I tell them I can make 100% a year they are pretty impress and wanted to try trading for a living. Some will quit job and pursue trading for a living. When taking a closer look they actually wanted to make $5000 a month with only a $10000 account. (90% of the people fall here which is why most people losses money in trading)

For me I only withdraw profit after a year because I know that during months of trading some month I will make $20000 while some month I will lose $10000 but important is I will achieve my 100% in 12 months time.

When I told people that if you want to make $5000 a month or $60000 a year you need to have at least $60000 in your account + a very good system. The moment they hear me saying $60000 in the account they look at me like a idiot and venture on their own. Nevertheless most of them join back the workforce in a couple of months time.

Quote from spect8or:

There have been quite a few, so it wasn't easy to choose, but I'd have to go with "choosing to daytrade for a living".

This is an incredibly stupid decision to make. The odds of success in daytrading for a living (its time intensive nature pretty much means you'll have to do it for a living) are so stacked against you it's not funny.

I am no idiot, mind you; far from it. I even made money one year. Not your "$2000/day avg", not even $500, but an income that I'm unlikely to see working for a wage for a while yet.

Still, as the bible says, "..time and chance happen to them all".

I don't care what anyone says, daytrading for a living is lousy deal whatever way you cut it. Yeah, sure, there are some people that can make money at it, year after year after year, but they are raaaaaaare, and for all intents and purposes, you won't be one of them. Not a pretty picture, I know. And of those that are, it's a statistical certainty that some of them are by virtue of luck alone; markets may be a lot less random than academics believe, but they're a lot more random than traders believe.

Don't misunderstand, I'm not railing against all trading. Not at all. I still maintain a great interest in the markets. Only that choosing to make your livelihood from trading the markets is, for the vast majority of people, about as bad a career move as you can make.