study:vegetarians live an average of 6-9 years longer than meat eaters

Quote from Free Thinker:

who feed you this crap? total nonsense other than b12. there are many populations on earth that eat no meat and do just fine.
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true, humans are able to live well without meat, but just as good they can eat some meat (if its of good quality) and also live very well.

this reminds me of the carbs VS no carbs flame wars on internet.

there are good sources of carbs and bad ones, it is THAT simple.

everything with gluten / lectin / gen. modified / etc. is bad- it has poisons.

but things like buckwheat, quinoa, oats are very healthy.
there are carbs in fruits and vegetables...

if salmon is factory rised near fukushima and has mercury and plenty of radioactive stuff- oh yeah it is not for consumption ! despite vitamin D, Q10, astaxanthin, Omega3s and other nutrients.

who lives longer? people who eat clean, nutrient dense foods, in MODERATION! Who allow time for the food to DIGEST!
who have a quiet hearts, little stress.
who do not live, eat and make love in a hurry.
 
I think this study is a result of incorrect inference. As a result of the foods involved, it is hard to get the same number of calories from a veggie diet when compared to a meat based diet. An 8 oz steak is roughly 400 calories - its essentially a small, dense, calorie delivery device. One would have to eat a fairly large load of veggies to get that amount of energy.

So... what you have in this study is a basic calorie restriction diet that is incorreclty being used to provide evidence against eating meat (likely because PETA or some other biased entity is involved). Vegetarians simply eat less calories on average because it is more work to get the same number of calories down. Low calorie diets have already been shown to improve *all* aspects of health.
 
Yes, but whats also important: how much energy you *lose* when digesting food. Sugar, alcohol, baked white flour and meat require lots of energy to break down.
Vegs and fruits being mostly water- very little.

this is a real reason why so called calorie restriction enhances lifespan- its not calories, its how much energy the body must use to digest food and eliminate undigested crap
 
Quote from Mike805:

I think this study is a result of incorrect inference. As a result of the foods involved, it is hard to get the same number of calories from a veggie diet when compared to a meat based diet. An 8 oz steak is roughly 400 calories - its essentially a small, dense, calorie delivery device. One would have to eat a fairly large load of veggies to get that amount of energy.

So... what you have in this study is a basic calorie restriction diet that is incorreclty being used to provide evidence against eating meat (likely because PETA or some other biased entity is involved). Vegetarians simply eat less calories on average because it is more work to get the same number of calories down. Low calorie diets have already been shown to improve *all* aspects of health.
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You are wrong.
Read the first few pages of The China Study: rural Chinese who had minimal meat in their diet ate MORE calories than the average American, but had significantly less in the way of heart disease, cancer, and cholesterol.
 
I can't believe nobody has mentioned the documentary Forks Over Knives, which makes the argument that animal protein is as likely to cause cancer as smoking, and is a primary contributor to heart and brain disease.

http://www.forksoverknives.com/

I'm not a scientist, so I don't want to argue over what's right or wrong. I can tell you that I did decide to try it about three months ago, and here's what I found.

1. It's hard to cook good tasting plant-based meals, but it can be done with persistance. I also have a really hard time looking at the venison backstrap and redfish fillets in my freezer. I eat out a lot, and that's very challenging as well.

2. I lost 10 pounds in under two weeks (~170 - ~160)... and then immediately hit a wall. I had no energy, and found that I have to eat large quantities of food all of the time in order to keep up my energy levels. Loads of beans... which my coworkers love.

3. Many of the nutrients that are difficult to find in "plants" can be found in either Brewer's Yeast or Nutritional Yeast. I have not yet found a way to make either taste very appealing.

4. I feel like I have more energy overall, and my body recovers faster. Not that I work out a lot, but when I do heavy yard work I'm only sore for a day, as opposed to half a week before. Also... something I didn't anticipate: My eyes are MUCH less sensitive to light. There must be some vitamin that my diet was lacking before.

Just a few of my experiences. If a deer walks out in my back yard this season, it's still going to find itself in my freezer... I'm just not going to sit in a deer stand every weekend. I'm SURE I can find something more productive to do.
 
Rehoboth said:
Funny how you are not focusing on this part. Talk to an actuary. Drinking, smoking and drug use are much more a determining factor for life insurance.
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Yes, but keep in mind that insurance companies can detect substance abuse through urine screens. They can't easily figure out if you are a vegan, and most people lie about what they eat anyway.
 
college ruled said:
How do vegans get adequate B12 and Vit D? Docs have raised recommended daily Vit D dosage recently. Vegans can't rely on nature to get enough they must eat fortified food. Suggests that nature doesn't recommend that we become vegan or it should be availble thru natural source.
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You can't get enough D from food anyway. You have to go out in the sun and sweat to make vitamin D (what we did back when "nature" was how we lived). We don't do that-- we sit in front of our computers. So in the modern world, we all have to take some D.

You could take a single B12 tablet every few months and be fine (assuming you can absorb it). These are very minor concerns that should not discourage anyone from avoiding animal products. The benefits outweigh these small problems.

The person who brought up smoking had a good point. I have a lot of arguments with a friend of mine who does all the health food stuff and exercises, but continues to smoke. He might as well be sitting on the couch and eating greasy cheeseburgers for every meal.

As for drinking, supposedly a little bit is good for you. I am not sure whether this has ever been tested in a non-Western population, though. Maybe if we were not torturing our cardiovascular systems with animal fat and sugars we would not need that little splash each day to lower the chance of myocardial infarction or diabetes (although I intend to keep drinking it :)

One does not have to be militant about this stuff, BTW. Eating a steak, burger, or some ice cream once a month is not going to kill you. Once or twice a week, yes, it may kill you.

I sometimes wonder why I go to so much effort to save myself from getting cardiovascular diseases, when most of the alternatives are worse....
 
In this country the leading cause of death is birth. So far it has been recorded at 100 percent. I have no statistical information from other countries that validate or deny the first statement. It ain't the destination that's important. It's the journey. At 88 I'm not concerned about the destination, but I do on occasion think about the destination, but not often. As long as you can walk comfortably and talk rationally who cares.
 
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