Stochastics

[silvermotion]

Quote from Stealth Trader:

Correct! And how many times does an indicator like STO exit the OB/OS area only to reverse right back into it stopping you out early or getting you in a trade opposite price direction? IOW, is the dog wagging the tail or is the tail wagging the dog?

If you don't understand the concept of price action, just say so. No need for name calling or embarrassing yourself in this manner.

yes yes yes your highness price action is the only thing there is and all indicators are lagging and seriously until you told me i would never have guessed.

im using these stochs to tell me how relative is this immediate market action compared to past market action. I need that because the panel i posted a screenshot from (notice the arrows with S2 S3 C1 etc?, those are setups) is one of my autotraders and i cannot tell a program to ''look at the price and if its going down go short), i need to input a value from some math equation and those stochastics do a good job at that. maybe someday you'll drop this 'I am better than thou'' attitude of yours and realize that there is always a reason for everything, including some people having a good reason to use ''lagging'' indicators like the stochastic.

I will assume from your post that you have been using a stoch at some point and the exact thing you think happens to me has happened to you. Thats why they put safety labels on chemicals and ''dangerous'' power tools you know, because some ppl will hurt themselves with items that other people use to make a living.

 

[silvermotion]

Quote from MandelbrotSet:

That's a great chart slivermotion.

In it are all of the elements that a trader needs to successfully scalp the e-minis.

If the OP can figure-out what it is saying he would be way ahead of the game with little cost of pain.

Good trading.

thank you Mandelbrot, a lot of work went in this one.

 

[Stealth Trader]

Quote from silvermotion:

yes yes yes your highness price action is the only thing there is and all indicators are lagging and seriously until you told me i would never have guessed.

im using these stochs to tell me how relative is this immediate market action compared to past market action. I need that because the panel i posted a screenshot from (notice the arrows with S2 S3 C1 etc?, those are setups) is one of my autotraders and i cannot tell a program to ''look at the price and if its going down go short), i need to input a value from some math equation and those stochastics do a good job at that. maybe someday you'll drop this 'I am better than thou'' attitude of yours and realize that there is always a reason for everything, including some people having a good reason to use ''lagging'' indicators like the stochastic.

I will assume from your post that you have been using a stoch at some point and the exact thing you think happens to me has happened to you. Thats why they put safety labels on chemicals and ''dangerous'' power tools you know, because some ppl will hurt themselves with items that other people use to make a living.

Seems I hit a nerve! If you are unable to answer the question I posed, just say so!

You claim STO’s give you IMMEDIATE market action in one sentence, and then follow it by “acknowledging” indicators are lagging of price. Given that inept mindset, it’s understandable your frustration level is so high.

“better than thou”? I simply asked what your squiggly line showed that price did not. A simple question that you have evaded with name calling and fuzzy logic. If you do not know the answer to that simple question, once again, just say so.


Assumption being the mother of all f**k up's, yep, been there, done that. As such, I am not aware of any "canned" indicator based automated system/s that have stood the test of time and remain profitable. If one exists, I would most welcome your being able to enlighten me to such, complete with verifiable statistics of course, and how it relates to your use of the STO's. That being said, there are indeed automated systems in use that rely on algorithms of price and other parameters void of canned indicators as a data source. Therefore, your point?

In summary, the only "good reason" to use a lagging indicator is ignorance. As much as I appreciate you clearing that up for us, once again, I ask what your lagging indicator gives that the enclosed chart does not.

Have an enjoyable evening,

st

 

[silvermotion]

Stealth, are you a moron? i believe you didnt read my post completely because i answered your question, I use a stoch because the chart i posted is a autotrader, i.e programming, and since computers only understand numbers, i have to input a number in there somewhere, the value of those stochastics is that number. What part of this simple concept can't you understand.

you call that fuzzy logic? take a programming class and you'll see what i mean.

now concerning your attitude, You did hit a nerve because nowhere have i said that stochastics are better than price action, nowhere have i said that price action understanding wasn't useful. You barged in asking those condescending questions assuming that i was some kind of retard who unfortunately ''do not understands the concept of price action''. Where exactly i have mentioned that? You would be surprised, like Mandelbrotset mentionned, how surprisingly efficient this chart is for its intended setups.

Quote from Stealth Trader:

In summary, the only "good reason" to use a lagging indicator is ignorance. As much as I appreciate you clearing that up for us, once again, I ask what your lagging indicator gives that the enclosed chart does not.

I agree with you on that when you are a manual execution trader that needs to be actively looking at charts, the prices go down, so will the stochs, and the stochs are going to lag the price by a few bars. thats not the issue here. The issue is that you fail to recognize that in order to code a autotrader, it needs indicators. even the slope of a trendline is a indicator, because it has a nice non arguable numerical value. Im sure you would do better than me on 1 market if you were using pure price action, and me a stochastic. but the beauty of a autotrader is that you can make it trade 4000 markets at a time and he won't make a single error, unlike a human being.

 

[Stealth Trader]

Quote from silvermotion:

Stealth, are you a moron?
......snipped worthless drivel for brevity......

No, actually I'm all a-twitter over your so complete and utter
cluelessness. Carry on.

 

[silvermotion]

and how exactly i'm i clueless? I honestly don't see the problem here. I'm showing ONE of my charts setup in relation to the subject of this thread (how do you use a stochastic) and you're all over me with that ''price action'' like a mormon at my door on a sunday morning. what the hell is the problem again?

 

[Stealth Trader]

Quote from silvermotion:

and how exactly i'm i clueless? I honestly don't see the problem here. I'm showing ONE of my charts setup in relation to the subject of this thread (how do you use a stochastic) and you're all over me with that ''price action'' like a mormon at my door on a sunday morning. what the hell is the problem again?

Why am I reminded of the "never try and teach a pig to sing" phrase?

I note you edited your posts after I already responded, but nonetheless, in the sake of arguing further which is not my intent.......once again................

"Assumption being the mother of all f**k up's, yep, been there, done that. As such, I am not aware of any "canned" indicator based automated system/s that have stood the test of time and remain profitable. If one exists, I would most welcome your being able to enlighten me to such, complete with verifiable statistics of course, and how it relates to your use of the STO's. That being said, there are indeed automated systems in use that rely on algorithms of PRICE and other parameters void of canned indicators as a data source. Therefore, your point?"

Furthermore, I ask a simple question, you respond with "smartass." I inquire further, and you evade by responding with "moron". Seeing a pattern here?????

The better response would have been that indeed price trumps indicators as you added in your edit, followed by your saying " due to my lack of programming skills, I only know how to use sto's as a data point for an automated system and can't afford hiring anyone who can program price in lieu of sto's. See how easy that is?!!

As for the thread topic, the better answer would have been canned indicators are very similar to teenage pussy..........they are both highly over rated.

st

 

[Goinglite]

Quote from silvermotion:

i use stochastics a different way, i use them to determine if we are trending or not. so when the stochastics enters extremes (above 98 below 20) and they stay there, we are trending hard

i use 17,3,1 and 13,3,1 as settings

i only display the %D

Nice Charts, by the way

Like I said, the main value I find in Stoch's are OB/OS.

How one uses that is up to them.

Some use OB/OS for pullbacks with the trend. Some use OB/OS as a sign of strong trend. Some use OB/OS for turns. It really depends on your system.

Slow Stochastics are popular with Floor Traders.


Goinglite

 

[silvermotion]

Quote from Stealth Trader:


The better response would have been that indeed price trumps indicators as you added in your edit, followed by your saying " due to my lack of programming skills, I only know how to use sto's as a data point for an automated system and can't afford hiring anyone who can program price in lieu of sto's. See how easy that is?!!

you really are pretentious, i have several setups automated like this, the one you saw runs on a 610v chart, i have different setups on 5 minute charts and 3 minute charts, and they use other indicators. some even use price action believe it or not!!!. Why do you attack my programming skills and assume i know nothing? to boost your tiny ego? all this because i don't do exactly what you do and you assume is the only thing that works?

and for your personal education, its not harder to use price or a indicator when programming, a number is a number.

heres a 5 minute autotrader using a different setup.

 

[Goinglite]

Quote from davidmaria1:

USD/JPY USD/CHF etc etc. .....all have spent several days in the "oversold" territory, often making vague attempts to rebound. NOT the grail!
When used on it's own, "The stoch can make you broke!!"
I made that up myself.

What timeframe are you referring to on these charts?

How did the Stoch's look when those markets were in "Pullback Mode"?

For most folks, it's easier to pick tops off a strong DownTrend

On a strong DownTrend, there's no need to pick a bottom if your methodology is not geared towards that.


Goinglite