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Still in College - Any Advice
- Thread starter Rex32
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Honestly, the best thing you can do is concentrate on school, have fun, and get a good internship/job. Treat trading as a hobby and nothing more. If you're still serious about it, open a paper trading account (Oanda for currencies) and practice without risking your own capital. Get a subscription to the Wall Street Journal, watch a ton of CNBC, search the internet. Knowledge will come naturally as you immerse yourself in the markets. Speaking from personal experience, if you're hungry enough, anything can happen... Just make sure you have your priorities in order...
1) Finish school. Only 22% of the US population has a 4 year degree. In the coming years as more and more of the middle class is squeezed into oblivion, college degrees will be not a golden key like it used to be, but your application will be round filed without. Grim times ahead.
2) Think strongly about postgrad degrees.Only 2% of ALL US taxpayers earn >$200,000. Do you think more of them are traders or people with advanced degrees?
3) Find a woman to complement your life. Not some high maintenance taker.
4) Buy a house.
5) Have a hobby(ies). Going to the gym is not a hobby. That's how you take care of your body. But what about your soul? I play guitar(badly) but it engages my mind away from trading.
6) In the really, real world, you will feel the pressure to keep up appearances with the Jones'. Dont. Alot of so called intelligent people do not understand you cannot spend more than you make indefinately. Save. And invest part of your savings.
Trading is a very lonely existence and a extremely exacting life. Make sure you are ready because no one who ever accomplished something noteworthy did it by doing something they hated.
Trading is defintely not for everyone.
2) Think strongly about postgrad degrees.Only 2% of ALL US taxpayers earn >$200,000. Do you think more of them are traders or people with advanced degrees?
3) Find a woman to complement your life. Not some high maintenance taker.
4) Buy a house.
5) Have a hobby(ies). Going to the gym is not a hobby. That's how you take care of your body. But what about your soul? I play guitar(badly) but it engages my mind away from trading.
6) In the really, real world, you will feel the pressure to keep up appearances with the Jones'. Dont. Alot of so called intelligent people do not understand you cannot spend more than you make indefinately. Save. And invest part of your savings.
Trading is a very lonely existence and a extremely exacting life. Make sure you are ready because no one who ever accomplished something noteworthy did it by doing something they hated.
Trading is defintely not for everyone.
this is interesting, only because i did the opposite of what everyone here is suggesting. I left school for a bit to daytrade. Why? Well i would rather have a "gap" in my resume during college, when on campus recruiting makes landing a job much easier. Secondly, its a good experience. The way I see it, trading will always be there, but on campus recruiting will not. I would hate to graduate, go into daytrading, find out its not for me, then try and find a job. I'd rather try it out (people leave school for all sorts of reasons/study abroad/travel/ect.), find out its not for me, then go back and get a job through on campus recruiting.
What i would hate to see is what I just saw. There are 2 kids from berkley. One was an analyst at Lehman bros, the other some operations guy. They both left their jobs after a 1 1/2 years to work for some literally insane trader for a news advisory. (i don't know if ET lets me bash another site, but just think of Val Kilmer in Top Gun)
They are basically getting scammed; talk of an IPO this, ipo that. No salary, and they are trading their own accounts. They are both very naive; its there first trading job they every applied to. They don't even know what a prop firm is. They try to pull off daytrades with their scottrade accounts with that ridiculous commish! They are working with two other kids that moved from NY and were HS dropouts. They work out of small room in the back of a horse ranch, I shit you not. (granted, the horse ranch is very nice)
Now how is that supposed to look when the guy at Lehman trys to find a job after this daytrading incident? Horrible. (lets put it this way. The "head trader" doesn't use an execution platform. He calls all his order in through a retail broker. RIDICULOUS!
What I would say is this. Figure out if daytrading is for you BEFORE you graduate, unless you can get into a firm that will train you/possibly pay you after graduating. Do not, for the love of god, graduate with your degree and think that its going to land you a job if you fool around daytrading. If you plan on joining a prop with your own capital after graduating, just be damn sure its what you want to do. If you can't figure it out, I'd take some time off to see if its for you. That way if it doesn't work out, you'll always have the option of writing off that experience as an internship/time off during your undergrad when your choices won't be judged as harshly by employers after you graduate.
People will never overlook your mistakes. However, as a general rule, people are more inclined to forgive dumb shit you did in undergrad as opposed to 2 yearsout in the workforce. Just read the other thread about a trader who quit. People on this own message board have been telling this guy on ET to make up a fake company and have his spouse be the secretary and his best friend be the CEO of the dummy company. Despite being incredibly unethical and humiliating (just think of the position your wife is in for god's sake), the fact that people here would even suggest anyone do this should show you JUST HOW DETRIMENTAL it would be to find out daytrading isn't for you AFTER college, after foregoing potential career paths.
The great thing for you is that you've got plenty of time to figure this out before you graduate, however you like (trade as a hobby, join a prop during your summer time, take a semester off, whatever)
good luck man.
What i would hate to see is what I just saw. There are 2 kids from berkley. One was an analyst at Lehman bros, the other some operations guy. They both left their jobs after a 1 1/2 years to work for some literally insane trader for a news advisory. (i don't know if ET lets me bash another site, but just think of Val Kilmer in Top Gun)
They are basically getting scammed; talk of an IPO this, ipo that. No salary, and they are trading their own accounts. They are both very naive; its there first trading job they every applied to. They don't even know what a prop firm is. They try to pull off daytrades with their scottrade accounts with that ridiculous commish! They are working with two other kids that moved from NY and were HS dropouts. They work out of small room in the back of a horse ranch, I shit you not. (granted, the horse ranch is very nice)
Now how is that supposed to look when the guy at Lehman trys to find a job after this daytrading incident? Horrible. (lets put it this way. The "head trader" doesn't use an execution platform. He calls all his order in through a retail broker. RIDICULOUS!
What I would say is this. Figure out if daytrading is for you BEFORE you graduate, unless you can get into a firm that will train you/possibly pay you after graduating. Do not, for the love of god, graduate with your degree and think that its going to land you a job if you fool around daytrading. If you plan on joining a prop with your own capital after graduating, just be damn sure its what you want to do. If you can't figure it out, I'd take some time off to see if its for you. That way if it doesn't work out, you'll always have the option of writing off that experience as an internship/time off during your undergrad when your choices won't be judged as harshly by employers after you graduate.
People will never overlook your mistakes. However, as a general rule, people are more inclined to forgive dumb shit you did in undergrad as opposed to 2 yearsout in the workforce. Just read the other thread about a trader who quit. People on this own message board have been telling this guy on ET to make up a fake company and have his spouse be the secretary and his best friend be the CEO of the dummy company. Despite being incredibly unethical and humiliating (just think of the position your wife is in for god's sake), the fact that people here would even suggest anyone do this should show you JUST HOW DETRIMENTAL it would be to find out daytrading isn't for you AFTER college, after foregoing potential career paths.
The great thing for you is that you've got plenty of time to figure this out before you graduate, however you like (trade as a hobby, join a prop during your summer time, take a semester off, whatever)
good luck man.
I've heard people, like friends and family/people who don't trade say this all the time.
"Just graduate, then do the daytrading. If it doesn't work, you can at least say, "well, at least I've got my degree""
It doesn't work that way.
actually, i guess it does. it works out great if you want to have a terrible time landing a prestigous job after daytrading for 3 years/rubbing shit all over your resume.
People are lifeguards in college/tennis camp instructors during summer, then they move on to nice cushy little business consulting positions. There is no reason you can't find the time in college to see if daytrading if for you.
But you know what? I don't see a lot of lifeguards/tennis instructors getting consulting gigs if they've been doing that for a few years after college. You wouldn't expect the same for daytrading either.
Its true, your degree will always help you land A job. If you daytrade and fail, you'll be able to use your degree for something. But will it be the best job you could have landed straight out of undergrad. Very unlikely.
Most traders i've run into envy the stability other jobs provide. Most of my regular job friends envy things about daytrading. If you fail at daytrading in your undergrad, you just might appreciate the nice jobs most people complain about (Oh, I hate i-banking, Oh, I hate being an actuary, ect ect.)
You're getting a different point of view from me. there are probably some things you can take away from what everyone has said to decide what suits your personality best.
Good luck. (and don't listen to anyone blindly. You figure whats best for you, and you'll more likely be at peace with your decisions as long as YOU took ownership and responsibility. You might find the same is true for your daytrading as well. at least it is for me.
"Just graduate, then do the daytrading. If it doesn't work, you can at least say, "well, at least I've got my degree""
It doesn't work that way.
actually, i guess it does. it works out great if you want to have a terrible time landing a prestigous job after daytrading for 3 years/rubbing shit all over your resume.
People are lifeguards in college/tennis camp instructors during summer, then they move on to nice cushy little business consulting positions. There is no reason you can't find the time in college to see if daytrading if for you.
But you know what? I don't see a lot of lifeguards/tennis instructors getting consulting gigs if they've been doing that for a few years after college. You wouldn't expect the same for daytrading either.
Its true, your degree will always help you land A job. If you daytrade and fail, you'll be able to use your degree for something. But will it be the best job you could have landed straight out of undergrad. Very unlikely.
Most traders i've run into envy the stability other jobs provide. Most of my regular job friends envy things about daytrading. If you fail at daytrading in your undergrad, you just might appreciate the nice jobs most people complain about (Oh, I hate i-banking, Oh, I hate being an actuary, ect ect.)
You're getting a different point of view from me. there are probably some things you can take away from what everyone has said to decide what suits your personality best.
Good luck. (and don't listen to anyone blindly. You figure whats best for you, and you'll more likely be at peace with your decisions as long as YOU took ownership and responsibility. You might find the same is true for your daytrading as well. at least it is for me.
Just to clear some thing up, IMHO:
"Treat trading as a hobby and nothing more." You mean like building model ships? Without focus and determination nothing will come of it.
"Open a paper trading account (Oanda for currencies) and practice without risking your own capital" - Bull, one needs to study the Market for a good long time while learning its intricacies, not flippantly throwing even paper trades at it hoping it will release some sage like information. Trading is a skill and like any career needs to be treated accordingly. It takes years to get and fine tune one's "EDGE".
"Get a subscription to the Wall Street Journal" - Why, do you want him to get a dog and paper train them? The rag is worthless for trading.
"Watch a ton of CNBC" - Why, do you want him to go blind and crazy? Those talking heads are absolutely clueless. I treat it like the comedy channel.
"Search the internet" - Ok, I agree with this one a little.
"Knowledge will come naturally as you immerse yourself in the markets" - This one I stand up and applaud you on but it works only if you stay focused and not take any shortcuts.
Quote from Rex32:
Nothing much!
I wans't trying to piss anyone off my being a newbie on the forums, just looking for advice. I've read liars poker and plan to purchase the ten books on investopedia's recomendation list.
I love taking my business courses, so glad I switched from engineering!
Anyone any advice that you guys could offer, on the subject of trading
Thanks Again,
Mike
I haven't read the entire thread, get some books on Technical Analysis, Edwards and Magee, Murphy, etc. Nison and Morris, including Bigalow are good for Candlesticks. Sign up for a demo account and try to make alot of funny money before you risk a cent.
Finance, you should be good and quick with arithmetic, that's good. Study psychology, this is going to be a real head game. That's more important, once you know how to read a chart, then look for some holy grail trading method.
I agree, stay and finish your degree. Finance jobs are good to fall back on and they can pay real well.
Good luck.