Started the Trades
- Thread starter sfbayarea
- Start date
You are not computer illiterate, you can already print, take digital photo, import it to pc, and attach it to your post. Great. But here is a tutorial to make it much simpler. (and to save the forest, and your time)
http://www.bleepingcomputer.com/forums/topic43088.html
Thanks CLM,
Would you prefer a screen print or a hard copy photo? I can try the screen shot next time. The problem for me is that trading ranges are very difficult for me. Yeah, when it's a trending leg, it's a lot easier. When there is a bunch of overlapping bars, which make it a trading range. That's where I often get lost.
I either get in and exit on the pullback only to find that it goes where I want it to minutes later or I get sucked into trading in the direction of the pullback. One or the other is where I usually lose.
Another tool that I can consider using in the future is to add double the shares into a stop loss order. So when my trade ends with a losing one via the stop, it also automatically picks up an entry trade with shares in the other direction. So this way, a new trade is in the other direction. This would probably mitigate some losses. It's often hard to mentally trade in the other direction when you've just been dealt with a loss. It takes fast mental reflexes to do that and I can't do it fast enough to keep up with the market. This is an option.
Would you prefer a screen print or a hard copy photo? I can try the screen shot next time. The problem for me is that trading ranges are very difficult for me. Yeah, when it's a trending leg, it's a lot easier. When there is a bunch of overlapping bars, which make it a trading range. That's where I often get lost.
I either get in and exit on the pullback only to find that it goes where I want it to minutes later or I get sucked into trading in the direction of the pullback. One or the other is where I usually lose.
Another tool that I can consider using in the future is to add double the shares into a stop loss order. So when my trade ends with a losing one via the stop, it also automatically picks up an entry trade with shares in the other direction. So this way, a new trade is in the other direction. This would probably mitigate some losses. It's often hard to mentally trade in the other direction when you've just been dealt with a loss. It takes fast mental reflexes to do that and I can't do it fast enough to keep up with the market. This is an option.
after seeing this chart i am strongly recommending for you to skip couple days of trading and spend time going through this thread:
http://www.elitetrader.com/vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=113456
Also look at NoDoji threads and posts.
There are more thread to suggest, but this is plenty for now.
good luck,
tihfa
It is easier to see a snapshot , than a scratched wrinkled snapshot. May be you would get more help.
So don't trade trend, when you see "a bunch of overlapping bars" sitting on a flat ema, unless you know when it is ending or which way it will go.
I don't think it is a good idea, but your testing should prove it to you, if it is profitable or not.
It would be better to find a way to enter the new trend as early as possible. For example limit yourself to first pullback. If you miss it, don't chase it, wait for next first pullback.
Thanks CLM,
What gets me is determining whether it's going to be a trading range or trend. I often wonder when it's going to change or switch from one to another. Perhaps a 40% overlap with the previous bar would make one think that it's going to go into a trading range (aka channel). I used to fade the extremes of channels when I first started trading but I didn't know what to do when it reversed. I have a better idea of what a reversal pattern looks like now.
Thanks for keeping me refocused. You're right on the first pullback being a good trade. I tend to lose sight of that over time even though I reminded myself of it too a month ago.
A mistake with Lightspeed's MTS system (well there's always a mistake with their website) led me to believe that I had more funds in the account than I thought. I wouldn't have been as aggressive as yesterday had I known the actual amount. Their MTS system said I had more than I did. I have to wait an ACH of +10 to get it back over 25K. I don't mind if I run on fumes because it forces me to be more careful.
Looks like I'm really going to run on fumes for a bit but I do know that I can make +10-20 per day if I really choose to. However these last few weeks, I was trying other techniques in an attempt to yield more. The other technique works if in a trend with the first leg being a trend with little overlap. The bad part is that I didn't know that it doesn't work for trading ranges and I got slaughtered. I'm going to do a lot of chart reviewing over the weekend to find the best way to deal with trading ranges. I tried to the same thing on demo today (trading like a trend on a trading range) and got killed just like the last few days. Just another learning lesson that I wish I didn't have to learn the hard way.
Thanks to everyone for their input.
So I did the demo today and basically had the same problems with the strategy that I've been using. I eventually ended up on the plus side with the paper account via scalps but this was my biggest loss and it's no different than a lot of the other losses that I've had. The entry bar was one tick lower than the low for the support level. It broke it by a tick then reversed up big to where I couldn't stand it anymore and I get out with a loss. I thought it would go lower and it eventually did. On the demo, I did get some of the losses back by shorting a little bit on its way down but didn't stick with it all the way which is typical for me. Does anyone here have a way to deal with this?
I feel like if I don't enter, I could miss out which has happened before. This is the one where it didn't go and did a big pullback, then ended up where I thought it was going to go except I ended up with a paper loss. Perhaps a stop is needed?
I've done a screen shot edit of the 1 min chart. This is not with Lightspeed charts, their charts are not as good or crisp. Took time for me to figure it out but works good. Thanks CLM.
I feel like if I don't enter, I could miss out which has happened before. This is the one where it didn't go and did a big pullback, then ended up where I thought it was going to go except I ended up with a paper loss. Perhaps a stop is needed?
I've done a screen shot edit of the 1 min chart. This is not with Lightspeed charts, their charts are not as good or crisp. Took time for me to figure it out but works good. Thanks CLM.
Nice chart eventually.
Here is my opinion in hindsight, so take it as it is.
1) Your entry was along the trend. Which is good.
2) Your exit was not optimal for your entry.
When you enter on a tick or so below the low or above the high and the market reverses right away it means you probably caught a trap, in this case a bear trap. Which can happen to any break out trades. Since it is a break out trade you'd expect the market to follow through right away which it did not, you could have covered the short right away when the next candle finished. That would have been my choice (most likely) if I entered at the same place as you did.
But if you still think the trend is valid, you could say, yeah, I caught a trap, I sit through the retrace since the trend is still down, and I put my stop above previous swing high, or when the MAs cross back (if that is what you are using for trend definition).
But from your post it seems, you don't use logical stops, or price action stops, but you use your stomach to signal exit. (which in the long run will not do too much good to you, unless you learn to do the opposite what your stomach tells you)
If you can't take heat, you need to find entries with less heat.
Here is my opinion in hindsight, so take it as it is.
1) Your entry was along the trend. Which is good.
2) Your exit was not optimal for your entry.
When you enter on a tick or so below the low or above the high and the market reverses right away it means you probably caught a trap, in this case a bear trap. Which can happen to any break out trades. Since it is a break out trade you'd expect the market to follow through right away which it did not, you could have covered the short right away when the next candle finished. That would have been my choice (most likely) if I entered at the same place as you did.
But if you still think the trend is valid, you could say, yeah, I caught a trap, I sit through the retrace since the trend is still down, and I put my stop above previous swing high, or when the MAs cross back (if that is what you are using for trend definition).
But from your post it seems, you don't use logical stops, or price action stops, but you use your stomach to signal exit. (which in the long run will not do too much good to you, unless you learn to do the opposite what your stomach tells you)
If you can't take heat, you need to find entries with less heat.
Thanks CLM
I had the same problem with my entry today on the paper trade. Ended up same as Friday as barely positive with scalps. I didn't have a higher stop because I looked at the P&L and it was close to -100 so I bailed. I need to set in stops. Unfortunately I couldn't set them in on the demo but I can do a market exit order if the price goes by a certain point.
Seems as though, it is extremely hard to trade spike and channels which I've seen a lot of lately. As you know, most of us are trying to capture the second leg of a move. What gets me is always the spike and then channel (trading range). You can't use that entry one tick under the last bar with them. How do you trade spike and channels? I have difficulty understanding and determining when it's going into a channel or trading range until when it's very well developed. By that time, it'll breakout, pullback, or reverse. Do you set an entry simple at the top of a channel?
I had the same problem with my entry today on the paper trade. Ended up same as Friday as barely positive with scalps. I didn't have a higher stop because I looked at the P&L and it was close to -100 so I bailed. I need to set in stops. Unfortunately I couldn't set them in on the demo but I can do a market exit order if the price goes by a certain point.
Seems as though, it is extremely hard to trade spike and channels which I've seen a lot of lately. As you know, most of us are trying to capture the second leg of a move. What gets me is always the spike and then channel (trading range). You can't use that entry one tick under the last bar with them. How do you trade spike and channels? I have difficulty understanding and determining when it's going into a channel or trading range until when it's very well developed. By that time, it'll breakout, pullback, or reverse. Do you set an entry simple at the top of a channel?