SPY buy and hold return controversy

[intradaybill]

Quote from nLepwa:

You are right.

And as we're talking about b&h we need to consider CAGR as return on fixed capital is irrelevant.
That's what I was trying to make him understand.

Ninna

Do a favor to yourself please and try to understand first what others are talking about before you try to appear as wise. Also, try to answer some more difficult questions elsewhere that you avoid systematicaly:

http://www.elitetrader.com/vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=214773&perpage=6&pagenumber=1

You are crawling around looking for easy targets for quick answers that make you sound smart.

I said "total return is roughly 279% in 18 years or 15.5% per year NOT counting for dividend reinvestments."

Now, if you cannot calculate that in order to have a 279% return in 18 years without reinvestment you need to make a 15.5% return a year, it is your problem.

I never spoke of reinvestment or compounding. I spoke about yearly return on trading capital without renvestments.

Find another target...you failed this time around...big time...

 

[Kevin Schmit]

Quote from jimbojim:

The CAGR for a 279% return in 18 years is 5.85%

That is incorrect. The CAGR for a 279% return over 18 years is about 7.7%. 5.85% is the CAGR for a 179% return over that period.

 

[nLepwa]

Quote from intradaybill:

I'm not interested in fighting.

Ps. I don't see how the other thread is related?.. I answered the question there nonetheless.

Ninna

 

[Dacamic]

The data I have stored for the S&P 500 shows a cumulative return -- including annual dividend reinvestment -- of 179% (5.7% compounded annually) from January 1993 to January 2011.

January 2000 to January 2011 has a net cumulative loss of 13%, even after a 55% gain during the past two years.

EDIT: The returns shown above are inflation-adjusted. Nominal CAGR is 8.2% during the past 18 years.

 

[jeb9999]

The SPY ETF has a performance data sheet.

The SPY performance data sheet states that the SPY started on January 22, 1993 and that the annualized performance of the S&P 500 index since inception is 8.24%.

The 10 year annualized performance of the S&P 500 index is only 1.30%.

The data shows that the SPY slightly underperforms the S&P 500 index.


https://www.spdrs.com/product/fund.seam?ticker=SPY

 

[intradaybill]

Quote from nLepwa:

I'm not interested in fighting.

If you are not interested in fighting, when you reply you should be very careful how you come out. You wrote:

Quote from nLepwa:

And as we're talking about b&h we need to consider CAGR as return on fixed capital is irrelevant.
That's what I was trying to make him understand.

Ninna

I was referring to the return on fixed capital a trader should achieve in order to match this return. If you are a trader (BIG ? here), you should know that those of us who trade for a living do not care about CAGR because we do not buy and hold. We try to live off our profits and preserve our capital.

So I ask you the question again:

How much a trader should return each year to match the CAGR of the SPY buy and hold since 1993?

 

[Zr1Trader]

Quote from intradaybill:


How much a trader should return each year to match the CAGR of the SPY buy and hold since 1993?

EDIT Traders should make >%6.13 a year to beat buy and hold for S&P

>%7.2 for DJIA

 

[intradaybill]

Quote from Zr1Trader:

EDIT Traders should make >%6.13 a year to beat buy and hold for S&P

>%7.2 for DJIA

That is compound return. Traders do not compound. Buy and hold investors and bond holders compound.

If you guys do not understand that, I will give you a few examples but have no time now. I must enter scale orders for the day.