Socialism leads to Atheism?

[nitro]

I am reading Brothers Karamazov. There is a line from it that I don't follow, and maybe one of you can explain it to me. This passage:

"As soon as he reflected seriously and was struck by the conviction that immortality and God exist, he naturally said at once to himself: 'I want to live for immortality, and I reject any half way compromise'. In just the same way, if he had decided that immortality and God do not exist, he would immediately have joined the atheists and socialists (for socialism is not only the labor question or the question of the so called fourth estate, but first of all the question of atheism, the question of the Tower of Babel built precisely without God...)"

I don't understand how Dostoevsky reaches the conclusion that "socialism is not only the labor question or the question of the so called fourth estate, but first of all the question of atheism" ??? Does that mean that the statements negation, that Capitalism would then lead to Theism??!!

 

[Kassz007]

I have not read the book, but think logically for a second. How on Earth do you correlate socialism to atheism, and capitalism to theism?

 

[Ricter]

Marx called religion the opiate of the masses, ie. it dulls the perception and pain of Man-caused unfairnes. I myself consider some form of opiate an absolute necessity to Man's existence, so I've never taken his statement to mean religion should be abolished (though, tragically, others did). I think it is not hard to imagine a functioning Christian (or other similar religious) commune.

 

[Maverick74]

Quote from nitro:

I am reading Brothers Karamazov. There is a line from it that I don't follow, and maybe one of you can explain it to me. This passage:

"As soon as he reflected seriously and was struck by the conviction that immortality and God exist, he naturally said at once to himself: 'I want to live for immortality, and I reject any half way compromise'. In just the same way, if he had decided that immortality and God do not exist, he would immediately have joined the atheists and socialists (for socialism is not only the labor question or the question of the so called fourth estate, but first of all the question of atheism, the question of the Tower of Babel built precisely without God...)"

I don't understand how Dostoevsky reaches the conclusion that "socialism is not only the labor question or the question of the so called fourth estate, but first of all the question of atheism" ??? Does that mean that the statements negation, that Capitalism would then lead to Theism??!!

Nitro, everyone worships a higher power. For some, it's money. For some it's God. For others it's government. It seems to me that most atheists have a tremendous respect for government and the power they hold and the reliance on that government to be their keeper. Others do no rely on government but rather their faith.

 

[Lucrum]

Quote from Maverick74:

Nitro, everyone worships a higher power. For some, it's money. For some it's God. For others it's government. It seems to me that most atheists have a tremendous respect for government and the power they hold and the reliance on that government to be their keeper. Others do no rely on government but rather their faith.

That's kinda what I was thinking, only I wouldn't have been able to state it so eloquently.

 

[trendlover]

I think he talk about people can do good things for humankind, so they do not need the god to motivate them. Maybe?

Like this quote from stu from another thread.

Quote from stu:


Religious direction can never be as genuine , as self-less , or as properly representative of true human spirit, than those people who do good for goodness sake, without having to believe that a fictional megalomaniac is instructing them.

 

[Maverick74]

Quote from trendlover:

I think he talk about people can do good things for humankind, so they do not need the god to motivate them. Maybe?

Like this quote from stu from another thread.

Quote from stu:


Religious direction can never be as genuine , as self-less , or as properly representative of true human spirit, than those people who do good for goodness sake, without having to believe that a fictional megalomaniac is instructing them.

What's a spirit?

 

[trendlover]

Quote from Maverick74:

What's a spirit?

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This is the quote from stu. So I will tell you what I guess stu is thinking. Spirit=empathy/survival instinct

 

[soldsoldsold]

Quote from Maverick74:

Nitro, everyone worships a higher power. For some, it's money. For some it's God. For others it's government. It seems to me that most atheists have a tremendous respect for government and the power they hold and the reliance on that government to be their keeper. Others do no rely on government but rather their faith.

As an atheist, I don't have "tremendous respect for government." I had no say in its stipulations at the time of its creation and it certainly does not favor my success.

My 'higher power' would be the meaning I put into my life in the form of self fulfilment. My hobbies, my contribution to the world. It's a work in progress.

 

[bigarrow]

Quote from Maverick74:

Nitro, everyone worships a higher power. For some, it's money. For some it's God. For others it's government. It seems to me that most atheists have a tremendous respect for government and the power they hold and the reliance on that government to be their keeper. Others do no rely on government but rather their faith.

In America today the atheist is the quintessential individualist.

Everyone does not worship a higher power.