So why Tesla didn't pick Poland for their European factory?

[Pekelo]

Romania only made half million cars last year...

I think you mean Slovakia. Romania is largely irrelevant with only Dacia (owned by Renault) producing vehicles used across Europe, sales numbers are also small.

Or Poland:

"The automobile industry in Poland makes up a sizeable part of the Polish economy, accounting for about 11% of Poland's industrial production. Poland is one of the largest producer of light vehicles (passenger cars) in Central and Eastern Europe. As of 2013 Poland was the 23rd largest automaker in the world."

In East Europe the top countries are:

Czech Rep., Slovakia, Hungary, Poland, Romania.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_motor_vehicle_production

 

[d08]

Romania only made half million cars last year...

Yeah, that's a big number but I suppose I'm looking at Slovakia only having 5 million people and producing 1.2 million cars. The big international brands are in Slovakia (brands like VW, Audi, Porsche, Škoda, Kia).

 

[Pekelo]

Poland's and Hungary's labor forces are cheaper than Slovakia's. The real cheap ones are the Romanians:

https://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/docum...P-EN.pdf/e4e0dcfe-9019-4c74-a437-3592aa460623

Poland has sea ports, Slovakia only has rivers, if they plan to transport cars farer away. Also putting a big factory close to the capital/big city is problematic because they will care more about environmental issues. Not to mention those are the Germans and their greens bitched about disrupting some kind of protected snake's life habitat. That wouldn't be an issue in Poland.

 

[d08]

Poland's and Hungary's labor forces are cheaper than Slovakia's. The real cheap ones are the Romanians:

https://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/docum...P-EN.pdf/e4e0dcfe-9019-4c74-a437-3592aa460623

Poland has sea ports, Slovakia only has rivers, if they plan to transport cars farer away. Also putting a big factory close to the capital/big city is problematic because they will care more about environmental issues. Not to mention those are the Germans and their greens bitched about disrupting some kind of protected snake's life habitat. That wouldn't be an issue in Poland.

I would be an issue in Poland. The Via Baltica road work was halted in 2007 due to it being built through a protected area. It has since been re-routed.

It makes complete sense to protect the nature in Central and Western Europe as most species have been destroyed by the last industrial expansion. Protecting the environment is generally good but yes, in Europe sometimes it does go to extremes - I couldn't build a house in my ancestral land because it has since become a Natura protected area.

 

[piezoe]

NGO involved in politics give me a fucking break. Those are worse than Hitler himself. Disguised wolfs in sheep clothing. If they were truly NGOs they would be busy feeding the hungry and curing the sick. Truth is those are mother fuckers with hidden agendas. Same as Soros.

This is an interesting comment on Soros, because Soros has been extraordinarily open about his political and social agenda. Entire books have been written on it (See the OSF, the Open Society Foundation). So if he has a hidden agenda its very well hidden. Apparently you're one of the few who knows what it is, and I guess that would make it not entirely hidden, just well masked.. Would you care to enlighten us?

 

[DiceAreCast]

The answer is very simple. Why should companies who have learned from the past repeat the same mistakes? For decades companies have moved to locations with the lowest unit labor costs and out come inferior and mediocre products. A Romanian or polish laborer is currently not as well trained and does not possess the same desire for quality standards than a German worker. The result is pricing differences. It's not just about labor unions but about differences in the quality of the output. People slowly get educated that buying cheaper but inferior quality in many cases (not all) costs overall more, long term. Producing in Romania is inferior to producing in France or Germany but its cheaper. It's a tradeoff that each company and each product line has to decide for itself. Tesla has a tough going in Europe and Germany in particular because so far the quality of Tesla is abysmal and hugely inferior even to lesser priced German cars. I guess Elon Musk tries to alter that image. But image management in Germany never worked. Either you actually do offer better quality or not. Producing in Romania won't satisfy German consumers, at least not those who are asked to shell out a premium price

I'm an avowed Tesla bull, but I too questioned Musk's decision to plant his flag in the middle of German auto manufacturing when there were better alternatives, like Romania. For well over 20 years Romania has become the de facto volume auto manufacturing hub for European brands. Tesla’s upcoming 25k vehicle for Europe could have been made there for a fraction of the cost of making them in Germany.
Tesla is an ego driven company. Right now, Musk wants to show the world's leading auto manufacturers that he can outshine them in their house. This lack of humility has been Musk's driving force, but there will soon come of time when the average consumer will have plenty of alternatives to choose from and Tesla's QC issues will become a liability if they aren't addressed today while the brand's fans fuel the demand.

 

[DiceAreCast]

I don't think Soros is completely honest about his hidden agenda about Germany and Eastern Europe and liberalism and Jewish hegemony. It's known to those who study his private lectures and exposes but he does not openly talk about it. But what he funds and how speaks volumes.

This is an interesting comment on Soros, because Soros has been extraordinarily open about his political and social agenda. Entire books have been written on it (See the OSF, the Open Society Foundation). So if he has a hidden agenda its very well hidden. Apparently you're one of the few who knows what it is, and I guess that would make it not entirely hidden, just well masked.. Would you care to enlighten us?

 

[piezoe]

I don't think Soros is completely honest about his hidden agenda about Germany and Eastern Europe and liberalism and Jewish hegemony. It's known to those who study his private lectures and exposes but he does not openly talk about it. But what he funds and how speaks volumes.

It is still unclear what you are referring to as a hidden agenda. Here is what i know about Soros.

He openly advocated, in Frankfort, for a complete European Monetary Union which would require that Germany agree to the Eurobond. He sees Germany as a stumbling block in that regard, and has said Germany should agree to the Eurobond or leave the EU monetary union. I think he is on the right side of that issue.

What he funds is an open book. Literally! He funds dissonant groups in authoritarian Eastern European Countries -- Russia, Hungary, etc., whose intentions are to oppose and disrupt the authoritarian governments in these countries. Naturally, he is hated by authoritarian Heads of State. It's reasonable to assume they are responsible for endless disinformation regarding Soros. To Soros's credit, he doesn't seem to care.

Soros is, so far as I can tell, what one could describe as a very liberal thinker. His family background is Jewish, but so far as I know he has never been a practicing Jew. Nor is he an apologist for the Jewish State, which at times he has been critical of. I have read much of what Soros has written , but I have yet to discover anything that might reasonably be described as a hidden agenda.

During the war in Bosnia, Soros was instrumental in getting fresh water to the citizens of Sarajevo whose water had been cut off. He has been credited with saving thousands of lives. He did this at his personal expense and with some personal risk as well. Sarajevo, so far as I'm aware is largely Bosnian Muslim (~2/3rds or maybe more) . The other religion practiced their would be some variant of Christianity (Serbs and Croatians) Soros's rescue of muslim Sarajevo would seem a strange act for anyone promoting "Jewish hegemony" as a "hidden agenda". Especially someone who so far as I can tell from his writing must surely be an atheist.

 

[DiceAreCast]

Frankfurt ;-)

Exactly, and this would destroy all the German wealth with one signature. All the hard work of the past 7 decades would be reduced to nothing. All the while our Greek and South Italian neighbors partied as if there is no tomorrow and each time the bill arrives they knock on Germany's door and demand handouts. That is the EXACT way that Soros proposes. And no, that is not gonna happen. He conveniently does not demand any comparable sacrifices from any other country or nation on earth. Guess why his parents moved their Jewish butts and why the German hatred.

It is still unclear what you are referring to as a hidden agenda. Here is what i know about Soros.

He openly advocated, in Frankfort, for a complete European Monetary Union which would require that Germany agree to the Eurobond. He sees Germany as a stumbling block in that regard, and has said Germany should agree to the Eurobond or leave the EU monetary union. I think he is on the right side of that issue.

What he funds is an open book. Literally! He funds dissonant groups in authoritarian Eastern European Countries -- Russia, Hungary, etc., whose intentions are to oppose and disrupt the authoritarian governments in these countries. Naturally, he is hated by authoritarian Heads of State. It's reasonable to assume they are responsible for endless disinformation regarding Soros. To Soros's credit, he doesn't seem to care.

Soros is, so far as I can tell, what one could describe as a very liberal thinker. His family background is Jewish, but so far as I know he has never been a practicing Jew. Nor is he an apologist for the Jewish State, which at times he has been critical of. I have read much of what Soros has written , but I have yet to discover anything that might reasonably be described as a hidden agenda.

During the war in Bosnia, Soros was instrumental in getting fresh water to the citizens of Sarajevo whose water had been cut off. He has been credited with saving thousands of lives. He did this at his personal expense and with some personal risk as well. Sarajevo, so far as I'm aware is largely Bosnian Muslim (~2/3rds or maybe more) . The other religion practiced their would be some variant of Christianity (Serbs and Croatians) Soros's rescue of muslim Sarajevo would seem a strange act for anyone promoting "Jewish hegemony" as a "hidden agenda". Especially someone who so far as I can tell from his writing must surely be an atheist.

 

[d08]

Frankfurt ;-)

Exactly, and this would destroy all the German wealth with one signature. All the hard work of the past 7 decades would be reduced to nothing. All the while our Greek and South Italian neighbors partied as if there is no tomorrow and each time the bill arrives they knock on Germany's door and demand handouts. That is the EXACT way that Soros proposes. And no, that is not gonna happen. He conveniently does not demand any comparable sacrifices from any other country or nation on earth. Guess why his parents moved their Jewish butts and why the German hatred.

Exactly. The southern EU is borrowing until completely broke. Meanwhile up north and east there's plenty of countries that keep a tight leash on finances. Southern EU countries are also favoring EU-wide taxes that will mostly penalize the northern countries, how very convenient. They most obviously favor a "I spend, you pay" approach. It can only end in the fall of EU.