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simple-automated-trading.com
- Thread starter TraderBilly
- Start date
OK, apparently this was moved to "chit-chat". I dont' know what that means, but from reading the other posts, I am assuming that it means that it has been put somewhere where no one will ever read it. Thats sad, but what can I do.
Anyway, the update here is that I am still in the room and I can now tell you with absolute certainty that this is a scam. Why do I say that:
(1) The results being posted on the website don't even match the strategy more less what is happening in real trading with slippage (see next point). If any of you are interested in proving this for yourself without risking a dime, all you need to do is go to the trading room and look at the broadcast trades being posted in Hotcomm, write them and do your calculations. Then look and see what gets posted on the website at night. The biggest scam is that many times the systems that lost substantially just get a $0 in the results on the website.
(2) Regardless of point #1 above, you can't achieve the results even when the "strategy" is making money. The reason is slippage. If one of the strategies just takes 2 winners in a row for the day and then finishes the day with maximum profit, then you will make money, but after slippage it will be lot less than the strategy made. Most traders are averaging between 2-4 ticks slippage per round turn. Well you can look at the TS strategy performance reports and see that if you just apply 1 tick of slippage per round turn, the system would either be at break even or would be at severe loss over lengthy periods of time. I have not tested all of the strategies that way, but I am telling you that you cannot make money on these systems when you include slippage.
Today, a member in the room asked about one of the systems in particular called "StickingBird" whether anyone was making money just letting the system run since this is the system that the vendor keeps saying that his wife trades everyday without touching it. And, no one in the room piped up because there is a very good reason that you don't keep the system on....once you turn it on and the system maxes with a profit for the day and you are still in loss because of the number of trades it took to get there, or you get a few ticks net but the system says that it got 12 ticks net for the day, you start to realize that the results that led you to the room and the strategies in the first place, are simply not achievable after slippage. How long do you need to leave it on before you realize that you have been duped? How stupid would you be if you just turned it on and just left it on for any entire week just to watch your account be devastated while the system shows that it broke even or made a lot of money for the same week.
yet, the fact that no one will just leave the systems on over a long period of time is what the vendor uses as an excuse to say that this why people are not making money. How convenient. But on the trades that he announces in the hotcomm room that his wife is achieving in her account, he is almost never getting slippage, but everyone in the trade is getting slippage and sometimes we are getting very, very bad slippage and he is getting none.
there may still be a way to beat his system by trading manually, but I dont think it will be easy because several traders have already tried it. on many trades you can enter at better price, but on a lot of them you cannot.
At any rate the trading room is known as simple automatic trading and the website is www.simple-automatic-trading.com. You had better avoid spending your money there.
Anyway, the update here is that I am still in the room and I can now tell you with absolute certainty that this is a scam. Why do I say that:
(1) The results being posted on the website don't even match the strategy more less what is happening in real trading with slippage (see next point). If any of you are interested in proving this for yourself without risking a dime, all you need to do is go to the trading room and look at the broadcast trades being posted in Hotcomm, write them and do your calculations. Then look and see what gets posted on the website at night. The biggest scam is that many times the systems that lost substantially just get a $0 in the results on the website.
(2) Regardless of point #1 above, you can't achieve the results even when the "strategy" is making money. The reason is slippage. If one of the strategies just takes 2 winners in a row for the day and then finishes the day with maximum profit, then you will make money, but after slippage it will be lot less than the strategy made. Most traders are averaging between 2-4 ticks slippage per round turn. Well you can look at the TS strategy performance reports and see that if you just apply 1 tick of slippage per round turn, the system would either be at break even or would be at severe loss over lengthy periods of time. I have not tested all of the strategies that way, but I am telling you that you cannot make money on these systems when you include slippage.
Today, a member in the room asked about one of the systems in particular called "StickingBird" whether anyone was making money just letting the system run since this is the system that the vendor keeps saying that his wife trades everyday without touching it. And, no one in the room piped up because there is a very good reason that you don't keep the system on....once you turn it on and the system maxes with a profit for the day and you are still in loss because of the number of trades it took to get there, or you get a few ticks net but the system says that it got 12 ticks net for the day, you start to realize that the results that led you to the room and the strategies in the first place, are simply not achievable after slippage. How long do you need to leave it on before you realize that you have been duped? How stupid would you be if you just turned it on and just left it on for any entire week just to watch your account be devastated while the system shows that it broke even or made a lot of money for the same week.
yet, the fact that no one will just leave the systems on over a long period of time is what the vendor uses as an excuse to say that this why people are not making money. How convenient. But on the trades that he announces in the hotcomm room that his wife is achieving in her account, he is almost never getting slippage, but everyone in the trade is getting slippage and sometimes we are getting very, very bad slippage and he is getting none.
there may still be a way to beat his system by trading manually, but I dont think it will be easy because several traders have already tried it. on many trades you can enter at better price, but on a lot of them you cannot.
At any rate the trading room is known as simple automatic trading and the website is www.simple-automatic-trading.com. You had better avoid spending your money there.
Running a Wire was /is a horse racing scam. They did it in the movie The Sting. You delay the announcement of the race so that your racing room knows the outcome before the start and you give the mark the tip on how to bet so he loses... Nearly all scams are childishly simple like that I suppose..
They are crooks likely as not.. at the very least they are incompetent... I'd think twice about crossing them up though, they might have your payment info and decide to take that and run with it awhile... best to just go away quietly maybe..
They are crooks likely as not.. at the very least they are incompetent... I'd think twice about crossing them up though, they might have your payment info and decide to take that and run with it awhile... best to just go away quietly maybe..
this guy looks like he is trying reverse psychology. DON'T TRY MY SITE. THIS ONE. AT www.MY-SITE.com. REALLY. IT IS SCAM. DON'T Go THERE!!!!!
Can you help me out...as I see that you have been out here for a while and you have a high number of post (and I am asking you sincerely).
If you are dealing with a company who is scamming people, and you wanted to help other people out by making sure that there is relevant information in the public domain about this company, how would you go about doing that without appearing to be a spammer?
The dillema is that if I don't put the name of the company, then two things happen: (1) I don't help anyone, and (2) I will be accused of being a clever, professional spammer because I will be making people private message me to get the name of the company or website.
However, If I do put the name of the website that is ripping people off, even if I make it clear that it is a scam, then again I am just a clever spammer / marketer of the very website that I am trying to warn people against.
And lastly, maybe I am mistaken, but if I were a spammer, would I really need to start a negative thread to spam out here? I just spent a few minutes looking through this website and apparently you can pretty much spam at will without having to say anything negative at all. All I have to do is ask a question like "hey, have you dudes heard of XYZ traders, my brother in law says he is making a lot of money with them". I don't see those post being deleted?
I dont understand how to accomplish my goal.
If you are dealing with a company who is scamming people, and you wanted to help other people out by making sure that there is relevant information in the public domain about this company, how would you go about doing that without appearing to be a spammer?
The dillema is that if I don't put the name of the company, then two things happen: (1) I don't help anyone, and (2) I will be accused of being a clever, professional spammer because I will be making people private message me to get the name of the company or website.
However, If I do put the name of the website that is ripping people off, even if I make it clear that it is a scam, then again I am just a clever spammer / marketer of the very website that I am trying to warn people against.
And lastly, maybe I am mistaken, but if I were a spammer, would I really need to start a negative thread to spam out here? I just spent a few minutes looking through this website and apparently you can pretty much spam at will without having to say anything negative at all. All I have to do is ask a question like "hey, have you dudes heard of XYZ traders, my brother in law says he is making a lot of money with them". I don't see those post being deleted?
I dont understand how to accomplish my goal.
OK, so attached is a TS Strategy Report for one of the systems being traded in the room. I have not really checked the results on the website for this system...so don't know what is being reported but heard from another trader that they match very closely.
As you can see, the issue is that the average $ profit per trade is $2.68. That is great, and if it could be achieved you could trade multiple contracts and make pretty good money.
However, the issue here is that even if you are able to pull off only average 1/2 tick slippage per round turn, that is $2.50 of your profits per trade right there. So, you are now only making $.18 cents per round turn which over 152 trades is only $27.36. I don't know this for sure because I am not as experienced as many of you out here, but from my limited experience trading this market, I don't think that averaging only 1 tick of slippage per every 2 round turns is even feasible. The system trades on Market If Touched (MIT) orders, and I have not been able to achieve 1/2 tick of slippage per every 2 round turns, and even if I could, it would still leave me with very little profit.
As you can see, the issue is that the average $ profit per trade is $2.68. That is great, and if it could be achieved you could trade multiple contracts and make pretty good money.
However, the issue here is that even if you are able to pull off only average 1/2 tick slippage per round turn, that is $2.50 of your profits per trade right there. So, you are now only making $.18 cents per round turn which over 152 trades is only $27.36. I don't know this for sure because I am not as experienced as many of you out here, but from my limited experience trading this market, I don't think that averaging only 1 tick of slippage per every 2 round turns is even feasible. The system trades on Market If Touched (MIT) orders, and I have not been able to achieve 1/2 tick of slippage per every 2 round turns, and even if I could, it would still leave me with very little profit.
Attachments
So, under the category of "tricks that vendors play" is this little story.
A few days ago, the vendor of this site, Gregg, got a little bit upset because a trader who has been in the room for a while threw out a challenge to the entire room by asking a question regarding who has been able to make money with the systems by just letting the systems trade (the context of his question was whether they had made money AFTER SLIPPAGE).
Essentially, though I don't have the exact words, the vendor responded by saying that he wanted to know who in the room had turned on the strategies and just allowed them to run for at least one month. He said that if no one in the room had done that, then he did not want to talk about it any further.
However, the issue here is that you cannot just leave these systems on and make money...when you run the backtest you can see very quickly that if you took your average slippage per round turn being experienced on the real trades, and then you multipied by the number of trades in your backtest, and then you subtracted that amount from the system profit, you are in losing territory. So, someone tried to explain this to the vendor and the vendor basically said that he did not get the slippage that everyone else was getting and that the problems had to be related to computer systems, connections, etc. with the individual traders.
This, even after 1 week before, the vendor seemed to be agreeing that it was all random with TradeStation since it was clear that people in the room with the fastest computers and connections were not doing any better than those with slower computers and connections over the long run on fills it just appeared to be completely random...some days you get hit with bad slippage and somedays you did not. Someone in the room commented that it could have something to do with what server you are on.
A few days ago, the vendor of this site, Gregg, got a little bit upset because a trader who has been in the room for a while threw out a challenge to the entire room by asking a question regarding who has been able to make money with the systems by just letting the systems trade (the context of his question was whether they had made money AFTER SLIPPAGE).
Essentially, though I don't have the exact words, the vendor responded by saying that he wanted to know who in the room had turned on the strategies and just allowed them to run for at least one month. He said that if no one in the room had done that, then he did not want to talk about it any further.
However, the issue here is that you cannot just leave these systems on and make money...when you run the backtest you can see very quickly that if you took your average slippage per round turn being experienced on the real trades, and then you multipied by the number of trades in your backtest, and then you subtracted that amount from the system profit, you are in losing territory. So, someone tried to explain this to the vendor and the vendor basically said that he did not get the slippage that everyone else was getting and that the problems had to be related to computer systems, connections, etc. with the individual traders.
This, even after 1 week before, the vendor seemed to be agreeing that it was all random with TradeStation since it was clear that people in the room with the fastest computers and connections were not doing any better than those with slower computers and connections over the long run on fills it just appeared to be completely random...some days you get hit with bad slippage and somedays you did not. Someone in the room commented that it could have something to do with what server you are on.