"Scaling out" is inferior behavior

[Buy1Sell2]

Quote from NihabaAshi:

Ok...time for me to leave this thread when I see a statement like this.

A large position regardless if it occurred all at once or a scale will get butchered via a market order if the price levels are thin.

Newbie traders or traders that don't trade size and considering trading a lot of size if you are properly capitalize for such...

Don't try what Buy1Sell2 just recommended when a position size is too large for what ever reasons unless you have parental guidance.

See ya and the door has hit me on the way out.

Mark

A position that is large enough to get butchered by a market order is one that should be traded. For instance, a stop order is market order in itself, and is considered to be the safety net of the trader. If a market orders gets killed in execution, then it is the trader's fault for having that position on to begin with. --Just ask Bear Stearns. (By the way, they were supposed to big professional players).

Sorry to see you go and thanks for contributing. For some reason your points were not really relevant to the discussion at hand all throughout, but thanks fpr trying.--

 

[Buy1Sell2]

Quote from EdgeHunter:

To take this "as advice" to go market on a size order in a thin or illiquid market would be very unwise...


<img src="http://www.enflow.com/p.gif">

The advice was apparently missed. I thought you would have gotten it. The advice is to not trade illiquid markets--or at least not size as it relates to your account. If you are in a market that is illiquid enought that a market order would have a great impact on your account, then that market/instrument should not n=be traded.

 

[Buy1Sell2]

Quote from illiquid:



2) The thread starter also gave up on intraday trading because it was "a waste of time" (see other threads).

Now in light of the above (and please correct me if I am wrong, b1s2), you can see why he would/could start such a thread with such conviction -- and also why 2) should be the obvious case.

To say that if one cannot trade a position at a single price at a single moment, a trader should cut down his position size, is a complete fallacy. Any trader worth his salt <b>learns</b> to scale his positions, both entries and exits, if the conditions demand it -- THAT is reality. Do you really expect us to believe that the best traders on the street always enter and exit at one shot?

No Scale In and No Scale Out works on all time frames. Daytrading is a waste of time because there are other things that can be done with the time to add quality to life instead of sittinig in front of a screen. Markets that will not allow all in or all out market orders without significant detriment to your account should not be traded (at least not with size that would hurt--ask Bear Stearns).

 

[Buy1Sell2]

Quote from smilingsynic:


If I am willling to risk 2 points for a potential six point gain, for instance, why would I get out at less than 6 unless I have to? The market will make it loud and clear if I have to.

Exactly. --and I know from personal experience over the years that it is very easy to pull the position before the 6 points. Most people including myself have the tendency to grab gains as soon as they become available, thus throwing out all the research and back testing where there was no emotioin involved. I had to train myself to hold positions until the trade reached maturity. Most traders will never learn this. Am I smarter or a superior person? No. However, my trading style is superior. I am not saying that you can't make money scaling, however it is inferior to the profits that can be made by not scaling.

 

[Buy1Sell2]

Quote from fearless9:

Each trade is a new adventure because I believe in trade size and I will leave you all to figure out the logic.



"One size fits all" belongs to paper tigers.

regards
f9

Trade size is a huge key. Great point!

Paper Tiger?? Not hardly.


Never risk more than 2 percent of TLNW on any one trade/idea.

 

[Buy1Sell2]

Quote from EdgeHunter:


The world is NOT linear and neat... It is chaotic and messy... and chaos, or life, is built out of scales at all levels... it only appears that it is neat and linear...

[

I never said that the world is linear and neat. However, by using correct sizing and principles such as not scaling, we can make it more close to neat and ordered. That is what we are really trying to do as traders anyway. Thank you for your post.

 

[volente_00]

How is scaling out inferior when on your last trade you had 2 different chances to cover at 1255 but instead covered above 1343 ? ES trades with quite a bit reversion to the mean so it is highly likely that your thinking can be correct but you get whipped out of the position with lower profit due to mean reversion.

 

[smilingsynic]

Quote from volente_00:

How is scaling out inferior when on your last trade you had 2 different chances to cover at 1255 but instead covered above 1343 ? ES trades with quite a bit reversion to the mean so it is highly likely that your thinking can be correct but you get whipped out of the position with lower profit due to mean reversion.

Hindsight is 20/20.

If it had gone to 1150 and then B1S2 got out at 1200, then covering at 1255 would have appeared unwise.

Shoulda, woulda, coulda.

 

[Buy1Sell2]

Quote from volente_00:

How is scaling out inferior when on your last trade you had 2 different chances to cover at 1255 but instead covered above 1343 ? ES trades with quite a bit reversion to the mean so it is highly likely that your thinking can be correct but you get whipped out of the position with lower profit due to mean reversion.

This was a very profitable trade for me with 140 ES points per contract realized with full position.

Again the discussion is about what works over the long haul, not on one individual trade.

 

[fearless9]

good morning B1S2,

On a forum such as this one, a great number of members are batting way beyond their average and this is revealed in their postings.

We are all judged no only by what we contribute, but most importantly by the manner in which this contribution is made.

Your Op had a very narrow reference (too narrow IMO) and now you are working outside it in order to justify yourself.

Why dont you try sharing and participating ín the discussions instead of your normal fear driven dictatorial style of response.

Good heavens you may even learn something in return.
After all, isnt that the true purpose of ET.

Right now, you leave me with the impression that your somewhat academic pedantic postings are the result of a deep seated fear that is preventing you from moving forward.

Maybe you have gone too far down chartist lane and you cannot take the next step and begin trading a real account.

Maybe this is not the case at all.
But I would suggest that you give thought to your approach if you hope to be taken seriously.

regards
f9