Rush gets himself in trouble...damn liberals!

[canyonman00]

Quote from Don Bright:



And the last I checked, buying drugs without a prescription = illegal drug purchase and use. (Sorry, Chet, I actually meant to respond to the post above about the "crack" etc.)...

Don

And if sentencing of some type becomes associated with all of this, then so be it. And I would immediately move to supporting about half of the Hollywood crowd getting their fair share. Of course don't forget the NBA and NFL. We do need to start some fair and equal sentencing here.

 

[Rearden Metal]

Quote from canyonman00:



I also feel that illegal drug use gets too much of a pass. Especially if the perp has $$.

...and I feel the exact OPPOSITE.
Since when is it the government's job to protect us from ourselves by spending billions of our tax dollars incarcerating millions of innocent political prisoners?

The legitimate role of government is to protect people from criminals who would violate their individual rights. It is not the role of government to care who gets high and with what substances.

Life, Liberty & Pursuit of Happiness- Remember?

 

[hapaboy]

Quote from Rearden Metal:

The legitimate role of government is to protect people from criminals who would violate their individual rights. It is not the role of government to care who gets high and with what substances.

Life, Liberty & Pursuit of Happiness- Remember?

What about the criminals who violate our individual rights because they're high, looking for a way to finance their habit, or are engaged in the drug business? What about the crack mom whose baby is born with all kinds of problems and whose care will literally cost the taxpayer MILLIONS of dollars over that baby's lifetime for care?

It's just like motorcycle helmet laws - feel free to ride without a helmet, but don't ask the rest of us to pay for your medical expenses when you become asphalt pizza.

 

[marketsurfer]

Quote from hapaboy:



What about the criminals who violate our individual rights because they're high, looking for a way to finance their habit, or are engaged in the drug business? What about the crack mom whose baby is born with all kinds of problems and whose care will literally cost the taxpayer MILLIONS of dollars over that baby's lifetime for care?

It's just like motorcycle helmet laws - feel free to ride without a helmet, but don't ask the rest of us to pay for your medical expenses when you become asphalt pizza.

this is exactly why drugs need to be decriminalized. the money spent on the "drug war" should be spent on helping and educating the addicts.

best,

surfer

 

[canyonman00]

Quote from Rearden Metal:

...and I feel the exact OPPOSITE.
Since when is it the government's job to protect us from ourselves by spending billions of our tax dollars incarcerating millions of innocent political prisoners?

The legitimate role of government is to protect people from criminals who would violate their individual rights. It is not the role of government to care who gets high and with what substances.

Life, Liberty & Pursuit of Happiness- Remember?

Sorry to here that. I have a cousin (by marriage) who is doing 20 years for possession and trafficking in cocaine (and other things) who would just love to meet you.

He explained it to me once. He said he never had a chance to get anywhere so he had to take charge himself and that's why he was selling. He had a new Porsche at 19. Never had job, just bought car. He's currently in year 11 and is expecting to get out on good behavior soon. And he can't wait to buy a Range Rover.

He too say's it's the government's fault that he had to sell drug to make ends meet. He had to bring in money for his two kids to help out with their mother's expenses. Pampers, formula, hair appointments, daily living money. But he felt that he needed the finer things too. He had the fancy cars, the expensive designer suits and tons of shoes.

He was at all the expensive sporting events in the best seats. He was "Livin' Large." When he finally got busted, he was pissed at society and the police, for stopping another businessman from "just making a living."

Now he has plenty of capital stashed and he say's he's too smart to get busted this time around. Fortunately, he was locked away I say. Let's both hope he doesn't impact your family this time around.

 

[marketsurfer]

interesting story, canyonman. that is another prime example on why drugs need to be decriminialized asap. take away the profit motive, and the dealers will vanish. your cous does have fine taste in cars.....


best,

surfer

 

[Maverick74]

Quote from marketsurfer:

interesting story, canyonman. that is another prime example on why drugs need to be decriminialized asap. take away the profit motive, and the dealers will vanish. your cous does have fine taste in cars.....


best,

surfer

I've thought about the legalizing of drugs argument for years and I too thought that was the answer. Just legalize them and let whoever wanted to destroy themselves with the drugs, do it. In fact, help them so they could kill themselves as fast as possible as not to be a burden on society. However, after further evaluating this idea of getting rid of the dealers, I'm not so sure anymore and let me give you examples.

A black market in any product is there for a reason. Sometimes, its not their because the actual product or service is illegal. Example, prostitution. For years it has been legal in Nevada outside of Vegas, yet the so called black market in vegas is as strong as ever. Why? Because what the dealers will do in the black market is simply make the product or service better, stronger or cheaper.

Take cocaine for example. Sure the us government could legalize and call it Cocatal and let Merck manufacture it and sell it at Walgreens over the counter. But it will be weak, and expensive. The dealers however will have something called pure cocaine. And it will be strong, pure and effective. Also it will be a fraction of the cost. So you see, by legalizing drugs or anything on the black market, you will not stop the crime only spread the epidemic.

Another example. Nutritional supplements. We have all but legalized steroids in this country. No they are not called that but we have legal products that are very damn close. Well, did it stop the black market? No, it made it stronger. Why? Because essentially what it did is it got a lot of young guys taking pro hormones for the first time and testosterone and they liked it but they are not nearly as effective as the real thing. So eventually these guys would go into the black market to buy the real deal at a fraction of the cost and much much more potent.

So all legalization will do is introduce a large part of our society to a less potent and very expensive version of the real thing, get them hooked and it will only be a matter of time where they will seek out the real drug which is much better and much cheaper. In a way, you could say this would be the best thing that ever happened to the dealers, because the gov't would be acting as an introducing broker so to speak. It scares the hell out of me to think of the potential consequences of this.

To sum it up, legalization will only make the crime go higher, and bring new customers that ordinarily would never have touched this crap. And it would be our tax dollars that would be subsidizing the destruction of our society.

 

[dgabriel]

Quote from canyonman00:



Sorry to here that. I have a cousin (by marriage) who is doing 20 years for possession and trafficking in cocaine (and other things) who would just love to meet you.

He explained it to me once. He said he never had a chance to get anywhere so he had to take charge himself and that's why he was selling. He had a new Porsche at 19. Never had job, just bought car. He's currently in year 11 and is expecting to get out on good behavior soon. And he can't wait to buy a Range Rover.

He too say's it's the government's fault that he had to sell drug to make ends meet. He had to bring in money for his two kids to help out with their mother's expenses. Pampers, formula, hair appointments, daily living money. But he felt that he needed the finer things too. He had the fancy cars, the expensive designer suits and tons of shoes.

He was at all the expensive sporting events in the best seats. He was "Livin' Large." When he finally got busted, he was pissed at society and the police, for stopping another businessman from "just making a living."

Now he has plenty of capital stashed and he say's he's too smart to get busted this time around. Fortunately, he was locked away I say. Let's both hope he doesn't impact your family this time around.

I hope your cousin does well after his release.

But the fact remains another person took his place in the drug trade the minute he was arrested. And it's an endless cycle that keeps the prisons full of young black men, providing no true rehabilitation or real chance for improving thier futures, the courts overbooked, the police departments overburdened and overzealous in asset forfieture, and the taxpayer getting the bill.

Decriminalization will wipe out most of the crime associated with the drug trade. Prohibition did not cure alcoholism; criminalizing drug use does not cure the crackhead. Criminalizing drug possession just puts a puritan stamp of disapproval on drug use.

Hapaboy's crackhead mother (example) is a crackhead mother already.

 

[canyonman00]

Quote from dgabriel:

But the fact remains another person took his place in the drug trade the minute he was arrested. And it's an endless cycle that keeps the prisons full of young black men, providing no true rehabilitation or real chance for improving their futures, the courts overbooked, the police departments overburdened and overzealous in asset forfieture, and the taxpayer getting the bill.

Decriminalization will wipe out most of the crime associated with the drug trade. Prohibition did not cure alcoholism; criminalizing drug use does not cure the crackhead. Criminalizing drug possession just puts a puritan stamp of disapproval on drug use.

Hapaboy's crackhead mother (example) is a crackhead mother already.

I strongly disagree. The government will regulate whatever product that is released. And as another writer stated, the pure product will still be desired, available, and illegally sold. If I might use this example.

Dropping of prohibition did not stop the oncoming drug onslaught. The rationale was if you make it legal (alcohol) crime that was associated with it would go down. I would move that crime just shifts to another venue at best. Those who profit in the illegal trafficking will just find the next product.

My cousin has no marketable job skills nor does he have any interest in getting any. Or I should say, none that would allow him the revenue to purchase the desired Range Rover. Thousand dollar suits on McD's cashflow? Not hardly. At 19 he was driving a 928. Custom made clothing was his trademark. He wants to live in a penthouse.

Whenever he's released there'll be a reality check on his horizon. Let's hope it's not with some unsuspecting law-abiding citizen at the end of his 45.

 

[canyonman00]

Quote from marketsurfer:

interesting story, canyonman. that is another prime example on why drugs need to be decriminialized asap. take away the profit motive, and the dealers will vanish. your cous does have fine taste in cars.....
surfer

Not hardly. His logic is that he'd just find a way to make or find a stronger product. I had that discussion with him already. He also thinks car jackin' is pretty cool. He said that the parts should make "mad crazy" dollars at the chop shop.

It is a very sad thing to say, but there is a segment of the populous that does seek the lowest common denominator. For whatever reason, be it real or contrived. For them, you do need to be real also.