Ron Paul Is the Tin Cup Of Conservatism

[rew]

Quote from pspr:

I think there would be a huge void in world order if the U.S. just pulled out of everywhere and came home. We would certainly see the world ignite into war in many places and eventually spread to engulf us. No doubt, nuclear weapons would proliferate and be used by many.

I think the world will get along with that "huge void" just fine.

I would take you more seriously if you would agree to pay twice as much income tax so we could keep the empire going without bankrupting ourselves.

 

[AAAintheBeltway]

Quote from pspr:

I couldn't agree more except I don't think I can live with Paul's foreign policy in the primaries. It's just too radical. But I would vote for him vs Obama should the tide turn.

I believe Pauls views would change some after sitting down with national policy advisors and he is presented with some facts he either is not privy to or has ignored so far.

That is my thesis. Paul did not have to renounce his foreign policy views, just temper them a bit. He could say we made a big mistake in Iraq and Afghanistan, and that he doesn't want to deal in hypotheticals regarding iran but that Iran getting a nuke is unacceptable.

The point is that he wouldn't have been pandering. He could still make the point that our interventionist policy is bankrupting us and creating more problems than it solves. Just don't say stuff that frightens people and lends itself to being misinterpreted.

 

[pspr]

Quote from rew:

I think the world will get along with that "huge void" just fine.

I would take you more seriously if you would agree to pay twice as much income tax so we could keep the empire going without bankrupting ourselves.

LOL If you want to send me your check I will make sure it gets in the proper hands.

 

[rew]

Quote from pspr:

LOL If you want to send me your check I will make sure it gets in the proper hands.

Why would I send you a check? I'm not the one who wants to spend billions on stupid foreign wars.

 

[jem]

the problem is none of these republican candidates have the balls to lay it out there like Cain.

999 or 777
or no tax but tarriffs.
or cut 3% a year until balance and a flat tax.
or no tax but a vat.

The independents also want a plan.
Contrary to the fear that by putting out a plan you give Obama something to attack... the country is screaming for a change by a plan.

Screaming for it. I can not believe how deaf these fools are.
Cain showed them how to win.
Stop listening to advisors and get on the train.

Low flat, yearly spending cut - til balanced, Job producing industries targeted for tarriff or hard core trade negotiation. Exploit natural gas.

Stop dollar debasing activities.

How hard is that.
you will get all the republicans and 90% of independents.

How hard is that.

 

[pspr]

Quote from rew:

...... wants to spend billions on stupid foreign wars.

I don't recall saying that. Can you point out where I did?

 

[Trader666]

Perfect conservative by what standard? Racist, kook, or liar?

The Fact Checker
Ron Paul and the racist newsletters

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs...ker-biography/2011/12/21/gIQAKNiwBP_blog.html

Quote from AAAintheBeltway:

Then there is Ron Paul. The perfect conservative in both public and private life. A guy nearly everyone in the party admires on some level.

 

[hofficita]

Quote from AAAintheBeltway:

I'm reasonably sure it is the latter, but like Tin Cup, sometimes that gets in the way of achieving a larger, more important goal.

Did you not get the ending of 'Tin Cup'? The point was that greatness is sometimes achieved by being stubborn (principled) and failing rather than doing the easy thing and succeeding.

RP's only interest is in changing the political philosophy of the nation, and you don't do that by pandering. He understands that without a philosophical change among the populace, changing the leadership in Washington is meaningless.

And perhaps Paul's legacy will reverberate through the coming years long after the winner of this year's election is forgotten.

 

[John_Wensink]

After learning more about Ron Paul I have to say I like him. I believe he is a man of principle and honestly. His foreign policy was absurd but that doesn't mean he could have actually implemented it if he were elected.

I think he would have taken the dishonest in our gov't to task and exposed the fraud.

Frankly, whether it be obama or whoever, we are fucked

There is more dishonesty in gov't and the media than I care to think about.

Quote from AAAintheBeltway:

The Republicans are down to four candidates, none of whom has achieved launch velocity. Each has flaws or at least warts that turn off substantial segments of the party.

Romney lacks authenticity, doesn't connect on an emotional level and has a history of flip-flops.

Gingrich is the other extreme, all emotion, love him or hate him.

Santorum is George Bush in a sweater vest, a big government, pro illegal immigration, neo-con moralist.

Then there is Ron Paul. The perfect conservative in both public and private life. A guy nearly everyone in the party admires on some level. The big but however is his foreign policy, which strikes many as naive. Obviously, the neo-cons, the Israel firsters and the military-industrial complex view him as anathema. He threatens their world view. Worse yet, what if he was proved correct? Then who is going to buy those weapon systems?

Paul however has allowed himself to be demonized by these groups and marginalized. In practice, there would be little difference in his foreign policy and that of any other candidate, except maybe Santorum. Paul should have been emphasizing that and trying to minimize differences. Instead, he sharpened them and exaggerated them. Why? Was it some kind of misguided ego trip or just the continuation of a life of putting principle above expediency?

I'm reasonably sure it is the latter, but like Tin Cup, sometimes that gets in the way of achieving a larger, more important goal.

 

[AAAintheBeltway]

Quote from hofficita:

Did you not get the ending of 'Tin Cup'? The point was that greatness is sometimes achieved by being stubborn (principled) and failing rather than doing the easy thing and succeeding.

RP's only interest is in changing the political philosophy of the nation, and you don't do that by pandering. He understands that without a philosophical change among the populace, changing the leadership in Washington is meaningless.

And perhaps Paul's legacy will reverberate through the coming years long after the winner of this year's election is forgotten.

I realized after posting that I probably should have summarized Tin Cup for those who didn't see it. Here goes: Driving range pro blows chance to win U. S. Open because of obsession with hitting the perfect shot. He dumps multiple balls into a lake fronting the 18 th green trying to do so and loses. The movie's premise is that he is somehow a pure hero, unconcerned with society's definition of success. I thought the movie was stupid and the hero was a moron and loser who couldn't handle winning, so had to retreat into his own make-believe world.

Now there does seem to me to be an obvious analogy with Ron Paul. In his case, I think it is a near obsession with principle, but it is healthy in that what he wants is what is best for the country. In Tin Cup, by contrast, it was purely ego-drive. "Look at me hit the perfect shot."

The problem though is Ron Paul may be letting down his followers and the country, just as the guy in Tin Cup let down his fans. No one is asking Paul to jettison his principles just to be popular. Is it too much to ask though for him to try not to scare people who have been brainwashed for years?