"Retail" investment in leading CTAs

oldtime · Apr 4, 2013

Quote from optionbull:

pending the strategy, you can look at Barclays Hedge, some very reputable CTA have low draw downs and decent returns..

I hear ya, but thse were commodity CTA's min investment 25K

one of them charged 4% of the gross and 20% of the profits

the only one that almost did ok charged 0 of the gross and 30% of the profits

max size for most funds was about 8 million, and some were as small as 80k

marketsurfer · Apr 4, 2013

Quote from oldtime:

I hear ya, but thse were commodity CTA's min investment 25K

one of them charged 4% of the gross and 20% of the profits

the only one that almost did ok charged 0 of the gross and 30% of the profits

max size for most funds was about 8 million, and some were as small as 80k

Isn't Barclays Hedge all self reported data? It has nothing to do with Barclay's bank, in case anyone was wondering and is based in IOWA. LOL--

<i>Please note: BarclayHedge is not affiliated with Barclays Bank or any of its affiliated entities. We are a privately owned Iowa corporation>/i>

surf

optionbull · Apr 4, 2013

Quote from oldtime:

I hear ya, but thse were commodity CTA's min investment 25K

one of them charged 4% of the gross and 20% of the profits

the only one that almost did ok charged 0 of the gross and 30% of the profits

max size for most funds was about 8 million, and some were as small as 80k

wow,

I like the profit only fund but 4 percent fees is steep.
Back in your day were "funds" like fidelity that main stream, ths was alternative to "stock broker" recommendations...

oldtime · Apr 4, 2013

Quote from optionbull:

wow,

I like the profit only fund but 4 percent fees is steep.
Back in your day were "funds" like fidelity that main stream, ths was alternative to "stock broker" recommendations...

most people just owned 4 or 5 stocks
all stockbrokers hated fidelity or any no load fund and they were never mentioned

the first thing I did when I got fired was take all my familiy's money and move it to the Vanguard S&P 500 index fund. It was kind of hard to explain why now, suddenly it was such a good idea, and why they had never heard of it before.

(the 4% guy was up over 120% at one time, but he burnt out quickly. His fund got closed out before it went too far down.)

2/20 became the norm, but most CTA's couldn't make it with such small accounts and left to go on to do other things (Richard Dennis, case in point)

rwk · Apr 4, 2013

Quote from Mirkou:
... the 50 K account is not a segregated CTA account because it is simply not possible to run a segregated account with only 50 k ...

I was noodling this idea a while back. With changes in technology, I believe it would be technically possible to manage individual accounts at $50k and possibly smaller. It's the regulatory hurdles and overhead expense that make it impractical. And small investors are often more trouble than larger (i.e. more sophisticated) ones.

optionbull · Apr 4, 2013

Quote from oldtime:

most people just owned 4 or 5 stocks
all stockbrokers hated fidelity or any no load fund and they were never mentioned

the first thing I did when I got fired was take all my familiy's money and move it to the Vanguard S&P 500 index fund. It was kind of hard to explain why now, suddenly it was such a good idea, and why they had never heard of it before.

(the 4% guy was up over 120% at one time, but he burnt out quickly. His fund got closed out before it went too far down.)

2/20 became the norm, but most CTA's couldn't make it with such small accounts and left to go on to do other things (Richard Dennis, case in point)

interesting, thanks

optionbull · Apr 4, 2013

Quote from rwk:

I was noodling this idea a while back. With changes in technology, I believe it would be technically possible to manage individual accounts at $50k and possibly smaller. It's the regulatory hurdles and overhead expense that make it impractical. And small investors are often more trouble than larger (i.e. more sophisticated) ones.

Thought IB and organizations like Vision Financial give you a master accout and you allocate each trade accordinly, so if you have 10 accounts with 10k and you trade 10 lots each get allocated per instructions such as 1 each ?

think you have t oregister as CTA though

trade2live · Apr 4, 2013

Quote from oldtime:

I hear ya, but thse were commodity CTA's min investment 25K

one of them charged 4% of the gross and 20% of the profits

the only one that almost did ok charged 0 of the gross and 30% of the profits

max size for most funds was about 8 million, and some were as small as 80k

Were those managed accounts or funds ?

rwk · Apr 4, 2013

Quote from optionbull:
Thought IB and organizations like Vision Financial give you a master accout and you allocate each trade accordinly, so if you have 10 accounts with 10k and you trade 10 lots each get allocated per instructions such as 1 each ?

think you have to register as CTA though

I use IB, and that is one of the approaches I considered. But at the time, I was trading fully automated, and I also considering having multiple copies of the IB software and my app. I could add computers as needed, perhaps a whole room full.

There is an exemption for [something like] max 15 investors and max $400k funding in commodities, but the exemption does not allow any advertising. It's supposed to be for friends and family.

xandman · Apr 25, 2015

marketsurfer said:
Aaa, perhaps checking Google would be a smart first step before publishing anything ?

Here's a clue to get you started. Try equinox mutual funds on for size.

surf

Thanks, Surf. I have always wondered if there was a retail backdoor to these legendary futures fund managers. Any other? Do you know of any retail way to get into Dunn Capital Management?