Renaissance Technologies Moving Into Futures

[Maverick74]

Quote from Trader5287:

6B ain't jack

The Renaissance Institutional Equities Fund, started in mid-2005 is being offered as a "mega-fund" for institutional investors; reportedly it has a capacity of up to $100bn.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Renaissance_Technologies

Yes, but the 6 billion dollar book is mostly HIS money. Think about that for a second. The guy is making 40% a year net of fees on basically his book. Obviously he is not charging himself fees so his real return is close to 70% a year on his own money!!!!!. Now do some simple compounding math and tell me how soon he is going to be a trillionare. LOL. Or at least the world's richest man.

 

[Trader5287]

I don't get a lot of what you pros know on HF strategies, risk management, etc.. but say they are invested all the time making thousands of trades. What happens to the markets they're in if they stop trading and go to cash on 100B + 6B x leverage?

 

[Enfinity]

In my estimation he is diverting some of the earnings from Medallion into other vehicles, including his institutional fund. I know of one very large Chicago HFM that has an account with Northern Trust and has been doing extensive diversification into quality art.

I would vote for the Chicago couple to have a better chance at hitting trillionaire status before Simons due to their age. Even then, there is a long time horizon before any of them even approaches 13 figures. The strategies to manage that kind of accumulating wealth are beyond just cutting edge at this point...our experience with pools of money that large has been long bonds, stocks, and real estate. That's not to say better alternatives don't exist, just that the current pikers running money of that size haven't had to be very creative to achieve their mandates.

Quote from Maverick74:

Yes, but the 6 billion dollar book is mostly HIS money. Think about that for a second. The guy is making 40% a year net of fees on basically his book. Obviously he is not charging himself fees so his real return is close to 70% a year on his own money!!!!!. Now do some simple compounding math and tell me how soon he is going to be a trillionare. LOL. Or at least the world's richest man.

 

[Maverick74]

Quote from Enfinity:

In my estimation he is diverting some of the earnings from Medallion into other vehicles, including his institutional fund. I know of one very large Chicago HFM that has an account with Northern Trust and has been doing extensive diversification into quality art.

I would vote for the Chicago couple to have a better chance at hitting trillionaire status before Simons due to their age. Even then, there is a long time horizon before any of them even approaches 13 figures. The strategies to manage that kind of accumulating wealth are beyond just cutting edge at this point...our experience with pools of money that large has been long bonds, stocks, and real estate. That's not to say better alternatives don't exist, just that the current pikers running money of that size haven't had to be very creative to achieve their mandates.

No way do the Griffins beat Simmons to a trillion. Although I expect Ken to get a nice bump when he eventually goes public. There are some very distinct differences between the two. Ken has been struggling of late to maintain his returns. James is just getting warmed up. I really think the world has not seen nor will see anyone like Simmons again for quite some time. The only way he fails to get to a trillion would be because of personal choice, if he walked away. I don't see that happening.

 

[Enfinity]

My position has nothing to do with skill or strategy, the position has everything to do with age. James is 69 with a net worth of $4 billion. Ken is 39 this year with a net worth of $2 billion +. Compounding interest is what will create the first trillionaire.

Simons is very special mind, but the future will always bring forth an equally great mind that will build upon all of the knowledge we have today and surpass everyone of today.

Quote from Maverick74:

No way do the Griffins beat Simmons to a trillion. Although I expect Ken to get a nice bump when he eventually goes public. There are some very distinct differences between the two. Ken has been struggling of late to maintain his returns. James is just getting warmed up. I really think the world has not seen nor will see anyone like Simmons again for quite some time. The only way he fails to get to a trillion would be because of personal choice, if he walked away. I don't see that happening.

 

[Maverick74]

Quote from Enfinity:

My position has nothing to do with skill or strategy, the position has everything to do with age. James is 69 with a net worth of $4 billion. Ken is 39 this year with a net worth of $2 billion +. Compounding interest is what will create the first trillionaire.

Simons is very special mind, but the future will always bring forth an equally great mind that will build upon all of the knowledge we have today and surpass everyone of today.

I actually forgot James was 69. But, based on his returns, if he continues to double his net worth every year, he will be a trillionaire by 73!!!!!

 

[chewbacca]

un f-ing believeable. simmons does like 2-3% of daily volume on nasdaq/nyse. griffin does like 2-3% and cohen does 2-3%. so the three of them do 6-12% of all volume on the stock exchanges - unfreaking beleivable. they take our money daily, lol. i doubt any of them are going to be a trillionaire ever or even manage a trillion. there about as big as they can get, at some point people will find out what kind of strategies they are using and they will have major competion from lots of funds enter the position at same price and there will not be enough liquidity to accomodate all.

 

[MGJ]

Quote from Enfinity:... the future will always bring forth an equally great mind that will build upon all of the knowledge we have today and surpass everyone of today.[/B]

Two words: Antonio Stradivari

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antonio_Stradivari

 

[Enfinity]

Yea, none of them are in danger of having to solve the problem of effectively managing a personal fortune in the hundreds of billions of dollars. Steve Cohen generates returns just as good as Medallion and is only 51...he is a very strong candidate as well. The one issue that remains to be solved/tested in real life is managing that kind of significant wealth and achieving consistent returns in the teens. BUT:

$1 billion invested today
$1 billion reinvested each year (performance carry)
12% return
41 years = first trillionaire

Staggering figures in my opinion.

Quote from Maverick74:

I actually forgot James was 69. But, based on his returns, if he continues to double his net worth every year, he will be a trillionaire by 73!!!!!

 

[Maverick74]

Quote from Enfinity:

Yea, none of them are in danger of having to solve the problem of effectively managing a personal fortune in the hundreds of billions of dollars. Steve Cohen generates returns just as good as Medallion and is only 51...he is a very strong candidate as well. The one issue that remains to be solved/tested in real life is managing that kind of significant wealth and achieving consistent returns in the teens. BUT:

$1 billion invested today
$1 billion reinvested each year (performance carry)
12% return
41 years = first trillionaire

Staggering figures in my opinion.

BTW, Ken is looking to get into politics, possibly running for US Senate in Illinois. So that might cut into his networth some, at least he won't be making as much.