Regarding the Existence or Absence of God
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The question then becomes, what is the meaning of life? The most common answer seems to be to perpetuate the species. But what sense does that make? Pass on our unknowingness (yeah, I just invented a word) about why we exist?
So if religion gives people a "purpose", then I guess that is a good thing. Not all people can "get over it". At least apparently not. I mean religion is big business. The biggest there is.
(to use an expression....I don't mean to use the term "business" in a derogatory way. Not here anyway).
What percentage of the world's population believes in some kind of God or religion. What percentage do not?
Daniel, for me and for you, we can do without it. But apparently we are the exception. And you know what? Doesn't bother me in the least to be in the minority. And it doesn't bother me in the least that the majority has their faith. I would no more want to convert them to atheism than I would want them to try and convert me. I think that is the main problem with religion. Really the only problem. Imposing it, or being evangelical about it.
Why can't each religion just say: "Here is what we are about. If you like it, join us. If you don't, don't."
But for some reason, most (not all) religions campaign for recruits. And some make those that are not members their enemies. This intolerance is what has caused more harm than good to come from organized religion.
I have said it before: Thank God I'm an Atheist
Oh, as a side note, my wife is quite religious. But we get along anyway. I indulge her, she indulges me (very slightly), and all is well. Coexistence can work.
rs7The question then becomes, what is the meaning of life? The most common answer seems to be to perpetuate the species. But what sense does that make? Pass on our unknowingness (yeah, I just invented a word) about why we exist?
there doesn't HAVE TO be a purpose, does there? why does everyone assume that there simply somehow must be some grand purpose for us being here. I, too, would like to think there is. But if there isn't - SO WHAT! We - mankind - can invent it.
Beyond the propagation of the species - which is "life's" goal - I submit that man's happiness is his highest pursuit. His highest goal in life. You and others may dispute it, but look at the actions you take on a daily basis; are they not all geared to bringing you either more pleasure or less pain? Of course they are.
Daniel, for me and for you, we can do without it. But apparently we are the exception. And you know what? Doesn't bother me in the least to be in the minority. And it doesn't bother me in the least that the majority has their faith. I would no more want to convert them to atheism than I would want them to try and convert me. I think that is the main problem with religion. Really the only problem. Imposing it, or being evangelical about it.
Why can't each religion just say: "Here is what we are about. If you like it, join us. If you don't, don't."
rs7, i know you are not blind to the disastrous track record religion has had on mankind - and i'm not just talking wars. the pyschological damage it does. Unforgivable.
that is all a result of the religion being forced unto people. Believe me, if they stopped trying to spread their vile crap, i wouldn't say two words about it.
Purpose: To enjoy life as best as you can. Seems simple to me.
Disastrous track record: Blame the zealots. Not faith in god.
Psychological Damage: Blame the screwballs that propagate the garbage like "original sin" and use guilt to gain power. They are not the only religious leaders. Some are actually good souls. I know one cleric personally. I like him as a person. He is a big sports fan, a regular guy (except his job). We get along fine.
Spreading vile crap and forcing religion "unto" people (I like "unto"): Yeah, my main objection, like I said.
Believing in the Bible: I don't think that even the most religious people take the Bible literally. I don't think it was meant to be taken literally even by those who wrote it. It is just parables. Doesn't bother me at all.
Rs7Well, since you mention it, 'faith in god' isn't actually as much to blame as god himself.
If god is all-knowing, as christians assure us he is, he must have forseen the tremendous cruelty that would befall the world if he revealed himself to some but not others. Given that he knew it, and given that he had the power to stop it, one can only imagine that god created the situation as it is because he WANTED IT. In other words, he gets pleasure from seeing us suffer in his name.
What a prick!
I'm assuming you mean me instead of axehawk.
A woman being raped and strangled is a terrible thing.
I would never make fun of that.
What DOES bother me is when people around
her will say things like:
"Id like to thank god, for giving me the strength
to continue after this horrible event..."
etc etc, blah blah
Am I the only one who see's the irony here?
If god exists he is an evil son of a bitch, or doesnt
give a shit, or is powerless to do anything.
And dont try to bring up free will.
The Nun did not deserve that via her actions.
If I were a benevelont god, I would have saved the nun.
A person who is completely loyal to me! Gimmie a break!
You said:
"so easily torn down by one liners and criticisms "
Dark... thats all it takes. Christianity is such a weak
position its trivial to attack and poke fun of.
You ALLUDE to some great defense that you have
only spoken of to other atheists (college buddies),
but I have yet to hear it.
Put your money where your mouth is and defend
your beliefs.
I debated this for years as a christian and was utterly
destroyed in debates with free thinkers everywhere I went.
Get used to it.
I think your easily bright enough to figure this out if you were
intellectually honest and did some research.
I'm guessing the reason you are mad is that you can't
intellectually defend your position. Just a guess.
Thats why I used to get mad. No matter what I said,
I got shredded in debates.
Finally.... they got through to me... I started thinking for myself.
I became agnostic out of confusion. Then the feelings
of god started to fade as I studied more and more.
Here is a GREAT start.
Losing Faith in Faith: From Preacher to Atheist -- Dan Barker
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/t...102-9699053-6771369?v=glance&s=books&n=507846
At least read this book, then you can claim you have
read some atheist materials, if you havent already.
Finally, I lost my religion and became a free thinker.
Im happier than ever. I control my own life.
No more mystical gods in my life to confuse me.
I'm still waiting for one of these answers to all these
questions "that they (christians) have never heard of before. "
Come on dark. Give us one good explaination why
god exists, or why jesus is god. Just ONE.
No one liner... just one real good explaination that
a rational person should accept as true.
One more comment... I recommend that book as
an example of one mans journey to atheism.
He described in detail his path. It was very interesting.
But as an objective case for Atheism, there are
far better books. Some atheists tear Dan up
for his weak debating skills. But its a good starting point.
He's just a little sloppy
peace
axeman
A woman being raped and strangled is a terrible thing.
I would never make fun of that.
What DOES bother me is when people around
her will say things like:
"Id like to thank god, for giving me the strength
to continue after this horrible event..."
etc etc, blah blah
Am I the only one who see's the irony here?
If god exists he is an evil son of a bitch, or doesnt
give a shit, or is powerless to do anything.
And dont try to bring up free will.
The Nun did not deserve that via her actions.
If I were a benevelont god, I would have saved the nun.
A person who is completely loyal to me! Gimmie a break!
You said:
"so easily torn down by one liners and criticisms "
Dark... thats all it takes. Christianity is such a weak
position its trivial to attack and poke fun of.
You ALLUDE to some great defense that you have
only spoken of to other atheists (college buddies),
but I have yet to hear it.
Put your money where your mouth is and defend
your beliefs.
I debated this for years as a christian and was utterly
destroyed in debates with free thinkers everywhere I went.
Get used to it.
I think your easily bright enough to figure this out if you were
intellectually honest and did some research.
I'm guessing the reason you are mad is that you can't
intellectually defend your position. Just a guess.
Thats why I used to get mad. No matter what I said,
I got shredded in debates.
Finally.... they got through to me... I started thinking for myself.
I became agnostic out of confusion. Then the feelings
of god started to fade as I studied more and more.
Here is a GREAT start.
Losing Faith in Faith: From Preacher to Atheist -- Dan Barker
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/t...102-9699053-6771369?v=glance&s=books&n=507846
At least read this book, then you can claim you have
read some atheist materials, if you havent already.
Finally, I lost my religion and became a free thinker.
Im happier than ever. I control my own life.
No more mystical gods in my life to confuse me.
I'm still waiting for one of these answers to all these
questions "that they (christians) have never heard of before. "
Come on dark. Give us one good explaination why
god exists, or why jesus is god. Just ONE.
No one liner... just one real good explaination that
a rational person should accept as true.
One more comment... I recommend that book as
an example of one mans journey to atheism.
He described in detail his path. It was very interesting.
But as an objective case for Atheism, there are
far better books. Some atheists tear Dan up
for his weak debating skills. But its a good starting point.
He's just a little sloppy
peace
axeman
prayer [práir] (plural prayers) noun
illusion of communicating with God or other being: the act or practice of making spoken or unspoken communication with God, a deity, or a saint that does not exist
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