FredBloggs
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yea - just like your dumb posts
Refco Stiffing Its Customers
- Thread starter Cdntrader
- Start date
yea - just like your dumb posts
Ivanovich,
your question is a smart question, not a dumb question.
FDIC insurance partially protects you from collapse of an FDIC-insured financial institution holding funds deposited in your name. If OANDA acted as a fiduciary, depositing funds in your name, with an FDIC-insured institution, then you would be protected, because the money would be yours, regardless of bankruptcy by the bank or by the broker.
But this isn't what OANDA does. If, for example, you wire funds to OANDA, then OANDA deposits your money in an account styled as
OANDA segregates customer funds from its operational funds, but it fails to separate customer funds into separate accounts named for each customer. FDIC insurance will not protect you, in this situation, because the account is not in your name. FDIC does not provide any protection at all from the collapse of OANDA or any other retail spot FX broker, which fails to hold your money in a separate fiduciary account. If OANDA goes bankrupt, you can lose your entire account, and FDIC will be of no assistance whatsoever. You will have to queue up with all the other general unsecured creditors, at the end of the line in bankruptcy court, who will receive a pro rata share of cents on the dollar, in case there is any meat remaining on the bones of your broker, after the higher-priority creditors are made whole.
NOTE: I just saw some posts which might be taken to suggest that SIPC might protect accounts at retail spot FX brokers. This is not the case. SIPC only protects registered securities broker/dealers. SIPC provides absolutely no protection whatsoever, for retail spot FX accounts or futures trading accounts.
Just to add some fuel to the fire, SIPC protection is largely a myth. More of a marketing ploy than anything else.
Unlike the FDIC, the SIPC is not government backed. Rather it must rely solely on the yearly contributions from its members. At the end of last year, the SIPC only had $1.4 billion in assets, from which losses are to be paid. IB alone has more customer assets.
SIPC works only in the case of a small brokerage firm going bankrupt. The largest loss in SIPC history was a mere $80 million. Should a mid-size firm or larger go under, SIPC would be hard pressed to make up for the losses.
Asset risk is just another part of trading and life for that matter.
Read this article to learn more about the fundamental weakness of sipc..its from their own website.
http://www.sipc.org/pdf/SIPC_fitch.pdf
Unlike the FDIC, the SIPC is not government backed. Rather it must rely solely on the yearly contributions from its members. At the end of last year, the SIPC only had $1.4 billion in assets, from which losses are to be paid. IB alone has more customer assets.
SIPC works only in the case of a small brokerage firm going bankrupt. The largest loss in SIPC history was a mere $80 million. Should a mid-size firm or larger go under, SIPC would be hard pressed to make up for the losses.
Asset risk is just another part of trading and life for that matter.
Read this article to learn more about the fundamental weakness of sipc..its from their own website.
http://www.sipc.org/pdf/SIPC_fitch.pdf
Note, it looks like in Canada some FX dealers have some insurance that protects your from all this mess. REFCOFX Canadian clients aren't in trouble, it's business as usual for them.
Where is Alexander Hamilton in all this mess???
Judges/DA/Congressmen should stop studying Jefferson, and follow Hamilton's advice when making laws concerning the markets.
Market in the US are not safe!!!!
Do not invest in the US with US brokers.
The government is parternering with Refco and their fraudulent ways by allowing this environment to exist.
Where is Alexander Hamilton in all this mess???
Judges/DA/Congressmen should stop studying Jefferson, and follow Hamilton's advice when making laws concerning the markets.
Market in the US are not safe!!!!
Do not invest in the US with US brokers.
The government is parternering with Refco and their fraudulent ways by allowing this environment to exist.
I'm from Canada and this is my situation:
I originally tried to set up a FX account I believe with FXCM, whom at the time did not accept Canadian accounts, so they transfered my information to RefcoFX. All I had to do is fax RefcoFX my Canadian passport and proof of a Canadian address, which non-US account holders had to do. I funded it with my Canadian credit card. BUT...guess what?
My account was opened up as a US account NOT a RefcoFX Canadian account and I do NOT have access to my funds and probally never will.
* Canadian Address
* Canadian Passport
* Canadian Credit Card
But the dimwits at RefcoFX opened up an American account for me.
Don't believe it. This may have been sometimes true 100 years ago. Many UK judges today don't stay behind at all on the judicial corruption scale in Europe. UK judges only still 'tar and feather' in a very 'selective' manner these days.
After all, real power/repression is exerted through the judiciary. A democracy implies control of the power/repression apparatus by the people. Who exerts control over the judges in a democracy? The people?
(Parliament perhaps? )In truth, the USA is probably the only Western country where the people still have some say and kept some control over their judges and prosecutors.
Quote from nononsense:
Don't believe it. This may have been sometimes true 100 years ago. Many UK judges today don't stay behind at all on the judicial corruption scale in Europe. UK judges only still 'tar and feather' in a very 'selective' manner these days.
After all, real power/repression is exerted through the judiciary. A democracy implies control of the power/repression apparatus by the people. Who exerts control over the judges in a democracy? The people?
In truth, the USA is probably the only Western country where the people still have some say and kept some control over their judges and prosecutors.
What kind of dope are you smoking.
People in control. We lost any kind of Representation we ever had when the 17th admendment was added to our constitution.
We are like what happened to the Romans.
The people no longer have a voice in goverment. You can't get your hands on your Senator or Rep. They only care about people that can line their pockets with money, or give them a leg up.
At least before the 17th Admendement was past, you could contact your State Senator in had at one time some power over the Federal Senator. But no more.
Don't believe me?
Try to call your State Senator about a problem in the Federal Goverment. He'll tell you there is nothing he can do.
Then try to get ahold of your States Federal Senator.
He's too busy to talk to the like of you, unless you have a donation. wink, wink
Where's Apex Capital? The guy was railing against ET posters accusing them of "Slander" and other obnoxious B.S. telling everyone with a Refco account to stay in since this would blow over.
That 200 million in recent gains from selling refco stock is in his wifes name. I'll bet on it. LOL!
That 200 million in recent gains from selling refco stock is in his wifes name. I'll bet on it. LOL!
mhashe,
I would be happy to update you on the nefarious activities of Apex Capital.
Apex Capital did everything he could do disrupt a lengthy thread entitled "Refco Account Security." He posted vicious insults and false personal attacks, over and over again, especially against me, but generally against anyone who questioned his assurances that it was safe for customers to keep funds at Refco. He also repeatedly threatened me with litigation for libel. I recommend you read my two postings dated 18 Oct 2005, for some of the highlights of the thread; they are both educational and humorous. See http://elitetrader.com/vb/showthread.php?s=&postid=872126#post872126. Apex requested that the thread be closed, and then it was closed. Baron's reason for closing the thread was because of all the "off-topic" personal attacks.
A number of ET members, meanwhile, had become involved in a productive, informative, educational, invaluable, gentlemanly debate, in another thread called "Refco Fallout". Until Apex got involved. Apex then resumed and escalated his campaign of vicious and dishonest behaviour, until Baron closed that newer thread as well, again because of all the off-topic personal attacks.
I persuaded Baron that he should re-open the "Refco Fallout" thread. I argued that Baron should not empower a Refco henchman to disrupt EliteTrader discussions scrutinizing Refco and the broader issues of brokerage account security.
Apex then let loose with a full throttle, intense barrage of false accusations, one after another after another, mostly directed at me. This behaviour almost completely halted any positive aspects of the thread's discussion. One of the participants compared it to the World Wrestling Federation (WWF). I think this is exactly the result Apex Capital intended.
You folks, on this thread, all seem to be interested in civil, intelligent discussion. I would appreciate you it if all of you could take a trip over to the "Refco Fallout" thread, and read the whole thread very carefully, and look at how Apex Capital ruined a very worthwhile debate. I promise you will learn a thing or two about brokerage account security, if you do. I would appreciate it even more if you could voice some support, publicly in that thread, and privately to Baron, for the idea that Apex Capital should not be permitted to behave in this manner, and that the Refco threads are extremely important and should not be closed, but should instead be protected from Apex Capital's interference.