RealTick Order Entry

I use realtick and like trader88, I opt to display only ecns and I defaulted my MM's OES to Arca Now.

I find using selectnet slow and unreliable because MMs drag their feet to fill you.

I trade using only ecns and Arca now is pretty effective and fast. I waited quite a while before this was implemented. Before, Arca would go all ecns AND also preference the MMs and that slowed me down because I had to wait a couple secs to cancel an order,or worse the MM would fill me if the market started to shift against me.

Anyway for my setup, the only thing I have against the current OES design is all that click to buy/sell and check to short. It would be wonderful to implement a hardware solution such as a usb keypad to speed things up.

I would prefer the mouse to click on my desired bid/ask and the keypad for buy/sell/short buttons and a confirm button close to the 3 former buttons.

Another thing that can be improved is the huge bandwidth that is consumed by the timeandsales ticker on the MM window. Sometimes when JNPR, BRCM and other such stocks are really moving, I have to close the ticker so that I am not lagged. I understand that the main ticker can be set to show only trades that are above a user-defined volume level.
If the same can be implemented for the MM ticker, all I have to do is adjust the min vol and I will be able to continue to have the timeandsales window open and still have timely quotes.

This is all for me.

 
If I could add, the realtick that I use with TerraNova-MB has what I would consider a glitch, I'm not sure if other realtick users have come across but certainly I'm not alone with at least 2 to 3 TerraNova-MB realtick users.

What happens is that when any symbol is loaded onto the MM window, you get the quotes for bid/ask. The quotes are updated as participants change them realtime. Sometimes the best ask or bid gets stuck there and it remains there for the whole trading day. I've got the time/secs for quote enabled so you see this stuck quote that was posted say 11.20.45am and its already 12.20pm but the quote is still stuck there even when it has already been hit and is no longer valid. Then I have to report this to my chatroom and the staff will remove it but it takes a good 20 mins to be done. Dunno why.

But it is for me very distracting when you are so concentrated at the 2-3 best ask/bid and you are ambivalent if that quote is really valid or actually stuck. I just can't fire my order with confidence because stuck quotes are quite frequent.

This may not affect other realtick users but I am sure afflicted by it.

Anyone?
 
Eastboy talks about the stuck quote problem with
Realtick. Let me come at this from a different angle
and confirm what he's saying.

Cybercorp has the identical problem with identical
symptoms and an identical cure (read: waste your
trading time to bitch to a customer svc rep who
-might- then correct the problem half an hour later).

I agree that order entry is done horribly badly by
most existing trading apps. I've used Realtick and
not liked it. I use Cyber now and don't like it.

It really does seem as though most of this software
is designed and laid out by nerds who do not themselves
trade on a daily basis.

A few months back, I had a conversation with a Cyber
employee with whom I was saying "having to move the
mouse this much is inefficient and wastes precious
seconds", to which his response was basically, "Gee,
I don't have any trouble moving the mouse."

Of course, neither do I, but I am TRADING in an
environment where quarter-seconds matter, whereas he's
slowly generating source code over hours or days. Sheesh.
Effing Cyber.

Still looking for alternatives to these guys. If
Townsend makes these USB changes they're talking up,
that could be very promising.

Doc

--




 
Eastboy,

Thanks for the feedback. I think that your complaints with the MM-OES are addressed by the improvement proposals. If you want to check it out, send me a note at the email address listed in my 3/24 post above and I'll send you the info. Let me know what you think.

Regarding bandwidth consumption and lagging quotes, the problem is more likely due to high CPU utilization rather than a lack of bandwidth capacity. Depending on your page setup (# of client conversations, # MM windows, etc.), high trade-rate stocks like JNPR and CIEN will at busy times cause 80-100% CPU utilization, and at very busy times can sometimes hold the CPU at 100% for minutes. During these events, data and commands are delayed or worse until the CPU load is eased. RealTick is actually very bandwidth conservative (compared to say eSignal). Try a CPU and bandwidth meter to identify which is the bottleneck.

To work around stuck quotes without program shutdown and restart, I'm proposing a "White-out" feature that functions similar to "Monitor": Right-click on stuck quote for menu that includes item "Block Quote"; click on "Block Quote" and the stuck quote line color and text goes solid white. The stuck quote is now just a white bar. Don't know if this can be developed into the product, but it is proposed.


Doc,

Send me an email address and I'll send you the proposed MM-OES and keypad information. I'd be interested in your comments.
 
Lancer,

I do monitor both my cpu usage and also my bandwidth. I will know if either becomes the bottleneck for a given situation.

I am saying that the MM window's timeandsales is the worst consumer of both bandwidth and cpu usage. This is because the MMtimeandsales window has to report EACH and EVERY trade that occurs and that includes all sizes from 100 to 10000 or more. With crazy stocks, the MMtimeandsales window starts zipping like a mad cat and frankly you can't see anything because it is too fast for reading.

And by implementing a minimum size of trade to show(adjustable by realtick user), you may control the speed of the MMtimeandsalesticker. User increasing the min size of trade to show to say 5000 shares, will only allow trades of size 5000 or more to be shown. This is VERY useful for crazy stocks like JNPR. The MMtimeandsalesticker then slows down considerably so that it is more intelligible. This also reduces bandwidth AND cpu usage considerably (how much depends on how high you set this min size of trade to show in the MMtimeandsalesticker).

All of us have a limited bandwidth with our ISP and we are bound by the speed of a single x86 cpu. We can go with the best Tier 1 ISP and match the same backbone as the broker's servers. We can go for a 1.33Ghz AMD Athlon for fastest processing available. We would of course like to increase the amount of data available on our monitors. But there is a limit to how much we can see due either to bandwidth or cpu limitations.

But what we can do also is to reduce the bandwidth consumed by unnecessary/unintelligible data. And the bandwidth and cpu usage saved can be used for opening more charts and minders.

I have done a lot of experiments and I can safely conclude that the MM's Timeandsalesticker is the culprit for hogging MOST bandwidth and cpu usage.

Townsend Analytics have already implemented this min size of trade to show in the general ticker. But they have forgotten to implement it for the MM's timeandsalesticker.

Doc and Lancer,

Dead quotes have been around since 4-6 months ago. They still have not solved the problem. Blocking it out or removing it done by realtick user is only a palliative solution. Townsend will have to work to find out the root of the problem which is the cause of all these dead quotes.

I don't mind having to remove the dead quote myself by right clicking then choosing Remove, as an interim solution. But I do not want to ask my chatroom to remove it because they take a good 20 mins to do it. I will click and remove it myself. And meanwhile Townsend can look for the causative root of the problem.

Sorry for bitching so much but who wants to click on a dead quote? who wants bandwidth hogup or cpu lockup when you are trading? We are trading with real money here. I want to lose money only to MY bad trade and not to the technical glitches of my trading platform.
 
ArchAngel are you there?

I read in a post somewhere that you are going to get a touch screen LCD and place your OES there.

Have you done that yet? If you have, how is it going?

I'm another Realtick user. Realtick is great, it just needs a little refining as you can read from the posts of this tread.
 

If Realtick, Cybercorp or even Blackwood Trading would just provide an Order Entry API then all of us would be developing unique solutions to fit our own trading needs.

MGB
 
Lancer,

I have learned some interesting things which may help solve your problems with RealTick. In the soon to be released build there are some new Order Entry capabilities which work in line with your USD keypad you have proposed. Apparently, there are new Hot Keys which use the 'Alt' button. These new Hot Keys work in conjunction with the Order View. Rather than setting an entire order parameter like the original Hot Keys, these Hot Keys will allow you to set parts of the order such as route, order type etc. to meet the needs on an order by order basis. The parameters not specified in the Hot Key will come from the active order view. The Hot Keys do not have to actually place the order, although they could if so desired.

E.G. Market Maker shows offer which the user wants to lift. Pre-defined Hot Keys are set as such: Alt-A sets ARCA route, Alt-I sets Island route. To buy on ARCA, you press Alt-A, and then click on the buy button. Or, Alt-A could be set up as "Buy on ARCA", in which case only one keystroke is needed to place the order.

This seems similar to what you have been discussing. I have not had an opportunity to use this function, so I cannot comment on it any more than that. Hopefully, we will all be able to offer suggestions when this new release is out.

Steve
 
slarson:

Yes, what a misguided attempt. There also might be an Alt-B for Buy, Alt-S for Sell, and Alt-C for Cancel. And in a fast trading environment, if you have some kind of alien extremity like a wrist with two hands, 6" fingers and an eyeball, these new hotkeys can be operated.

My feedback on this was very negative. If Alt-<key> is used, I suggested that the keys be placed together in an ergonomic arrangement per user-assignment instead of fixed by alphabetic association and spread all over the keyboard. What TAL needs are software designers that actually trade every day. If TAL design staff actually had to use their own product to make a living, I guarantee there would be some changes. These Alt-hotkeys do nothing to improve the situation.

Thankfully, this half-baked Alt-<key> idea is a 7.2 feature. The big order-entry interface overhaul is planned for 7.3 (June release). That is where I'm putting my product improvement efforts.

If you want to review and comment on the MM-OES and keypad I'm proposing, send me an email and I'll get you graphics and descriptions. I'd appreciate your opinion.


RealTick users, we need to let our voice be heard. V7.3 is our chance to finally get what WE want in an order-entry interface. Remain silent and you'll get more half-measures like Alt-hotkeys.


Eastboy and MGB: Got your comments also. Thanks.
 
Lancer,

There may be some misunderstanding. From my discussions with my contact the 'Alt' keys will be user defined, and in essence a big step closer to what you are working on.

I wonder if you could possibly have an ergonomic setup with the number pad? Don't know, but we will find out with 7.2 release.

Steve
 
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