I agree with this...you have to endeavor to be extremely successful...
I now tell myself: "Don't FEAR success!"
Realistic returns expectations of successful day trading
- Thread starter helpme_please
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I agree with this...you have to endeavor to be extremely successful...
I now tell myself: "Don't FEAR success!"
Make it or Fail, some times, you've just got to say damn it and TRY!!
Looks silly now for sure - but it was well before he claimed a long call position benefits from time decay.
Why should you feel that way? Keep an open mind, the post should be judged on its own merits and logics, irregardless of who authored it.
That sure is really retarded, you would need at least 200% gains to cover basic living expenses. That would be so stressful! Not counting that you can easily day trade early mornings(london session) with a steady strat or go for higher time frames. Quitting your job to trade should only be done if you already have the cash/income stream to retire. Compound interests is the only reason that trading is worth it IMO. Why sacrifice that by making your trading your only source of income?(unless you have a ton of money already of course)
RaVar is also right in the sense that the big money and the real game is in managing other people's money. My uncle is a very successful CTA, I don't know how much AUM he has, but it is a lot. He is a millionnaire many many times over. What does he do? Maintains a good relationship with his clients and make a low annual ROI in the bond and stock market. He gets a % of the assets he manages(well above a million/year) and he trades in a virtually riskless environnement. He gets good intel from the bank he is affiliated with and he cruises his way to a fat pay check every year. His annual ROI might only be 5% but he makes a ton of money with no risk.
On the other hand you get guys who multiply a few hundred thousands every year, but the work and the risk they put in takes a toll on their health. Not only that but it takes such a unique type of personality to succeed as a retail trader that you get an abysmal success rate. Think of all the trader who lost their shirt but who could have become great CTAs.
Trading is unique as an industry in the sense that on average you will make more working for others than you will working for yourself. I think that looking at it from a annual % return is the origin of the fallacy which states that trading your own money is the best avenue in trading.
Depends on your perspective and mentality. When you trade your own money, you many not make that much starting out, but as you build the account up and become consistently profitable there is nothing better than getting 100% of what you make and only paying 20% Federal taxes on it. You also never have to report to anyone, never have to worry about job security, or worry about some other rogue profit center blowing out the firm you work for. Not to mention having to share or give up the IP or strategy you created to the firm who hired you, question your discretionary bonus (which is never enough), or deal with the stupid non-compete clause if you ever decide to abruptly leave.
Sure, when working for a big prop group, hedge fund or bank, the cushy draw/salary, structured environment, nice benefits, no downside risk, no money you need to put up, and unlimited capital to trade with is a nice privilege and existence with much less stress, and as close to a free lunch as you can get. But in the end you are just another employee that may have to kiss someone's ass to try and get ahead, with always the possiblity of getting fired without warning,
It takes brass balls, chutzpah, and supreme confidence to back yourself and build your own trading empire. And in the end it's totally worth it because you can make your own hours, keep your IP, call all the shots, keep everything you make, and never have to answer to anybody.
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Yeah I am building my own thing too. I just understand why RaVar and other professionals laugh at a X00% return on a 100 000$ account since it is nothing $ wise compared to what they can pull with a single digit return on their AUM.
My uncle kind of built his own thing too, all if his clients are his only and he got them over the years. He's in a partnership with the bank, he can tell them to fuck off and start another partnership with another bank the next day.
Best thing if you figure it out early on IMO is to start trading in college, get a job as a money manager, build your style and portfolio while trading on the side(with the good money you are making). When you have a couple millions, however long it takes you can either start your own thing with clients or just trade your own money. By that point you don't need to take any substantial risk.
But yeah building it all from scratch is very attractive and exciting. As long as you keep your expectation in check and strive to become the best trader you can be.
The best returns sustainable are 200%++ per year. How do I know this? BNF took 16k and traded it to 200 million in 10 years. Using CAGR forumula (200,000,000/16,000)^(1/10) = 2.56. Which means he made 256% each year compounded for 10 years. I have researched
what the best traders make and its all around in the region. Although, theoretically with a smaller account you can make much more and it gets harder and harder to make more in % terms when it gets bigger and bigger. But keep in mind with a larger capital you can make lesser % but make more in terms of dollar value.
If on a small account 1000%++ in one year is achievable although not easy. Dan Zanger had a verified 29,233% world record return in 1 year during the dotcom bull run and its probably the highest return that is believable.
what the best traders make and its all around in the region. Although, theoretically with a smaller account you can make much more and it gets harder and harder to make more in % terms when it gets bigger and bigger. But keep in mind with a larger capital you can make lesser % but make more in terms of dollar value.
If on a small account 1000%++ in one year is achievable although not easy. Dan Zanger had a verified 29,233% world record return in 1 year during the dotcom bull run and its probably the highest return that is believable.