Realistic returns expectations of successful day trading

[easymon1]

a realistic return to be expected

mr helpme_please

Understanding the "Expectancy" of your Trading System

Here is a video made by a great guy who has taken the time to
answer That Very Question.

(Stevo also earned the number one rating in Timers Digest
multiple times for multiple products, sp500, gold, bonds me thinks.
Rules and Regs of the contest are in writing and so must be the
recommendations BEFORE the Fact for each and every trade.
It is pretty stringent.

He will even take your phone call or email on his show, daily
1 PM EST
877-927-6648
.
Always friendly and L O V E S to Take Your Calls.

So, Grab a cuppa joe, friend. Turn off that phone, settle in, be still and know.

Understanding the "Expectancy" of your Trading System

 

[bbpp]

You can use whatever leverage you want up to the margin requirements of the contract.

I mentioned "200 lots" as a size one could negotiate the bid/ask DOM with minimal slippage.

You could do a 1000 lot trade ($150MM notional) right now with only about 1/2 point slippage on the entire trade.

1/2 point is a great pain. You are cut both on entry and exit, so every trade you lost 1 point already.

 

[smallfil]

So called gurus like Timothy Sykes or Ross Cameron cannot be making over 500% gains yearly because, if they were, they would not bother teaching students how to trade for a couple of thousands a piece? That is how they make their monies now! If you charge a student $3,000 x 100 students is $3,000,000, they can have even just 25 students and make a decent amount each year before taxes. If you had a trading system able to generate 500% gains yearly, you would not be sharing it but, keep trading it for those huge profits! You will be a billionaire in a short period of time! The best hedge funds with top traders managing the monies make around 20% per year on average and have losing years once, in a while. Think the so called day trading gurus can do better? I highly, doubt it!

 

[Scataphagos]

1/2 point is a great pain. You are cut both on entry and exit, so every trade you lost 1 point already.

True but that almost always goes with "size" to some degree. (Often when we say "point" we mean percent. But a 1/2 point slip in the ES is only .0166%. of the notional value.) That's what the DOM is revealing at this time. I've seen other times where there were >1000 bid/offered at each price for 10 or more prices on the DOM. In those times, you could do a 1000-2000 lot with virtually zero slip.

 

[rallymode]

Often, I will hear about successful day traders on seminars or videos saying that it is possible to make consistent 20-50% gain a year regardless of market conditions, bull or bear on an account size of around USD100k.

I would like to ask the professional day traders here. Is this a realistic return to be expected? What are some reasonable returns to expect? I can't gauge because I'm not a day trader.

20-50% on accounts up to a mil or two is very reasonable and unless you can make at least that you shouldn't even bother with trading and pursue a career with more stability.

 

[rallymode]

This is not only uncommon but not a healthy goal.

Not necessarily. It's not about how much you have in the account but how much capital you have overall. If you are willing to recapitalize the account there is nothing wrong with shooting for 500-1000%. Keeping as little in your account as possible is the prudent thing to do. If my stuff can do 100% on 10-15% draws it would behoove me to cut my account in half and shoot for 500%. Nothing like this scales so you will need to wire out constantly in which case recapitalization is a nonissue.

 

[Scataphagos]

Not necessarily. It's not about how much you have in the account but how much capital you have overall. If you are willing to recapitalize the account there is nothing wrong with shooting for 500-1000%. Keeping as little in your account as possible is the prudent thing to do.

Uh, no. What you have in your "trading account" is not relevant. What percentage of your CAPITAL account is what matters. Example.... If my "trading account" goes from $10K to $20K, I've added "100%". Whoopie! But if my CAPITAL is $100K, I've added only 10% to my capital. Nothing wrong with that, but it ain't "whoopie".

 

[rallymode]

Uh, no. What you have in your "trading account" is not relevant. What percentage of your CAPITAL account is what matters. Example.... If my "trading account" goes from $10K to $20K, I've added "100%". Whoopie! But if my CAPITAL is $100K, I've added only 10% to my capital. Nothing wrong with that, but it ain't "whoopie".

ugh, that's just gibberish. The OP is talking about an account size not capital. Yes, a nuance, i agree.

 

[Scataphagos]

ugh, that's just gibberish. The OP is talking about an account size not capital. Yes, a nuance, i agree.

Like I said. "Account size" isn't relevant (unless your capital is your trading account). The ONLY thing that matters in trading is the total return on your capital... that and capital preservation, of course.

 

[gkishot]

Breaking even would be a good start.