I wish you would talk about this more. You are the first one who turned me on to the difference between free movement of goods, but not the people who make them. It's almost like every country now has there own stable of labor. And no matter what, they can't leave and go to another country that gives them a better deal.
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Rationality: it can happen
- Thread starter rangetrader2012
- Start date
Quote from oldtime:
I wish you would talk about this more.
If I told a story that started with "Once upon a time..." and included a few very rich, titled people who lived really luxurious lives, who had the freedom to move goods around and the power to restrict movement of people, it would be immediately recognized for what it is - feudalism.
But somehow changing the titles from "Lord" to "CEO" and from "fiefdom" to "country" apparently completely befuddles peoples minds, and suddenly the exact same situation is viewed as "free trade".
Quote from Random.Capital:
If I told a story that started with "Once upon a time..." and included a few very rich, titled people who lived really luxurious lives, who had the freedom to move goods around and the power to restrict movement of people, it would be immediately recognized for what it is - feudalism.
But somehow changing the titles from "Lord" to "CEO" and from "fiefdom" to "country" apparently completely befuddles peoples minds, and suddenly the exact same situation is viewed as "free trade".
Even in the US, something like 75% of people live within 15 miles of where they were born. I hardly think that is the result of some kind of neo-feudalism as represented by laws on crossing national borders. It's a result of the fact that people are lazy.
Do you really think that people are going to move en masse to follow production facilities wherever they may be located? Autoworkers would move from Ohio to Mexico or China? Heck, most of them didn't even move from Ohio to Alabama when production shifted south. And, if they had, guess what? There were already people in Alabama ready to do those jobs, so the autoworker from Ohio would probably have been lucky to get a job in an Alabama plant, never mind a Mexican or Chinese one, where there are not only people already willing to to do work, but they also speak the language.
So, it's not that what you are saying is "befuddling", it's "irrelevant".
Quote from rangetrader2012:
Only 2 countries had a majority of people supporting Romney: Pakistan and Israel. Both countries are extreme in their own way, so we should not be surprised.
But all decent, civilized countries on the planet backed Obama.
As a Hispanic, I made sure that I and all my friends voted Obama. Romney was an extremist nutter and now that we have finished him off, he should consider "self-deporting".
America is more than the lunatic peoples of the Bible Belt, and the result of this important election sent that message to those Bible Belt white trash with KKK tendencies.
I assume that this post belongs here, since rationality is a psychological phenomenon
I agree........although this post would best go under "abnormal psychology".
keep talking man, I like it. What is that corporation over in China, Foxconn? That makes the i phones. So the workers don't like it and decide they want to move to Iowa. How does that deal work out?Quote from Random.Capital:
If I told a story that started with "Once upon a time..." and included a few very rich, titled people who lived really luxurious lives, who had the freedom to move goods around and the power to restrict movement of people, it would be immediately recognized for what it is - feudalism.
But somehow changing the titles from "Lord" to "CEO" and from "fiefdom" to "country" apparently completely befuddles peoples minds, and suddenly the exact same situation is viewed as "free trade".
Quote from logic_man:
Automation has destroyed more manufacturing jobs than have been shipped overseas from the US. I'm even automating my trading, so I can go back to work doing other things.
F^&k yes.. Karl Marx is correct; The guy with the machines makes the money!! Jobs are going to illegals, automation is doing more and more of the work every day... WIN stands for Work Is Nonprofit!! We have two classes of people nowadays, those that profit from the machines and those that collect welfare. Personally, I'm doing a lot of computer programming, it beats candlelight vigils. Hmm.. actually those candlelight vigils and environment protests are where really undesirably nerdy guys can hook up with really good looking airhead women.. I might be able to squeeze a vigil or two into my busy schedule...
Quote from maxpi:
F^&k yes.. Karl Marx is correct; The guy with the machines makes the money!! Jobs are going to illegals, automation is doing more and more of the work every day... WIN stands for Work Is Nonprofit!! We have two classes of people nowadays, those that profit from the machines and those that collect welfare. Personally, I'm doing a lot of computer programming, it beats candlelight vigils. Hmm.. actually those candlelight vigils and environment protests are where really undesirably nerdy guys can hook up with really good looking airhead women.. I might be able to squeeze a vigil or two into my busy schedule...
Yep, capital won and (most) labor lost. When I work, I work in corporate strategy, supporting C-suite decision-making. That type of labor will be the last to be automated because it requires higher-level thinking and computers just aren't there yet. But, at some point, even my type of job will be automated. Fortunately, my trading algorithm will never be obsolete, so I can always depend on income from that source.
Quote from logic_man:
Capital deepening is an even greater reason. Automation has destroyed more manufacturing jobs than have been shipped overseas from the US. I'm even automating my trading, so I can go back to work doing other things.
if that is the case, why is everything made in china nowadays??? if automation is so widespread, why aren't more things made in the USA by robots??? still think labor cost arb is more profitable than automation.
Quote from ssrrkk:
if that is the case, why is everything made in china nowadays??? if automation is so widespread, why aren't more things made in the USA by robots??? still think labor cost arb is more profitable than automation.
Dude, it's not an either/or. It's both.
The things that went over to China were the sorts of things that could not be made by robots at the time. Believe me, there are going to be millions of unemployed Chinese as the next generation of robots gets rolled out.
A single robot than can replace 20 workers is going to be worth the investment, regardless of whether they are Chinese or not.
From where I sit at the top of the labor food chain, all I see is opportunities to put dumber people out of work.
Quote from rangetrader2012:
Only 2 countries had a majority of people supporting Romney: Pakistan and Israel. Both countries are extreme in their own way, so we should not be surprised.
But all decent, civilized countries on the planet backed Obama.
As a Hispanic, I made sure that I and all my friends voted Obama. Romney was an extremist nutter and now that we have finished him off, he should consider "self-deporting".
America is more than the lunatic peoples of the Bible Belt, and the result of this important election sent that message to those Bible Belt white trash with KKK tendencies.
I assume that this post belongs here, since rationality is a psychological phenomenon
Aha, but it wasn't just against the white trash KKK folks now was it. It is pretty much against whites in general, which is were the problem lies. It's an us against them mentality which can split this country right down the center. There can be no super-power USA if this happens.