raising funds

Quote from heech:
Is this the source of your confusion? You think this person, whoever he is, is being funded because he "projected something like 10% for a month"?

I can guarantee you no remotely sophisticated investor will EVER select an investment believing a projection of "10% a month". However, the amazing thing about mechanical strategies is that they CAN to, some degree, be back-tested using historical data. All of a sudden, you end up with something that at least resembles 3-5 years of historical performance data... That's something you assert you can't do. The difference between your situation and his situation is truly night and day.

And when you keep talking about 200-300% annual returns (or 6-15% monthly) being remotely possible, you're really just showing lack of maturity in this industry, which any sophisticated investor will immediately pickup as a huge red flag. It's as if my doctor promised me he could cure cancer by sacrificing farm animals... I would label him a quack and move on. I could care less about hearing more about his "talents".
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So many replies ignore what I typed. It's interesting but frustrating. No, that is not "the source" it is "one reason", like I already said. The person was selected for the projections, the backtesting and talking a good talk, like I said.

One unanswered question still: what is a discretionary trader to do? Is the answer that to get money, even a very small amount, one HAS to be a mechanical trader?

The only people who keep talking about those returns YOU GUYS! PLEASE STOP! I am the one saying IT CANNOT BE SUSTAINED BUT IT IS WHAT IT IS! Wow. Pardon me for being frustrated but what do you expect? I don't know what the returns will eventually be, but there are traders out there who make huge returns, it is possible. They are the 1% not the 99%, pun intended. Don't blame me for things that aren't my fault! I can't help the returns I'm getting and show maturity by continuously recognizing they have no likelihood of continuing. Please folks, it is very very frustrating. Your analogy about the doctor is ludicrous and makes no sense, although I think I know what you are getting at, it's still based on ignoring what I said and insisting on your own skewed version.
 
Quote from FrankSlaughtery:

if you're making high absolute returns everyone else can f*ck off there is no need for investors
if you're making lower returns and need investors, you need to cater to their wants such as looking at the backtests results in detail as other posters said.
no one will give you a penny based on a few months hypothetical performance. the poster who said you should save up money and trade for 3 years was dead on.
promising high absolute returns to investors, esp based on small sample size, is asking to get laughed out of the room and not get your parking validated. they will immediately say to you "if you're making such high absolute returns why do you need my money?"
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Again it is ignoring the issue: where to get the initial $100k? There is at least a need for an investor for that, and that ASSUMES the mega high ROI continues which I am NOT doing but am continuously accused of doing so. This is one reason why I hesitated to post in the first place. If I'm making lower returns and need investors, what is a discretionary trader to do? The solution to work for 3 years is only said out of frustration, not because it is an actual solution. I suggested there's an opportunity to provide a real solution and asked who the vested interested parties would be. No answer, ignored again. The answer to your last question about why need money with high returns has been answered so many times in this thread. You are not fully going in circles, but kinda. Semi circles. :D
 
Quote from Martinghoul:

The keyword here, traderwann, is that this is a "story"...

I agree with pretty much everything that heech has said. Like heech, for purposes of this thread, I fall into a category of people that could, in theory, be a potential investor. But, as I keep trying to tell you, I wouldn't touch anything like what you describe with a 10ft bargepole. And, please, don't take it personally, as it's got nothing to do with you. You appear to be a smart and capable guy, but, believe you me, that means next to nothing in the mkt. So, again, I wish you the best of luck.
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What the h**k?! I said right in that post it is NOT a story. It is real. It actually happened. Ignored again! Is it a conspiracy if it is actually happening? lol

Martin -- what do you need from a discretionary trader then? Let me guess, you need years of live results. Ok. How do I get that? Around and around we go. It seems like you ENJOY telling someone you wouldn't touch them instead of enjoying coming up with solutions. I prefer solutions. I try. No one else here does, they prefer to shut things down. No progress. Lost opportunity. Etc. It's quite sad. Perhaps the way I think may lead to the results I'm getting?
 
Quote from Swan Noir:

If you really believe in your system you need to leverage the trust that friends and family already have in you. The other posters are correct when they say no one with sophistication will back you. Take another six months at least and see if you can continue to produce those returns with acceptable risk. If so get backed by those who already have respect for your character and ability.

All of that said, you must understand that your bet is much larger than theirs. Most of these systems blow up at some point and those nearest and dearest to you will, in that circumstance, take losses. And if they take those losses you will then get to see their character. Have the rope, a chair and a sturdy place to rig from because once you lose even a small amount of their cash most people will simply aggravate you to the point where suicide is preferable to hearing a snide remark even one more time.

REALITY 101 ...
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Thank you for your post. Unfortunately what you are saying is that I must take advantage of my friends and family because anyone intelligent who knows what they are doing would never do it. Did you realize that? I'm not here to take advantage of anyone. If it is a solid offer to friends and family then it is even more solid to someone with experience, intellectual resources and greater capital resources.
 
Quote from traderwann:

Again it is ignoring the issue: where to get the initial $100k? There is at least a need for an investor for that, and that ASSUMES the mega high ROI continues which I am NOT doing but am continuously accused of doing so. This is one reason why I hesitated to post in the first place. If I'm making lower returns and need investors, what is a discretionary trader to do? The solution to work for 3 years is only said out of frustration, not because it is an actual solution. I suggested there's an opportunity to provide a real solution and asked who the vested interested parties would be. No answer, ignored again. The answer to your last question about why need money with high returns has been answered so many times in this thread. You are not fully going in circles, but kinda. Semi circles. :D
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The only reason I'm still posting in this thread is because this last post literally made me laugh out loud. Why the heck do you think the 3 year solution was said "out of frustration"?

If I was a betting man, I'd say 50/50 odds you're under the age of 25. So, I suspect no matter what I say here... you're just not going to "get it" until the real world slaps you in the face a few times.

Why the sense of entitlement? Why do you think there's a magical solution for "getting" $100k? Wake up man, there's no fairy godmother out there. What literally everyone has been saying is: it doesn't happen. Period. No way. Short of winning the lottery (or meeting Mrs. Robinson), you're not going to get $100k because you think you have discretionary trading "talent", and have 2 good simulated months.

If my best friend in the world (or worse, my brother in law) asked me for advice, and was in your shoes.. I'd tell him exactly what I told you: go work for 3 years, save up $20k, and trade it (very) successfully. That's the real world.

After all... how do you get to Carnegie Hall? Practice, practice, practice!
 
Why do you need an outside investor? Save $5k and go trade at a prop firm, if you are consistent they give you more leverage....you'll be at $100k BP quick, with consistent results.
 
Quote from heech:
The only reason I'm still posting in this thread is because this last post literally made me laugh out loud. Why the heck do you think the 3 year solution was said "out of frustration"?
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For exactly like I said, it's not an actual solution, it's out of frustration for being stuck. The point is to find a solution. I tried. I suggested something. I said that was ignored. Now you ignored my saying it was ignored. If what I suggest can't work, why? How to mold it? In what direction? What are the obstacles? Just saying, there's ALWAYS a solution, just a matter of finding it.
If I was a betting man, I'd say 50/50 odds you're under the age of 25. So, I suspect no matter what I say here... you're just not going to "get it" until the real world slaps you in the face a few times.
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Perhaps this statement tips off how you think vs. how I think. Age is irrelevant, I could be 14 and uber-precocious. That would be just as rare as being 41 and achieving the results I have so far. What is relevant is primarily what one says, how they say it, what is said to justify their statement/argument, and results. I keep asking tell me what I can do, the answer is there's nothing you can do, so I try to come up with a solution. That is apparently BAD. Mindless zombie says doing as you are told and maintaining status quo is GOOD. I do what zombie says. Creative no think independant I. Sigh. Sorry, I'm frustrated and don't know how else to make the point.

Why the sense of entitlement? Why do you think there's a magical solution for "getting" $100k? Wake up man, there's no fairy godmother out there. What literally everyone has been saying is: it doesn't happen. Period. No way. Short of winning the lottery (or meeting Mrs. Robinson), you're not going to get $100k because you think you have discretionary trading "talent", and have 2 good simulated months.
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Entitlement? WOW. That blows my mind. Finding solutions is being entitled? Trying to change the status quo is being entitled? Wait, I'm on candid-message board and you're playing George Orwell to pull my leg right? I guess believing in a free market vs a controlled market is being entitled as well by your logic. Wow. Just WOW. I have no words. I don't think there's a magical solution, but there's always a solution unless everyone ignores anyone trying to find a solution. That makes it difficult for the one doing the solution thinking and finding. How do you benefit by stomping that out? I asked about a realistic one, by not addressing that you accomplished what? There's a HUGE gap between what is apparently available to mechanical traders and what you say is available to discretionary traders. Does nature abhor a vacuum? Does a free market abhor a vacuum? There's a grand canyon of a vacuum to fill there! WOW. Just bloody WOW. How can else can I explain? Are you anti free market or why else do you keep ignoring this fact and anytime I ask about how to solve it? It's like you benefit from the status quo, if you don't, why do you act like you do? There's a contradiction, sorry, don't shoot me for pointing it out ... I'm afraid that seems to be the preferred solution.

Whether what you say to me is the same as you'd say to your brother or BFF ... it's about as irrlevant as the age thing. If you maintain the status quo and benefit from it and are willing to stomp on someone close to you to achieve it, that's up to you. I would not choose that. I would not choose what you do here either, but clearly we don't think similarly.

I'm sorry for repeating myself and having to go to this length, but I am not responsible for other people's choices and actions. Please don't put their contradictions on me. I can only point out what doesn't make sense by asking questions as I have here.
 
Quote from swag:
Why do you need an outside investor? Save $5k and go trade at a prop firm, if you are consistent they give you more leverage....you'll be at $100k BP quick, with consistent results.
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To be entirely honest, it's hard for me to answer because I don't know that much about prop firms. I have some reservations, but without more info I'd be assuming.
 
Here's something new:

A hypothetical mechanical and discretionary strategy, both are similar with good results, decent ratios and other measures. Any faults can be traced to one aspect. Just over half the trades go in the wrong direction about 2 or 3 times the expected profit, sometimes the profit is higher than expected as well but not always. There is no identifiable pattern so not possible to reverse or change without affecting rest of strategy. Most trades end up positive or close to it, and the rest take care of themselves. There are few losing days but when they come they can be 5 times the average daily profit. On a monthly basis this leaves the worst months around break even or small loss.

What is the advice and would it differ for mechanical vs discretionary? Is this an alarm bell issue or is it somewhat normal or is it even a problem?
 
Quote from traderwann:

To be entirely honest, it's hard for me to answer because I don't know that much about prop firms. I have some reservations, but without more info I'd be assuming.
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Seriously, a prop firm is your best ticket to $100k and beyond, if you are good. There's a whole forum on this website dedicated to prop firms, including websites/contact people, get started reading/researching/calling up firms there, rather than run around in circles in this thread. There are lot of scams too so do your due diligence for the reputable firms.

Again, if you want a ticket to the big show and have faith in yourself and your strategies, I'd say prop is the way to go, rather than hope for a high net worth individual to put some faith in you. Go prop with a couple thousand, prove that your strategies are legit, and BECOME the HNWI :)

Also, with your trading record from your prop firm showing consistent profitability, it would be that much easier to attract some capital, IMO.
 
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