Quitting Trading

[jsmith]

Quote from aeliodon:
As far as OP goes, dude haven't you lost enough: your life savings, 2 girlfriends, your family's respect. If 8 years of suffering isn't enough then maybe it'll take 16 years of losses, and bankruptcy, and homelessness to wake you up. You're obviously not sick and tired of losing, otherwise you would stop it already - either by quiting or by developing a rock solid discipline on a real edge.

I was in your shoes once years ago and I had to really hit rock bottom for me to get serious.

I would have to agree with aeliodon. Sorry to be harsh but you need to be more serious if you want to succeed or just quit trading.

You said you read Trading in the Zone many times yet you still can't follow the simple exercise at the end of the book.

Keep losing until you decide you can't lose anymore... or you quit trading...

 

[sg20]

After eight years and you are still not making money, for me I would have quit trading all together after 2 years. You need to stop trading completely and just look at the charts until you can figured out how the market moves; the goal is to learn to capture those moves any way you can, and I mean any way possible… If you haven’t been able to come up with a feasible plan then you should move on to other markets until you can find one that is tradable; and how you make it depends on your ability to read the market not by reacting to the movements and always stay with the main trend if you can find one. Good luck to you.

sg20

 

[Rahula]

Quote from nitro:


Imagine that when you were born, your survival depended on you being able to walk and talk from the get go. The reason we survive is that we have parents that give us the time to learn to walk and talk without having to worry about anything else. Plus, they mentor us with infinite patience.

This is one of the most important points ever made on ET. Trading alone is always dangerous because (1) no one is there to hold your accountable for reckless trading and (2) no one is there to encourage you to maintain discipline during drawdowns when you have the urge to abandon your discipline in order to "get even."

I highly doubt Steve Cohen, Paul Tudor Jones, Soros, or any of the other great traders can perform as well as they do if they had to trade alone.

Quote from nitro:


PS Your trading "experience" may actually be detrimental to finding a job at a trading firm. You may find no wants to hire you when they learn that you have traded before. That may seem counter-intuitive, but it isn't and one day you may understand. Many firms want a clean slate, a "nimrod" if you will. FYI. Do what you will with that information.

Yes, trading 'virgins' are a lot easier to teach because all they have to do is learn and not unlearn years of bad habits and wrong convictions.

But a trading 'virgin' lacks: the hunger, passion, and "made every mistake 100 times" experience that an experienced but failed trader has.

 

[youngtrader]

To the OP (if he is still paying attention to this thread).

True I am only 17 years old but I feel that I can add some value to this thread.

This thread really got to me. As my dad is in his mid fifties and a fairly successful trader.

First forget about day trading. It imo is for only the best of the best. There is just so many decisions a person has to make when trading intra day that it can be a bit overwhelming. Believe me by quitting day trading you will be taking the first step towards success (you can go back to it later if you want to). Now this doesn't mean that you have to stop trading......instead subscribe to moore research and only look at trades that are 100% trades out of 15 years. After you have located these 100% trades check the fundamentals of that particular market, then check out the daily chart. If it all looks good then go in with a predefined stop loss and just let it happen man.

In the mean time like previously stated you do need to get a job until you can make money consistantly by doing the above.

Best of luck to you man. I respect you sticking it out for this long.

YT

 

[slapshot]

Quote from jasper6:

I've been trading ES and ER2 both. With ER2, I use R100 constant range charts with a volatility stop set to 1.5. I take both long and short signals with a 1 point stop. I try to just trade in the first two hours when the market tends to go somewhere with conviction.

I can see your first problem right here. In the first 2 hours of the market, volatility is way too high to use 1.0 or 1.5 stops.

I'll bet you get stopped out too much and that your win rate % is too low . . .

 

[Joab]

Quote from youngtrader:

To the OP (if he is still paying attention to this thread).

True I am only 17 years old but I feel that I can add some value to this thread.

This thread really got to me. As my dad is in his mid fifties and a fairly successful trader.

First forget about day trading. It imo is for only the best of the best. There is just so many decisions a person has to make when trading intra day that it can be a bit overwhelming. Believe me by quitting day trading you will be taking the first step towards success (you can go back to it later if you want to). Now this doesn't mean that you have to stop trading......instead subscribe to moore research and only look at trades that are 100% trades out of 15 years. After you have located these 100% trades check the fundamentals of that particular market, then check out the daily chart. If it all looks good then go in with a predefined stop loss and just let it happen man.

In the mean time like previously stated you do need to get a job until you can make money consistantly by doing the above.

Best of luck to you man. I respect you sticking it out for this long.

YT

This is some pretty good advise (your wise beyond your years)

I would also add that the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result.

OP - I think your main problem is your "trying" to trade the toughest market in the world with the indexs.

Try stocks or as young trader said commodities.

You have to do "something" different.

 

[Rahula]

OP believes in the "averaging one point a day (with size)" myth. This is the biggest myth in trading. Averages in trading are completely meaningless. The only realistic way to average one point a day is to nail four 25 point trades that you hold for a total of 20 days and and break even on the other 80 days.

Its the fat tails that makes or breaks your week/month/year/career, not the "average".

 

[austinp]

<i>"The only realistic way to average one point a day is to nail four 25 point trades that you hold for a total of 20 days and and break even on the other 80 days. Its the fat tails that makes or breaks your week/month/year/career, not the "average".</i>

That's one way towards success. It works. Once a trader becomes more skilled = experienced than that, using the same concept scaled down to intraday swings will work better still.

 

[trackstar]

Honestly you already have a profitable system if you trade the one you posted. I would find a way to limit the trades it produces with a filter. I can help you if you like.

One thing you need to realize is the market does NOT just move up and down. Sideways is part of the game. Learn how to define UP DOWN and SIDEWAYS and you will learn how to spot the trades that take advantage of that.

 

[DrEvil]

To the OP, you have received lots of advice here, some it good. From first impressions as already pointed out, your stops are too tight and therefore even your good trades are getting taken out prematurely. You are almost surely guaranteeing failure this way.

There is a way you can trade your very very tight 1pt stops on breakouts if you have patience. Wait for a breakout, and plan to get in on a pullback. Locate a very safe stop placement (it must be under strong support or above strong resistance) such that if the price retraced to that level the breakout would be most likely a failed break. Ok you now have your stop defined and it's a SAFE one! Now put your entry order in 1 pt away from the stop. You will miss out on many good trades that never retrace that far after the breakout but you will catch one from time to time that retraces deeply, just be patient! I recommend a predifined exit that is at least 3 pts or more, or perhaps trail your stop.

Good luck in whatever you decide to do!