Question to anyone who bought a trading course

X

Xspurt

For years I have been toying with the idea of releasing a system that gives auto dynamic S&R, trend detection and impulse energy and when someone from ET asked me for mentoring I thought it was an ideal time to see how well I could communicate the system. I thought a short intro would do the trick as it is pretty simple.

However events took a completely different course when I decided to set a few tests to see the market through their eyes so to speak and I found two strong contrasts. The first was real talent that had been developed over the past 10 years but then handicapped by some technical errors that had become bad habits.

It's taken a couple of months to undo theses reflexes and rebuild a different view of the market and if I had just handed over a system with clear instructions I'd have been baffled as to why the results would have been below par.

Using what I considered clear chart examples and detailed explanations doesn't guarantee that someone takes the trade the same way: it needs close scrutiny of their efforts to discover the discrepancies.

It's just made me think a fire-and-forget approach won't get the quality results I expect so my question is - if you have bought a course did the mentor examine close up every trade you were taking and qualify that you were carrying out his instructions precisely or was it pay your money and take your chances?

Feedback appreciated.
 
Quote from Xspurt:

For years I have been toying with the idea of releasing a system that gives auto dynamic S&R, trend detection and impulse energy and when someone from ET asked me for mentoring I thought it was an ideal time to see how well I could communicate the system. I thought a short intro would do the trick as it is pretty simple.

However events took a completely different course when I decided to set a few tests to see the market through their eyes so to speak and I found two strong contrasts. The first was real talent that had been developed over the past 10 years but then handicapped by some technical errors that had become bad habits.

It's taken a couple of months to undo theses reflexes and rebuild a different view of the market and if I had just handed over a system with clear instructions I'd have been baffled as to why the results would have been below par.

Using what I considered clear chart examples and detailed explanations doesn't guarantee that someone takes the trade the same way: it needs close scrutiny of their efforts to discover the discrepancies.

It's just made me think a fire-and-forget approach won't get the quality results I expect so my question is - if you have bought a course did the mentor examine close up every trade you were taking and qualify that you were carrying out his instructions precisely or was it pay your money and take your chances?

Feedback appreciated.
More...

I've bought a couple a few years back. Both offered chat rooms where the instructor chatted the whole time as trades setup.

In both, the instructors would often disqualify setups for different reasons (ie too close to previous resistance to go long, etc). The setups where they'd say, "Now this is a setup that I would be interested in", sometimes would work out, sometimes they would not. When a trade worked out, they would go into how they would manage it - moving stops to lock in profits, etc. All in all they were decent strategies that did work - if managing winning trades correctly. What I mostly got out of it was that there are many ways to trade that can be profitable, but the most important factor was the r/r ratio. Both offered less than 1:1, which is why letting the winners run was crucial. The first course was basically an overbought/oversold countertrend strategy. The second course was a trend trading/pullback type strategy. The second was superior by far, including the chat room commentary. And 1/10th of the price of the first lol. I bought the courses to learn more about trading at the time, not necessarily to trade the systems. The first is no longer in business, the second is.

Not sure if that answered anything for you or not. I think really, it depends on how experienced the person trading the system is. Aside from having some screentime, the psychological issues will be important too. There are books that I read a few years ago that I re-read now and view completely differently.
 
The only time you should be interested in training courses is when they mentor you.. not teach you a "proven" system.

They gotta sell the craft, not the dream.

That being said, I haven't found anyone worth paying to learn from as of yet..
 
You're over thinking it.....

Selling a course to make money and trying to sell a discretionary system that you believe works are entirely two different things.

I've seen system vendors who could sell frozen shit to an eskimo and it didn't matter one iota whether it worked.


For the former you need to be talking to people here: www.wickedfire.com
 
Hi,

There's a huge difference between sharing your method online versus mentoring in person. Simply, if you didn't mentor in person with real money on the line in your trading account...you're just sharing your method with someone online for a fee.

There's nothing wrong with sharing your method online but don't be baffled if their results are not what you expected in comparison to mentoring in person regardless how well the online instructions were written, no matter how clear the instructions were, no matter how great the chart examples were...

Such will not overcome the flaws of the other person if they are not suited for trading, undercapitalized, doesn't have a proper trading environment at home or at work, lack discipline, trading the wrong trading instrument for the method and many other things that you will not be aware about involving the other trader.

In contrast, in person mentoring allows you to see in person what's really going on with the other trader. That's why whenever someone wants to get involved in mentoring...they should ensure the other trader is suitable as a student prior to the start of mentoring in person just like the student should ensure the mentor is suitable (verifiable) for mentoring.

Quote from wrbtrader:
My point is that if you're not mentoring in person...don't call it mentoring.
More...
Yet, if you're mentoring in person via real money trading, you have a lot more control, see your student's flaws, properly try to resolve those flaws and your students results will fall closer in line to your expectations...at least during the in person mentoring sessions.

By the way, proper mentoring will most likely cost a lot of money as in the thousands of dollars. For such a cost, there is "no excuse" why such is not performed in person via real money in the mentors trading account in front of the student's own two eyes and in the student's account with the mentor sitting by his/her side giving instructions. Yet, online follow-up courses and follow-up instructions is OK after the mentoring in person sessions.

Yeah, I'm getting to the fact that if you're going to mentor properly...you will need to travel and mentor your student in his/her trading environment to discover those discrepancies you mentioned.

Therefore, when you said the following...

Quote from Xspurt:
...Using what I considered clear chart examples and detailed explanations doesn't guarantee that someone takes the trade the same way: it needs close scrutiny of their efforts to discover the discrepancies...

Feedback appreciated.
More...
You will NEVER come close to duplicating real trading situation via hindsight chart examples with detailed (clear) explanations. Thus, as you realized...using hindsight charts with clear explanations as the only teaching tool doesn't guarantee someone will take the trade as instructed when real money is on the line and in a trading environment greatly different from your own.

Therefore, I'll repeat, the only way you can give close scrutiny of their efforts and discover their discrepancies is via in person mentoring because it's impossible to see such online through an internet connection with your student. There's no other way to do it.
 
I'm in an on going class now. 3 days of live with a group, then on line mentoring one on one.... 1 - 3 hours at a time over a few of months. The on line can do it, you can see each others screens and talk. The group and teacher also have an hour on line chat each week.

Some of the training is great. Sometimes I'm not so sure. I don't know enough to compair it to any one else.

I'm doing better with my trading, I have periods of some consistancy... tho haven't made back the cost of the class yet! I do see that whatever the teacher gives, I have to really work hard to make it work for me. Trading in the final analysis is just you?

Apparently teaching someone to trade is not straight forward due to all the reasons in posts above... tallent, capitol, their situation.... etc etc. NoD said she tried and not one person she taught would consistently follow her trade management rules...
My teacher says that the larger percent of her students just sit thru the one on one and say virtually nothing! And in our group on line ony a couple actually participate.
It dosen't make sense. ahhhh, other than when I'm losing several in a row I don't want anyone to know either!

Bye the bye, I have chemical sensitivities.... part of the reason I look to trading as something I can do in an environment I can choose.... So travel is real hard for me, and even having someone come into my space doesn't work well.... so an on line approach is something I looked for.

Hope that helps
 
I traded retail in several different chats and learned a few methodologies, i would make and lose money, it wasn't until i entered the prop game and got a real mentor until i actually started making serious cash.
 
I've taken many different courses overtime and have come to conclusion that if you have to sell it then it ain't any good.
 
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