QUESTION about hiring a programmer to automate your trading

Thank you all for your well thought out and considered responses. I'm grateful for your input. Judging by what some of you wrote, I suspect that this will be a major undertaking for a quasi technophobe like me, so I don't see it happening any time soon.

If I do decide to pursue this idea, I will likely try to familiarize myself with a language that does not limit me to only a few brokers since data accuracy and execution speed are critical for me: I only follow sub-one-minute time frames. And I will likely need to hire a local programmer at some point to help me finesse some isolated features which I imagine I will not likely be able to get out of a manual. (I'm not likely to have the patience to e-mail and visit forums to resolve what will likely be a string of endless and pesky details in both the coding of the system and its subsequent integration with market data and execution platform. It's somewhat discouraging just thinking abou it.)

I genuinely admire you folks who can do all of this stuff on your own. I wish I had taken some programming courses in school.
 
I'm sort of in a same situation with tums here. well....actually with far less experience and with still unproven strategy. regardless i have few questions for programmers and/or traders with automations. For someone with minimal programming knowledge(I aced both CS and AP CS in high school lol) where should I look to start? I've been given many feedbacks like goto amazon and buy books on C++ or C# or VBA .net .....the list goes on. Well, I didn't wanna waste money on buying many books, so I spent couple days in a local library digging up books with C++ C# VBA .net and stuff, just to get a general idea as to which book i want to buy.... but with 0 knowledge in programming, i had the most difficult time choosing a book. It's quite funny that I'm trying to learn to program but can't take that first step. What should I do?

another question is I see many people bringing up easylanguage as 1st path to take....but if my API works specifically with VC++....then would learning the easylanguage actually do any help? regarding C# versus C++, it seems like many are leaning more toward C#, but what if you system is compatible with C++ only? just for sake of comparison and easier understanding, are difference in these common programming languages as minute or insubstantial as someone who speaks english with a southern accent as opposed to someone with british accent?

lastly, if I want to build a system using IB(for equity), what language should I consider learning? This will take much time and dedication, and I have not commited to doing this just yet.........thx for any feedbacks.
 
forsan,

if you need c++ you need c++.

thinking in c++ by bruce e is pretty good.

if you're wrighting systems for IB, you have a choice... they have c++, .net, java, excel and some other choices. they're all pretty easy.

I also have to plug my own platform which is open source and broker-neutral :

http://tradelink.googlecode.com
 
Quote from forsalenyc:
I'm sort of in a same situation with tums here. well....actually with far less experience and with still unproven strategy. regardless i have few questions for programmers and/or traders with automations. For someone with minimal programming knowledge(I aced both CS and AP CS in high school lol) where should I look to start? I've been given many feedbacks like goto amazon and buy books on C++ or C# or VBA .net .....the list goes on. Well, I didn't wanna waste money on buying many books, so I spent couple days in a local library digging up books with C++ C# VBA .net and stuff, just to get a general idea as to which book i want to buy.... but with 0 knowledge in programming, i had the most difficult time choosing a book. It's quite funny that I'm trying to learn to program but can't take that first step. What should I do?
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That's an easy problem to solve... No need to start with books... there are lots of free C# lessons on the web.

another question is I see many people bringing up easylanguage as 1st path to take....but if my API works specifically with VC++....then would learning the easylanguage actually do any help?
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NO! Two different beasts.

regarding C# versus C++, it seems like many are leaning more toward C#, but what if you system is compatible with C++ only? just for sake of comparison and easier understanding, are difference in these common programming languages as minute or insubstantial as someone who speaks english with a southern accent as opposed to someone with british accent?
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It is the result of Microsoft's monopolistic conspiracy... C# has practically taken over all the development platforms.
 
Quote from forsalenyc:


lastly, if I want to build a system using IB(for equity), what language should I consider learning? This will take much time and dedication, and I have not commited to doing this just yet.........thx for any feedbacks.
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Easylanguage isn't a standalone language it's a way to customize TradeStation's platform. Much like EFS is to Esignal.

You need one of the languages you mentioned above. The tradeoff is the easier the language the less "powerful" it is. However, as a total beginner you have no idea how to harness that power. It's extremely likely the easier languages will do everything you need.

Having said all that there isn't an extreme difference in difficulty between any of them (my opinion, I don't claim to be an expert).

I use VB.net (NOT VBA, a related but limited language, they are different) for all my programs. Most people consider this the easiest to learn as a beginner. The express edition is free from Microsoft, and will do everything you'll need for quite a while. I trade 10-15M shrs month automated and it's all on VB.net based programs. I haven't found a reason to upgrade to one of the more powerful languages yet.

I've mentioned this other places, but I'll repeat it again. Take the time to learn the language before you start hacking up IB's code samples. A little pain upfront will make life much easier down the road. Figure 2 weeks to a month of evenings learning the language should get you started.
 
Tums, Im not the least bit a programmer either. But by using the Strategy wizard and scratching around on the forum its not too difficult to piece together something. youll usually find someone has tried to code something similar before. I do agree that Easy language is a lot easier to learn but each to their own
 
Hey Thunderdog, take a look at MacroScheduler , http://www.mjtnet.com/ , you might not need a programmer with this tool. There is a little bit of learning curve, but nothing like learning how to program. I've automated some programs for my business after just a few days using this and the possibilities are endless. Hope it helps.

Quote from Thunderdog:

I have a question for those of you without programming knowledge who have hired a programmer to automate your trading. Do you not essentially give up your strategy in all of its detail to a stranger who can then use it for himself and potentially pass it on to others?

Lately, I have been toying with the idea of either learning a programming language or hiring a programmer. Since I know nothing about programming, I suspect that this would be an onerous undertaking from start to finish. Hiring someone and disclosing my strategy in its entirety, on the other hand, strikes me as entirely unacceptable.

I'm curious to know if anyone else has come to this crossroads and how he or she dealt with it.
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Quote from bigarrow:

Hey Thunderdog, take a look at MacroScheduler , http://www.mjtnet.com/ , you might not need a programmer with this tool. There is a little bit of learning curve, but nothing like learning how to program. I've automated some programs for my business after just a few days using this and the possibilities are endless. Hope it helps.
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Thank you for the link. I had a look at their site and spoke with their contact people about what I had in mind. Chances are that I'd still need a programmer to iron out some edges, being the techno-doof that I am. Even so, you have presented what may be something of a short-cut option for me if and when I decide to pursue automation. Thanks again.
 
I am in a similar position, although I have some light experience in software development.

Have you yet written out you system in English to a level of detail that it could be followed by a total idiot for a week and not get screwed up?

It sounds trivial, but asking a lot of especially discretionary traders, to write out a set of rules to 1) Cook breakfast in a restaurant or 2) Determine whether or not to go to work on a given day you very well may get a lot of 'systems' that will not work.

I think if you can write it out in this level of detail, then it would make coding it much easier. In fact you will have to clarify things in this level of detail for any developer either you or another one, to complete the work.

There are so many gotchas in building a system that cannot be seen until you are into it.

In the end, I am going to end up writing the system myself.........
 
Quote from Trader922:

...Have you yet written out you system in English to a level of detail that it could be followed by a total idiot for a week and not get screwed up?
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Yes. (Who do you think follows it?)
 
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