Protecting IP when working with 3rd-party developer to automate

[HowardCohodas]

Quote from logic_man:

It's not that I want one, I'm just operating under the assumption that having one is a necessary evil. I did some Java development back about 10 years ago but getting back up to speed on that is something I'd prefer not to do.

That said, if you think there is a tool I should look at, please post a name or a link and I will.

I'm a retired software engineer. I've programmed many systems using VB, PHP, Fortran (yeh, I'm that old), etc. No longer.

Prodigio, a ThinkOrSwim product, lets you use a GUI based method for developing and testing a system. You select icons representing data sources and standard transforms including some built-in TA tools. You connect the icons with simple point and click.

You can have it alert you to trades. You can turn it into a robot and let it trade for you. I recommend you check it out.

 

[intradaybill]

Quote from logic_man:

What are some ways people have successfully done this? For the sake of discussion, let's assume that my strategy has IP worth protecting and isn't just trading randomness.

Is this the next chapter on the book you are writing?

Chapter 10. How to Protect your Tradign System IP

I forgot, chapter 5 was about curve-fitting:

Chapter 5. The Many Ways to Curve-Fit a System

Yep, you can get other people write a book for you here in ET in no time.

Just joking of course...

 

[Runningbear]

One very effective way I have done this is the past is to have my scripts coded in a way that allows me to modify the code directly and add the buy and sell rules myself using simple code strings.

Such as: buy if X is > than y and z is > than y or if a and b are < than c

This way they may know the what calculations you are making, but they will not know how you are applying them to trade.

Runningbear

 

[DeeDeeTwo]

Quote from rolextrader:

From a practical point, the best you can hope for is the developer will honor the terms of a confidentiality agreement.

Basically this.

Have the agreement written by a lawyer...
Courts will often enforce Confidentiality Agreements.

But it all depends on the developer having something to lose...
Like some real estate...
Because if your developer is broke (usually the case)...
Or located in a corrupt jurisdiction...
You have zero protection of any kind.

 

[Businessman]

Quote from logic_man:

What are some ways people have successfully done this? For the sake of discussion, let's assume that my strategy has IP worth protecting and isn't just trading randomness.

All systems have parameters.

ie which moving average, how far the stop loss should, position sizing etc.

These should not be hard configured in the code.

You can set these yourself via, GUI or file or database etc.

For testing purposes you can give the developer values that are way off. but still generate signals.

Perhaps give him parameters values that over generate entries and exits which will be more useful to him in testing anyway.

When you get the system replace the config GUI or file parameters with the 'secret' values.

 

[HowardCohodas]

Quote from Businessman:

All systems have parameters.

The successful systems that I have developed have both proprietary logic and proprietary settings for the parameters. It is hard to protect the logic with your approach.

 

[Eight]

Farm it out in pieces such that no one consultant can know what the whole is. Where it comes to your intellectual property have it coded up with a design that is similar to what you really want but not similar enough to reveal it. Do the last little bit of coding yourself, the part that converts the ip section to what you want it to be...

The CIA did technical projects like that, I had a friend that had no particular security clearance at all that worked on CIA projects at the RF Engineering firm he worked at. He said that years later he would see a news story about the item he worked on or it would appear as a commercial product and he'd say "oh, wow, that's what they were doing!!"

 

[dr.bingo]

As already mentioned your best options are:

1) Give the project out as piecemeal (compartmental security)
2) Get a trustworthy coder (how many $$s before trust ends?)
3) Find a development system that is easy to program and test yourself (works with the right platform)

Prodigio, currently behaves more like a beta product than a proper release, try it out but it has limited indicators and actions.

There are other systems currently much more robust and tested that work better.

Our company is about to release AlgoFire(TM) which is such a system and does not require programming other than Excel rules. (release in the next 2-4 weeks)

- sorry for the plug, but thought it is appropriate here-

We have built this system by licensing and modifying a very robust trading/charting package.

 

[HowardCohodas]

Quote from dr.bingo:

As already mentioned your best options are:
Prodigio, currently behaves more like a beta product than a proper release, try it out but it has limited indicators and actions.

There are other systems currently much more robust and tested that work better.

Prodigio has far more capability than I have been able to utilize. Perhaps my needs are pretty simple compared to yours.

Other than Prodigio and yours, what others do you consider more robust and tested and work better?

 

[earlyexit]

Quote from HowardCohodas:

Prodigio has far more capability than I have been able to utilize. Perhaps my needs are pretty simple compared to yours.

Other than Prodigio and yours, what others do you consider more robust and tested and work better?

Talking about protecting IP... Anything and everything you create on Prodigio is kept on their servers. They have complete access to whatever you create.

Not exactly a good way to keep your super-winning strats to yourself.




I was really into Prodigio and spent weeks and months working with it. In the end, I felt it wasn't worth it. Didn't like the idea of having my strats in their control and feeding Citadel even more $$..