suretrader doesn't look bad. I might try out their demo account to see how it is before putting some nominal amount to start.
Prop Firm Proposal
- Thread starter trader99
- Start date
suretrader doesn't look bad. I might try out their demo account to see how it is before putting some nominal amount to start.
Trader99, there is zero chance anyone will even spend 10 seconds on your proposal. I ran a prop office for several years. I understand the economics well. Not a chance in hell. You are not even in the right universe of offers. Honestly, your best bet is to trade futures where you can get 20 to 1 overnight leverage on avg in most products. I'm just being honest here. There is no one out there that will have any interest in that model. Sorry.
Maverick,
I've always enjoyed reading your post here on ET. So, thank you for the honesty.
So, what criterion/criteria should I relax above in order for a prop firm to be interested in my proposal?
Though I do swing trading, I'm very open to daytrading strategies as well. So, if I do that would it make more sense? And willing to pay some nominal desk/platform fees...
Or should I just look at other retail platform like Suretrade? IB only has 4:1 for intraday margin and standard 2:1 overnight. Suretrade has 6:1 intraday, but they seem to be smaller capitalized, which might be a risk if I decide to put larger amounts in them. I feel comfortable putting larger amounts in IB.
As for futures, sure. That works too. I have a small futures account. And a couple of equity accounts across several retail brokers.
Would be nice to have $500K-$1M leverage intraday to play with. I guess I'll have to build my account up over time so that I can get to a number that with intraday leverage(4x or 6x) would get me the desired intraday margin. That will take a while since I'm steadily building up my capital trading on the side.
Just wondering if I could shortcircuit that process through a prop firm leverage..
Any additional suggestions on how best to approach the proposal above would be most appreciated. Retail, prop, or otherwise.
Thanks!
99
Here is what Joel M., a prop firm recruiter, told me recently. I will use $25K, as an example, 1yr. lock-up, 20:1 intraday leverage (can go up), 5:1 overnight(can increase), 90/10 payout, 6/10ths of a penny, which is a little high, and $150 per mo. for data. Need a series 7 or 56 though!
Maverick74 is the uncontested SME of prop shops. I'm glad we are pulling him back into the regular threads. As I can see, you intend this to be a part time trading account. You definitely won't find a cost structure conducive to your trading. The business is setup to keep you playing.
$500-$1M intraday? You have to be out of your mind to put $100K-$200K into Suretrader even if you are rich.
$500-$1M intraday? You have to be out of your mind to put $100K-$200K into Suretrader even if you are rich.
No, not sure if I'll even open a Suretrade account and even if I did open one probably not that much given they are not well capitalized and not in US domicile do not make me that comfortable. So, it looks like maybe IB, but since IB is only 4:1 it will be a ways from now to build up to that level...
BTW, I'm "not" rich by and stretch of the imagination. Just a working professional who has good financial discipline, savings rate, and investing/trading knowledge.
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Thanks for reminding me about PM. I think I'll stick with Reg T until I build up the account(s). PM might make sense in the future but I'm still a ways from there. Thanks for the inputs and suggestions.
Check out Great Point Capital out of Chicago, they are both FINRA (retail) and do prop. If you're going to stick with Reg T then that's definitely an option.
Through their retail arm, you won't have the 1 year lock up, and you can negotiate the commissions. Of course, since it's retail, you can hold overnight, and payout is 100%.
You'll only need licenses if you join their prop division, not for retail, obviously.
If you're not actively scalping, then also check out Speedtrader as a discount retail broker.
As the op said, all the terms you are seeking are not realistic. ALL of the capital contribution prop shops that are U.S. registered brokers will require the 1 year lockup and a securities license. Bright requires more capital than most firms, however you can hold overnights, unlike most firms which are day trading only (there are exceptions, so always ask and conduct your own due diligence).
Through their retail arm, you won't have the 1 year lock up, and you can negotiate the commissions. Of course, since it's retail, you can hold overnight, and payout is 100%.
You'll only need licenses if you join their prop division, not for retail, obviously.
If you're not actively scalping, then also check out Speedtrader as a discount retail broker.
As the op said, all the terms you are seeking are not realistic. ALL of the capital contribution prop shops that are U.S. registered brokers will require the 1 year lockup and a securities license. Bright requires more capital than most firms, however you can hold overnights, unlike most firms which are day trading only (there are exceptions, so always ask and conduct your own due diligence).
ScalperJoe:
Thank you for your responses and suggestions. I did NOT say I don't want to have securities licenses. I had Series 7,55, and 63 back during my old prop trading days. Those are now obviously expired. And I don't mind take the necessary securities exams if they are required in the prop setting. It's just taking tests.
I checked out Great Point Capital. Interesting. Do you have much intraday leverage for retail account? It doesn't say on the website. How about on the prop account? I don't want to start trading a like 5-10 shares or even at 100 shares. Geez. Do you know how many shares they start people out with? Do you know if they charge desk fees? What's their split? Lastly, do they allow remote prop?
Anyhow, I have Robinhood and their commission is $0! Sweet! But the downside is that they do NOT currently offer margin account nor do they allow shorting yet. They say sometimes this year.
If Robinhood comes through then I'll be elated. 4x intraday and 2:1 overnight would be great. I don't mind paying for overnight margin if Robinhood allows margin trading and shorting. Keeping my fingers crossed.
But there is some good reasons for going prop if there is an opp for trading on significant capital base..
Thanks!
99
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