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Prop firm asking for source code and strategy??
- Thread starter WinstonTJ
- Start date
Quote from sws2179:
Just give them the finger and stay the held away from them; they are trying to steal your strategy. I have seen this kind of heinous act before from one of the very popular firm among ET sponsors. Beware!
this method of interview is designed only for one purpose
never hire the candidate, but screen scrape, remember that expression,
its used in basic intelligence gathering,
simply put, the objective of that interview / those types of loaded questions are designed to gain backward intelligence from the interviewed person of what they experienced, so that the prospective employer can take advantage of those methods, without ever hiring the candidate....
take this guys' advice and brush off your feet when you exit their offices too....
Run. Run far, far away, and never return!
An execution monkey is one who only knows how to push buttons. In this case he may not be a screen/manual trader but he can program, build systems, has a very firm grasp of math (not arithmetic, math) and statistics.
It would be one thing if a firm offered to purchase or share in the IP involved here but in this case the shop flat-out stated during a phone interview that it would be required before any "fully automated" strategies were to be turned on.
The other red flag (to me at least) was that they wanted to charge commissions and insisted on a profit split. I understand that payout agreements could be infinate however something as deep as 40% to the firm with his capital down (not trading firm's capital) AND paying fees seems crazy.
Limitdown - I don't understand your dislike for automated strategies... perhaps someday you will embrace the present like the rest of the wolrd has.
It would be one thing if a firm offered to purchase or share in the IP involved here but in this case the shop flat-out stated during a phone interview that it would be required before any "fully automated" strategies were to be turned on.
The other red flag (to me at least) was that they wanted to charge commissions and insisted on a profit split. I understand that payout agreements could be infinate however something as deep as 40% to the firm with his capital down (not trading firm's capital) AND paying fees seems crazy.
Limitdown - I don't understand your dislike for automated strategies... perhaps someday you will embrace the present like the rest of the wolrd has.
there's no regulatory requirement from sec/finra.Quote from WinstonTJ:
I'm going to keep this vague on purpose because I don't know if this is a regulatory requirement or not...
A friend of mine called me yesterday and said he spoke to a prop firm about trading, etc. He does 100% automated trades. The prop firm said flat out that he would need to disclose his source code as well as strategies (that are fully automated) if he were to trade there and that this was an SEC and compliance rule.
My first reaction was that this was total BS but its a pretty well-known and reputable firm (which I will not be disclosing so don't ask).
Are there any SEC/FINRA or even in-house compliance regulations that would require a shop to have or understand the source code or automated strategies to "prevent against manipulation" or the like?
since you won't name names, i will. i only know of one well known firm who does this, and that's assent. the mgr your friend spoke to is either misinformed or trying to justify their policy by lying. regardless, the official reason they do this is for risk mgmt.
needless to say, any firm that says they want to go through your code or "share your strategy" for risk mgmt purposes (for ANY purposes) is by definition not auto-friendly (trader-friendly). he should keep looking.
Quote from WinstonTJ:
An execution monkey is one who only knows how to push buttons. In this case he may not be a screen/manual trader but he can program, build systems, has a very firm grasp of math (not arithmetic, math) and statistics.
It would be one thing if a firm offered to purchase or share in the IP involved here but in this case the shop flat-out stated during a phone interview that it would be required before any "fully automated" strategies were to be turned on.
The other red flag (to me at least) was that they wanted to charge commissions and insisted on a profit split. I understand that payout agreements could be infinate however something as deep as 40% to the firm with his capital down (not trading firm's capital) AND paying fees seems crazy.
Limitdown - I don't understand your dislike for automated strategies... perhaps someday you will embrace the present like the rest of the wolrd has.
autos, buses, trucks, trains, planes and bicycles are all fine!
just remember the day when it was the sheer brilliance of the trader who calculated all those variables mentally and executed them flawlessly or at least within their risk quotient parameters...
autos have caused the game to require everyone playing to drive an auto or be left behind....
you see, this is an example of a firm that you wouldn't want to do any auto-trading with (imo, after that crap, ANY trading). you never ask for code, but you "may" share the stragey huh? how honorable of you. ridiculous that you would disclose this in public.Quote from Don Bright:
We do ask to have a basic business plan of the "what" you're attempting to do so we can offer some assistance - and GS holds Bright responsible of something goes haywire, so we "may" share some of the concept....but never have we asked for source code, never.
Don
if something goes haywire, you have risk controls in place. NOT, feel as if you're OWED something for even hosting them, giving you the right to share the strategy with the other traders in the firm? this is 100% horseshit.
i personally made my firm sign an nda. it likely wouldn't be worth much, but if i ever heard about them pimping my strategies to other traders in the firm or elsewhere, i would make life very difficult for them out of principle.
i'm still a little floored you would openly say that. if their were any doubts about the sleaze... doubt no more. bright trading, oh yea baby.
Quote from WinstonTJ:
I'm going to keep this vague on purpose because I don't know if this is a regulatory requirement or not...
A friend of mine called me yesterday and said he spoke to a prop firm about trading, etc. He does 100% automated trades. The prop firm said flat out that he would need to disclose his source code as well as strategies (that are fully automated) if he were to trade there and that this was an SEC and compliance rule.
My first reaction was that this was total BS but its a pretty well-known and reputable firm (which I will not be disclosing so don't ask).
Are there any SEC/FINRA or even in-house compliance regulations that would require a shop to have or understand the source code or automated strategies to "prevent against manipulation" or the like? [/QUOTE
u worry too much that disclosure would affect your friend or you negatively.
It's a scam. Tell them to get fucked.