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Professional profits
- Thread starter drasfs
- Start date
Quote from illiquid:
What time frame do these funds typically operate on? I've only heard of Hathersage which claims to hold most positions for less than 48 hours.
It is usually a mix. The size traders usually carry a "core" position and trade in and out around it. A large majority of trades are executed within a 48 hour period, especially on high volatility days. But, a portion of the "core" position could potentially be held for months (only in the case of a winning trade). Hathersage is one of the big ones. I have no idea how much $ they actually manage, but I do know that they only take huge accounts (at least a few million).
Quote from Jackjones:
Hi, thanks for the info, can you give us an example of this or is it just position trading?
Sure. Here is one tactic. Two trading accounts. One for longer time horizon. One for shorter. Essentially, the trader could be overall long, but also benefit from intraday/intraweek short positions. Initially, it probably sounds strange as you are regulary trading against your position and, in essence, flattening your position. But, it works, so I don't argue it.
But the position trading you are probably referring to is commonly used as well. Long 5MM, sell 2MM on rally, buy 1MM on dip, etc, etc.
And when comparing I think it's helpful to see drawdown and % risked!
Generally accepted risk on managed forex is no more than 5% (leveraged) per month. Managers do not view the beginning of the month, the same as the end. They are very selective in the begining and try to get up some $, so that they have something to work with. If they get into a hole early in the month they will probably only shoot for a break even month on low risk. #1 goal is always preservation of capital. Nice trades will always happen, so if you manage all the rest properly, you generally come out on top.
Hope that answers your questions.
Quote from Jackjones:
Hi, thanks for the info, can you give us an example of this or is it just position trading?
Sure. Here is one tactic. Two trading accounts. One for longer time horizon. One for shorter. Essentially, the trader could be overall long, but also benefit from intraday/intraweek short positions. Initially, it probably sounds strange as you are regulary trading against your position and, in essence, flattening your position. But, it works, so I don't argue it.
But the position trading you are probably referring to is commonly used as well. Long 5MM, sell 2MM on rally, buy 1MM on dip, etc, etc.
Quote from FXPimp:
Sure. Here is one tactic. Two trading accounts. One for longer time horizon. One for shorter. Essentially, the trader could be overall long, but also benefit from intraday/intraweek short positions. Initially, it probably sounds strange as you are regulary trading against your position and, in essence, flattening your position. But, it works, so I don't argue it.
But the position trading you are probably referring to is commonly used as well. Long 5MM, sell 2MM on rally, buy 1MM on dip, etc, etc.
Thats what i usually do in futures. Position trading system + swing system. What constitutes whipsaw to a 2month position trading system can actually turn into a nice trend for a 1week swing system.
Quote from FXPimp:
Sure. Here is one tactic. Two trading accounts. One for longer time horizon. One for shorter. Essentially, the trader could be overall long, but also benefit from intraday/intraweek short positions. Initially, it probably sounds strange as you are regulary trading against your position and, in essence, flattening your position. But, it works, so I don't argue it.
But the position trading you are probably referring to is commonly used as well. Long 5MM, sell 2MM on rally, buy 1MM on dip, etc, etc.
Would they ever consider taking a long position and size it as to be able to continue buying on "acceptable dips" (according to trade risk)? ie. adding to a loser... i ask because you hear some people say this is like a number 1 rule not to break in general trading.
Quote from drasfs:
Im just wondering what profits proffesionals usually achieve in the forex market?
Not in terms of pips, but rather in percentage(annual return on investment)
Do the professionals for example just achieve 25% in return on their investment?
I do however understand that this isnt an easy question, and i suspect that no survey on the matter has been done. But someone here might know it from experience, or is a proffessional themselves.
"Forex Trading Advisor Profiles"
http://www.fx-forex-trading.com/profiles.htm
Q
Click the Advisor of your choice to gain access to their performance profile:
Allied Irish Capital Management (Foreign Exchange)
Analytic Investment Management (Non-Linear)
Capital Growth Partners (C-View Limited 2XL)
Capital Growth Partners (C-View Limited 3XL)
Capital Growth Partners (C-View Limited)
Capricorn Asset Management (FX 3X)
Appleton Capital Management (25% Risk)
Campbell & Company (Derivative of Forex)
Capricorn Asset Management (FX 7X)
Capricorn Asset Management (Systementum FX)
Coral Rock Investments, Inc. (Leveraged 10 X)
CRT Currency Exchange LTD.
First Quadrant (Managed Currency)
Friedberg Commodity Management
FX Concepts Trading Advisor (Developed Markets Currency)
FX Concepts Trading Advisor (Multi-Strategy Fund)
Gamma Capital Management, LLC (Global FX)
Global Eurofund Management Ltd. (FX 2000)
Global Eurofund Management Ltd. (TCT)
Hathersage Capital Management (Daily Growth)
Hathersage Capital Management (Long Term Growth)
Hyman Beck & Company (Forex)
International Trading Advisors (Forex)
Jacobson Fund Managers Limited (Currency 2.5X)
Jacobson Fund Managers Limited (Currency)
John W. Henry & Company (Dollar Program)
John W. Henry & Company (Foreign Exchange)
John W. Henry & Company (G7 Currency Portfolio)
KMJ Capital Management (Currency)
Marathon Capital Growth Partners (System FX)
Millburn Ridgefield Corporation (Currency)
Northbridge Capital Management Inc. (Sigma Strategy)
Plimsoll Capital
Polpo Financial Ltd. (Zenith)
S.S. Advantage (Currency Option)
Seven Arrows Management
Stonebrook Capital Management, Inc.
Strategic Investments (Currency Program)
Sunrise Capital Management (Currency)
Tamiso & Company (Interbank Currency)
UQ
"Life of Program Allocation Performance Comparison through 10/6/06 "
http://www.fx-forex-trading.com/sys_stats.htm
Nice list, Oddtrader.
Jack jones, adding to a loser is generally frowned upon. Very rare circumstances may apply, for example, manager gets long at a price a little higher than he wanted, but did not want to miss the trade, price moves lower (but not past stop loss), manager buys more at price he originally wanted to get. While debacles are bad for regular traders, they are completely unacceptable for fund managers. You do NOT take a big hit with big size on ever. You have to remember that the focus is 95% on managing the risk and losers, and over time, the winners hit here and there.
Jack jones, adding to a loser is generally frowned upon. Very rare circumstances may apply, for example, manager gets long at a price a little higher than he wanted, but did not want to miss the trade, price moves lower (but not past stop loss), manager buys more at price he originally wanted to get. While debacles are bad for regular traders, they are completely unacceptable for fund managers. You do NOT take a big hit with big size on ever. You have to remember that the focus is 95% on managing the risk and losers, and over time, the winners hit here and there.