Pro Firm for overnight trading

WTF are you talking about.an indefinate amount to trade overnight with nothing down...of course it doesnt exist and I kow snonfeld VERY well even though i dont trade with them NO body in the world is giving some BOZO unlimited overnight exposure.If your so good why wouldnt you put some money down and get a higher payout?????answer maybe your not so good..I work for a prop firm make 75%+ hold massive overnights and have a small bank put up>>>why because I HAVE PROVEN myself and make a ton every month. By proving yourself you can get alot but asking for everything without even proving oyurself is a joke.
momo
 
No one at Opus (schonfeld's prop division) puts a penny down - and some have more capital than they could ever need --- this is for intraday, overnight and some for multi-day holds !!!! Not that having access to $20 mil wil make you a great trader - and only a few get to that level - but the opportunity does exist.
 
Tradetheplan,

How can I find out more about the Opus group, there is little to no information at Schonfelds site. All I see is info about Retail, Automated Trading and their Quant operation which is a Bank of America spin-off.

Any suggestions, I'd be happy to move to PM.

Thanks,

Eric
 
Momotrader, my point was that I was wondering if it is possible anywhere to trade overnights without being bound by having to put up money. Bound by your own capital limitations.

If you have to put up your own capital then you are immidietly bound by the economic reality that overnight trading has risks of 10%+ overnight drawdowns which will blow out anyone trying to leverage their own capital by more than 10-1.

So thus theoretically it is impossible to trade overnight strategies in the long term using your own capital with greather than 10-1 leverage if your strategies and concentration means you could wake up the next morning down over 10%.

So really what I'm talking about is I feel like my overnight strategies have positive expectancies but possible drawdowns of greather than 10%. You can't run such a strategy leveraging your own money at more than maybe 5-1. Or you get blown out. But if the strategy really has positive expectancies, it should still be run by someone.

If a firm believed in your ability as a long term trader they should be happy to fund your operation. I'm not sure that such a firm exists or what the terms would be to make it worth their while. Payout would probably need to be less than 30%.

Someone pointed out that what is needed is to be your own hedge fund. Then it is your investors that are funding you. The point of the thread was to ask the question if there are any prop firms that do this.
 
I think i figured out the answer to my question. There are no firms. It would require a prop firm to have many tens of millions in excess equity. And I don't think the firms frequently mentioned here have that. Not sure. At least when you are seeking $50 million plus buying power, hedge fund would be only way.
 
Prop firms work great for day trading. This is because a good day trader can control the drawdowns to just a few percent a day. So 50-1 leverage is no problem.

But the model breaks down for overnight trading because the drawdowns are just too large and too much is out of your control.

It is a conceptual problem. How do you leverage something more than 10-1 that has a 10% drawdown. Answer is you can't easily. Without finding deep pockets to fund you. I.E. hedge fund investors. I don't think there are any firms that specialize this because it is too hard for them to control the risk or to even evaluate whether they are giving their money to someone who will have a positive track record over long term.
 
Quote from momo trader99:

WTF are you talking about.an indefinate amount to trade overnight with nothing down...of course it doesnt exist and I kow snonfeld VERY well even though i dont trade with them NO body in the world is giving some BOZO unlimited overnight exposure.If your so good why wouldnt you put some money down and get a higher payout?????answer maybe your not so good..I work for a prop firm make 75%+ hold massive overnights and have a small bank put up>>>why because I HAVE PROVEN myself and make a ton every month. By proving yourself you can get alot but asking for everything without even proving oyurself is a joke.
momo
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Wow. Please work on your E-N-G-L-I-S-H; read this and I want to cry myself to bed.

Please tell me you are writing this outside the United States. It is a heavy burden to imagine you wandering the streets, stumbling over your words like a puttering car.
 
Quote from newguy1:

Wow. Please work on your E-N-G-L-I-S-H; read this and I want to cry myself to bed.

Please tell me you are writing this outside the United States. It is a heavy burden to imagine you wandering the streets, stumbling over your words like a puttering car.
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"WANDERING".............hmmmmmmmm
 
Quote from newguy1:

Wow. Please work on your E-N-G-L-I-S-H; read this and I want to cry myself to bed.

Please tell me you are writing this outside the United States. It is a heavy burden to imagine you wandering the streets, stumbling over your words like a puttering car.
More...

newbies like childern should be seen but not heard:D
 
Quote from silk:

I think i figured out the answer to my question. There are no firms. It would require a prop firm to have many tens of millions in excess equity. And I don't think the firms frequently mentioned here have that. Not sure. At least when you are seeking $50 million plus buying power, hedge fund would be only way.
More...

maybe you should re-read this thread. someone mentioned a few firms that do this. those firms also breed hedge funds.
 
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