Pristine, Worth the $$?

Hey, hsvt

I've been looking at Pristine for some time as well. It's truly amazing to me how people on ET without any credentials are so quick to judge, though they have never taken a course or have any relevant information. "Don't waste you money", "just do the research", "no one can teach you how to trade". What a bunch of nonsense.
I took a few free webinars by Pristine and they do not sell you a trading system. They teach you the fundamentals and rules of trading. So what all you "experts" suggest, is just to open an account and start learning? May be read a book or two?

Hsvt, I believe education is paramount in this business whether you get it in a formal way or through trial and error.

Please let me know if you decide to take the course. I would like to hear from someone who has actually taken a course and not just posting to feel important.

Best of luck.
 
Thank you all for your input.

I did an Elite search for Pristine as suggested and checked the link provided by EricP.

The Elit search was pretty benign. All the real problem allegations are connected to a great degree with Oliver who seems to have trouble wherever he goes. The only thread talking about the courses was mixed but hardly dismissive.

The link thread was damning indeed but based mostly on assertions of Greg & Ollie lying as proven by an NASD (now FINRA) broker check. My own broker check did not bear fruit for me. There was no big history on Greg, Ollie doesn't really matter at this point, and Mastertrader had one regulatory violation back in 2006 (hard pressed to find any brokerage firm with a record any cleaner than that).

As pointed out by eugetrader the various comments are frustratingly absent much in the way of concrete course information. I know what the thing costs, I know there are other less expensive ways out there to get what I need for knowledge to move forward with. I know that I've done a good deal of poking around for that info but without positive results. So the question remains does the course train you to be a trader or just blow expensive smoke in your face?

Of course allegations of fraud, lying, misrepresentation etc. are important as well but only if they are backed by something I can confirm.

I am about to check out mxjones' blog referral as an alternative to Pristine. If I think I can get what I need there that is worthy of consideration as well.

So again thank you all very much. I continue to be keenly interested in focused information.
 
Several final points, on the hope that it will help a few readers:

1) Long time members of ET have seen hundreds upon hundreds of posts with feedback about Pristine (and firms like them).

2) The feedback has been decided negative. The few posters with positive 'experiences' at Pristine have been those with very little credibility on the site (fewer than a handful of posts), which could very easily be coming from employee/principals of the firm in question.

3) The vast majority of Pristine feedback have ultimately been deleted from this site, as Baron has decided that it's easier and more profitable to delete these threads than to deal with lawyers from the firm that are making threats against him for allowing the posts to stand. I would likely do the same in his shoes, as it's probably not worth the trouble for him.

Many times in the past, gullible ET readers have chosen to overlook the feedback and strong recommendations from long time ET members. PT Barnum said it best, "There's a sucker born every minute". For some trading related firms, this is a key element of their business plan.

In the end, all readers will have to make their own decisions and live with the outcomes.

Best of luck,
-Eric

P.S. The same situation happened with VCM/Team Trading 2-3 years ago, with long time member strongly recommending against anyone joining that firm. Roughly one year ago, the firm went belly-up with allegations of mishandling of client money, and 90%+ of their clients have not seen a dime of their money since. Buyer beware.
 
Quote from RCG Trader:

Wow, Pristine is still around?:D If you like to spend money go right ahead. If you prefer to spend time, do a little research on the mechanics of markets instead.
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Care to elaborate or do I have to?
 
Given the complexity of the subjest it is obvious that you want to learn from a successful trader. If you have a lot of money a mistake in the market will cost you much more than the $3000 seminar.

Unfortunately chances are that successful traders trade and do not usually teach or sell you anything.


My suggestion is to read anything you can while opening a small account and start trading. You might want to look at IBD is much cheaper and it gives you a good starting point.

Good Luck.



Quote from hsvt:

I'm thinking about signing up with Pristine for their TPM1 course program. Has anyone done this and found it to be a significant component in teaching them how to trade successfully?

I'm not so interested in less expensive ways to do this just want to know if this way works.
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I know nothing specifically about Pristine.

There are plenty of educators out there who haven't sicked their lawyers on any forum to remove negative posts, and have never been associated with individuals known to run off with clients' money. Why on earth would someone consider giving money to one that has? Is their sales pitch that good?
 
Quote from eugetrader:

Hey, hsvt

I've been looking at Pristine for some time as well. It's truly amazing to me how people on ET without any credentials are so quick to judge, though they have never taken a course or have any relevant information. "Don't waste you money", "just do the research", "no one can teach you how to trade". What a bunch of nonsense.
I took a few free webinars by Pristine and they do not sell you a trading system. They teach you the fundamentals and rules of trading. So what all you "experts" suggest, is just to open an account and start learning? May be read a book or two?

Hsvt, I believe education is paramount in this business whether you get it in a formal way or through trial and error.

Please let me know if you decide to take the course. I would like to hear from someone who has actually taken a course and not just posting to feel important.

Best of luck.
More...

That coming from a guy who has 4 posts in 2 years LMAO

Either you dont trade with real money or you got other aliases on this board.

Pristine does the free seminars so you would sign up for their paid seminars. I ve taken their paid seminar once about 3 years back and tbh it wasnt worth it. Which is not bad per se. But OP was asking fi it's worth it. Look at Van THarpe-got the same thing even though he is very good for psychology part of trading.

Just go through the hall of fame threads and there is plenty of good stuff there. Lots of good blogs too out there that can give you ideas about developing an edge, psychology and other traits for trading.

It takes you 10,000 hours to get skilled at trading, same as any other profession little bit more or less depending on your learning prowess. And there are no shortcuts. I was sceptical about this statement when I started, but looking back at all my journals this is true. Finding a mentor will help greatly but its very tough call, maybe if you have friend or family its easier.

Here is a blog roll you should spend a lot of time going through all the topics

tradermike.net
wallstreetwarrior http://traderjamie.blogspot.com/
http://www.eminiplayer.com/
http://www.markets.fallondpicks.com/
http://www.kirkreport.info/
http://maoxian.com/
http://www.tradinggoddess.com/


Join some trading groups and exchange info-just keep your eyes open in this business and good luck
 
goldstandard,

Yes they do talk a good story that increases in believability the longer I hear it (usually scams do the opposite).

If you don't mind please name some of the others who offer comprehensive educational training programs.

btw: I'm not sure that EricP's assertion that Pristine lawyers pressured the removal of some posts is anything more than his personal speculation on why they were removed and I don't have any idea whether there are other possible explanations. OV certainly is a controversial guy but all of the things that ended in peoples money disappearing happened after he was no longer involved with Pristine.

Pristine offers a comprehensive course program that they claim, along with hard work, practice and mentoring (part of the package), should get one to the point where they are ready to begin trading with some expectation of at least some profitability. I have participated in a number of their free webinars as well as about a month in their trading room. Paul, and other moderators, call their trades usually before, or at least as, they make them. The entries, targets and stops are given clearly in writing. They lose on some trades and even on whole consecutive days. The trades they say made them money would, if done as described, do that. Sometimes they claim to have made quite a bit more money than I did trying to follow them but the reasons for that are plausible if not obvious. Their system is logical relating ones trade to chart patterns that reasonably demonstrate price direction based on signals of supply, demand, support and resistance. Nothing earth shattering here. About the only absolutely absurd claim they make is that their way is the best if not pretty much the only way to learn how to trade. But more or less every mother's son who ever sold anything makes claims that need to be taken with some disbelief. It does look like it is a way to learn and, unfortunately, very few posts here are from people who have taken the courses and can say what their experience is. One thing I don't see here is any angry rants from people who have actually paid for Pristine products.

It is true that one might shy away from something this controversial particularly when there are obviously other ways to get there. I've tried some of the other ways without much in the way of results. I'm a slow reader which makes slogging through endless internet noise to find useful information somewhat prohibitive. I've checked out most of the leads offered in this thread and found they either cost just as much or are leads that go to other leads that lead to the internet noise I have so much trouble navigating. From a good deal of talking with the Pristine people they seem largely like decent folk (obviously I can easily be wrong here) who claim believably that they can teach me what I need to know even if it is a pricey way to get there.

I have gotten them to extend a NYC Expo show deal until today for me which means I'll be deciding very soon. In spite of all I'm leaning in their favor. I guess the worst it can be is $2k and 4 months of my life down the tubes. A steep price indeed but I could also spend twice the time and half the money with, as far as I can tell, just as probably the same success/disappointment probabilities.
 
I just PMed you.

On second thought, $2k isn't really that much money for 4 months of training. If you can afford the time and money, and if it won't set you back too far if doesn't work out, then maybe you should just go for it. It's bound to be an educational experience.


Quote from hsvt:

goldstandard,

Yes they do talk a good story that increases in believability the longer I hear it (usually scams do the opposite).

If you don't mind please name some of the others who offer comprehensive educational training programs.

btw: I'm not sure that EricP's assertion that Pristine lawyers pressured the removal of some posts is anything more than his personal speculation on why they were removed and I don't have any idea whether there are other possible explanations. OV certainly is a controversial guy but all of the things that ended in peoples money disappearing happened after he was no longer involved with Pristine.

Pristine offers a comprehensive course program that they claim, along with hard work, practice and mentoring (part of the package), should get one to the point where they are ready to begin trading with some expectation of at least some profitability. I have participated in a number of their free webinars as well as about a month in their trading room. Paul, and other moderators, call their trades usually before, or at least as, they make them. The entries, targets and stops are given clearly in writing. They lose on some trades and even on whole consecutive days. The trades they say made them money would, if done as described, do that. Sometimes they claim to have made quite a bit more money than I did trying to follow them but the reasons for that are plausible if not obvious. Their system is logical relating ones trade to chart patterns that reasonably demonstrate price direction based on signals of supply, demand, support and resistance. Nothing earth shattering here. About the only absolutely absurd claim they make is that their way is the best if not pretty much the only way to learn how to trade. But more or less every mother's son who ever sold anything makes claims that need to be taken with some disbelief. It does look like it is a way to learn and, unfortunately, very few posts here are from people who have taken the courses and can say what their experience is. One thing I don't see here is any angry rants from people who have actually paid for Pristine products.

It is true that one might shy away from something this controversial particularly when there are obviously other ways to get there. I've tried some of the other ways without much in the way of results. I'm a slow reader which makes slogging through endless internet noise to find useful information somewhat prohibitive. I've checked out most of the leads offered in this thread and found they either cost just as much or are leads that go to other leads that lead to the internet noise I have so much trouble navigating. From a good deal of talking with the Pristine people they seem largely like decent folk (obviously I can easily be wrong here) who claim believably that they can teach me what I need to know even if it is a pricey way to get there.

I have gotten them to extend a NYC Expo show deal until today for me which means I'll be deciding very soon. In spite of all I'm leaning in their favor. I guess the worst it can be is $2k and 4 months of my life down the tubes. A steep price indeed but I could also spend twice the time and half the money with, as far as I can tell, just as probably the same success/disappointment probabilities.
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Quote from hsvt:

thanks. I have spent time but I'm not making money so the question remains do they offer the right stuff regardless of the cost?
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There's no such thing as offering the right stuff. If they could, then they would be training monkeys at major money firms. Or dare say, they would open their own major mega money firm.
 
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