Pre-exhaustion and set extension techniques don't appear to add value

[Frederick Foresight]

On pre-exhaustion:

A team of researchers investigated the method known as pre-exhaustion training, called PreEx, and found the order of exercise protocols to be unimportant in high-intensity resistance training.

Popular with bodybuilders, PreEx is based on the theory that performing isolation movements for a target muscle group, followed by a compound movement for the same muscle group, will maximize muscle fatigue.

http://www.ctvnews.ca/health/popular-bodybuilder-workout-has-little-benefit-study-1.1952803

The results of this study dovetail nicely with the finding that single-joint exercises don't add value to multi-joint exercises. I had link the following article in the recently closed thread:

http://cbass.com/FAQ(11).htm#I_still_have

And, finally, set extension techniques such as descending sets and so on:

http://suppversity.blogspot.ca/2016/04/breakdown-aka-drop-sets-another-very.html

So it seems that KISS it is.

When I started dramatically decreasing my volume a few years ago, I felt compelled to play around with set extension techniques to compensate. And so, I would do a descending set after going to failure on an exercise. However, in time, I invariably found that my proper failure set would begin to slip in reps slightly. So when I reduced frequency a while back from twice a week full-body routines to 3 times every 2 weeks (and then even once a week for a number of weeks), my first full set would improve in rep numbers for a given weight. This means that when I was doing set extensions, I was not allowing enough time for proper recovery. And so, I went back to twice a week, discarded the set extensions, but eventually allowed the extensions to creep back in again.

In fact, even as recently as a few weeks ago, I was doing set extensions on both weighted pull ups and weighted dips. After reading this article, I again dropped the extensions, and within a few workouts, I was able to add an additional rep that had eluded me to both exercises after I had been doing the set extensions for a while. I guess some lessons bear repeating. And so, I am reminded once again: KISS.

 

[Frederick Foresight]

As an aside, I touched on inadequate recovery in the preceding post. It occurred to me that the couple of people who were complaining in the push up thread that they were not able to replicate their personal best, may not have allowed enough time for proper recovery to perform again at peak. While we can't always hit our highest numbers for any number of reasons, if the previous best doggedly remains out of reach, it is entirely possible that we have not allowed sufficient recovery time.

 

[CaptainObvious]

On pre-exhaustion:

A team of researchers investigated the method known as pre-exhaustion training, called PreEx, and found the order of exercise protocols to be unimportant in high-intensity resistance training.

Popular with bodybuilders, PreEx is based on the theory that performing isolation movements for a target muscle group, followed by a compound movement for the same muscle group, will maximize muscle fatigue.

http://www.ctvnews.ca/health/popular-bodybuilder-workout-has-little-benefit-study-1.1952803

The results of this study dovetail nicely with the finding that single-joint exercises don't add value to multi-joint exercises. I had link the following article in the recently closed thread:

http://cbass.com/FAQ(11).htm#I_still_have

And, finally, set extension techniques such as descending sets and so on:

http://suppversity.blogspot.ca/2016/04/breakdown-aka-drop-sets-another-very.html

So it seems that KISS it is.

When I started dramatically decreasing my volume a few years ago, I felt compelled to play around with set extension techniques to compensate. And so, I would do a descending set after going to failure on an exercise. However, in time, I invariably found that my proper failure set would begin to slip in reps slightly. So when I reduced frequency a while back from twice a week full-body routines to 3 times every 2 weeks (and then even once a week for a number of weeks), my first full set would improve in rep numbers for a given weight. This means that when I was doing set extensions, I was not allowing enough time for proper recovery. And so, I went back to twice a week, discarded the set extensions, but eventually allowed the extensions to creep back in again.

In fact, even as recently as a few weeks ago, I was doing set extensions on both weighted pull ups and weighted dips. After reading this article, I again dropped the extensions, and within a few workouts, I was able to add an additional rep that had eluded me to both exercises after I had been doing the set extensions for a while. I guess some lessons bear repeating. And so, I am reminded once again: KISS.

I am now doing full body twice a week, about 45 minutes in duration. I walk a couple miles at a brisk pace on two other days. I'm also on a new drug for my Afib which is really helping with my overall energy. January was a horrible month for me with Afib episodes happening every other day, many times when I was simply at rest. This was a big change from episodes only happening during intense exercise. The level of daily exhaustion I felt from this made for a very poor quality of life. On my way back, hopefully.

 

[Frederick Foresight]

I am now doing full body twice a week, about 45 minutes in duration. I walk a couple miles at a brisk pace on two other days. I'm also on a new drug for my Afib which is really helping with my overall energy. January was a horrible month for me with Afib episodes happening every other day, many times when I was simply at rest. This was a big change from episodes only happening during intense exercise. The level of daily exhaustion I felt from this made for a very poor quality of life. On my way back, hopefully.

May I assume that your doctor approves of your workout regimen and your level of intensity? I do hope you keep him or her in the loop.

 

[CaptainObvious]

May I assume that your doctor approves of your workout regimen and your level of intensity? I do hope you keep him or her in the loop.

Yes, I have had lengthy conversations with my cardiologist and GP. I was hospitalized for three days at the end of January for observation while starting this drug. Coming back slowly. My workouts would not impress anyone at this point.

 

[Frederick Foresight]

Yes, I have had lengthy conversations with my cardiologist and GP. I was hospitalized for three days at the end of January for observation while starting this drug. Coming back slowly. My workouts would not impress anyone at this point.

Sorry to hear about your hospitalization. But I was under the impression from our earlier exchanges in the recently closed thread that you were on the mend and on a new track. What brought on the Afib?

 

[CaptainObvious]

Sorry to hear about your hospitalization. But I was under the impression from our earlier exchanges in the recently closed thread that you were on the mend and on a new track. What brought on the Afib?

I was doing better last fall but the old ticker started acting up again during December. Afib is nearly impossible to determine the why it happens. It's just a fairly common heart disease, usually, but not always among people 60 plus. It also may be hereditary and it did eventually kill my father. I don't drink, smoke or eat much crap food so I'm likely to respond well to treatment, but Afib is progressive and not curable. There is a now fairly common surgery for it and that will be my next move when this drug ultimately stops working. I'm told that could be several years from now, but there are no guarantees. The nerves that control heart rhythm are being eaten away by this disease slowly but surely. All that said people can live with this for many years, even decades. It's treatable, just not curable. Nobody gets out alive.

 

[Frederick Foresight]

I was doing better last fall but the old ticker started acting up again during December. Afib is nearly impossible to determine the why it happens. It's just a fairly common heart disease, usually, but not always among people 60 plus. It also may be hereditary and it did eventually kill my father. I don't drink, smoke or eat much crap food so I'm likely to respond well to treatment, but Afib is progressive and not curable. There is a now fairly common surgery for it and that will be my next move when this drug ultimately stops working. I'm told that could be several years from now, but there are no guarantees. The nerves that control heart rhythm are being eaten away by this disease slowly but surely. All that said people can live with this for many years, even decades. It's treatable, just not curable. Nobody gets out alive.

Okay, as long as it's under control and being monitored, and your docs are fully in the workout loop. Onward and upward.

 

[CaptainObvious]

I was talking to a friend of mine who has been a long time body builder, like all the way back to the seventies. One of his suggestions was to pre exhaust your chest with dumbbell flys before doing bench press. He said that you would lose reps on the bench, but would be getting more out of the bench for your chest. I tried this technique today and did find after three sets of flys, 10 reps each, that I did lose 2 reps on my last set on the bench and struggled more on the first two sets. Opinions?

 

[Frederick Foresight]

I was talking to a friend of mine who has been a long time body builder, like all the way back to the seventies. One of his suggestions was to pre exhaust your chest with dumbbell flys before doing bench press. He said that you would lose reps on the bench, but would be getting more out of the bench for your chest. I tried this technique today and did find after three sets of flys, 10 reps each, that I did lose 2 reps on my last set on the bench and struggled more on the first two sets. Opinions?

Although the above-noted research does not seem to support its efficacy, I never did PreEX myself, so I cannot give a considered opinion. But I'd be interested to hear from others and to know if you make progress over time that you think you can attribute specifically to the PreEX.

As an aside, you are probably aware that I am presently in the one-set-to-failure camp. And so, I'm curious to know on what basis you have decided to do 3 sets of any given exercise as compared to any other number.