I don't know, negligence resulting in personal injury is a disqualifier IMO, this wasn't an accident of 'someone bumping' into the old man. We've got much stricter rules for immigrants applying into the country when it comes to criminal conduct, why can't we for cops? Instead of arming them to the teeth, just spend that money on screening, education, & training. I believe we can downsize our police force nation wide, just as we can our military.
Poor cops. Can't even assault unarmed citizens with complete impunity anymore.
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I don't know, negligence resulting in personal injury is a disqualifier IMO, this wasn't an accident of 'someone bumping' into the old man. We've got much stricter rules for immigrants applying into the country when it comes to criminal conduct, why can't we for cops? Instead of arming them to the teeth, just spend that money on screening, education, & training. I believe we can downsize our police force nation wide, just as we can our military.
I dont think we need to downsize police. We need to revamp the police.academy system because many people with poor or little education see police as career to just get through the academy learning basic shooting, traffic laws and driving and are lit in the streets.
It should not be a short academy stint to become a person with so much power to violate constituonal rights and make decisions about life or death.
When crime spikes mayors increase the size of the police force but you are just putting more poorly trained people in dangerous situations.
More money sbould be spent like the military to get best training and equipment and simulated training and mentoring and continuing education every year.
On old friend joined the NYPD years ago and when I caught up to years later he spewed the most hateful speech about the people in the community he was assigned to protect. In the corporate and military worlds we have much higher standards for who gets in and what training they get.
I think even Firemen get sophisticated training above what police get.
Arm them with guns and sticks but don't treat them like soldiers trained to.kill
There job is dangerous and no cop.should die from errors and mistakes or KILL an innocent person because they were too lazy to check and address closely.
Ha Ha not that type of equipment
I mean databases and technology to track activity and poeple in the system and highlight higher crime areas in neighborhoods and direct resources there. Also more time and people for community outreach.
It's fine if we disagree, but imo, there are at least two separate and distinct issues, that aren't mutually exclusive.
The first is accountability. In the old man case, just as you didn't need to be trained to not push old men, because they could fall and be seriously injured; the same would be true for you, whether you became an Uber driver, a teacher, or a cop. Cops do not get to avoid the reasonable person standard, imo. Maybe they're subject to a reasonable cop standard. Either way, pushing an old, non-threatening man like that was certainly unreasonable. It's simply another case of contempt of cop. Obey me, or be subject to my force.
There are certain behaviors that all reasonable adults are expected to do, or not do, in certain situations. In essence, certain things are common sense; and every common sense behavior shouldn't have to be codified, or explicitly taught. But, I'd be willing to bet that what they did was against their training, and I also would bet that's why they were charged. Of course, the training probably didn't mention that specific scenario, but I'm sure they are generally trained about not using excessive force. A twelve year old boy would know that that push was excessive.
As someone else pointed out, those given power to detain, arrest, and kill, all under color of law, should be held to a higher standard, not a lower one.
Now, if the old man did something that would cause a reasonable citizen to fear his proximity, then a reactive push may be arguably defended. But in this case, the push was not reflexive, or reactive. It occurred after a delay, after the old mans forward progress had basically stopped. The pushes were essentially, premeditated.
The second issue is what you also raise, training. Issuing justice, in this case, is not equivalent to saying, we've fixed the police problem.
Let's not forget, the old man probably has family, that would like to see justice and accountability.
We need training reform, and accountability. And when the rules are broken, we need deterrence via enforcement of those rules. Rules, though weak, have been on the books for ages, but bad cops can see when they aren't being enforced against a certain race of people. That actually enables more bad actors.
In the words of Super Chicken, They knew the job was dangerous when they took it.
I decided I wasn't going to mention Nazi's along with 'just following orders/training' in this post.
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I agree with @El OchoCinco on this one. I believe more resources are needed against crime in certain areas. OR, that the current resources need proper management.
Impossible to know which case applies without having inside information. Same with assessing military assets (needing inside/classified information to make a proper assessment).
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A couple things...
I know he was 78, but he looks like he's pretty fit. Tall and slender. Guy obviously takes care of himself.
Now I'm not saying it was intentional, but I wonder why when he was falling he didn't turn to catch himself?
Think about it, if you're falling backwards, that's the first thing you're gonna do. Nobody falls straight back without trying to catch the fall with their hands. So... who knows... maybe thats what happens when you get old.
The other thing.... it looks to me like the old dude reached for something on the cops belt. Or pointed to something. He had something in his hand. That's a big no-no. Things happen fast and a cop's gonna have a natural reaction to that. Just sayin.
I know he was 78, but he looks like he's pretty fit. Tall and slender. Guy obviously takes care of himself.
Now I'm not saying it was intentional, but I wonder why when he was falling he didn't turn to catch himself?
Think about it, if you're falling backwards, that's the first thing you're gonna do. Nobody falls straight back without trying to catch the fall with their hands. So... who knows... maybe thats what happens when you get old.
The other thing.... it looks to me like the old dude reached for something on the cops belt. Or pointed to something. He had something in his hand. That's a big no-no. Things happen fast and a cop's gonna have a natural reaction to that. Just sayin.
WHen you are pushed suddenly and lose your balance you cannot suddenly become a Ninja and back flip on to your feet, his equilibrium was pushed over.
He had a cell phone in his hand that was not only clearly visible but he was pointing over to the side.
Would it be a bad thing if we do not give the police the benefit of the doubt just because in other cities there were looters and in this case there were like 5 people in the immediate area and 20 cops.
It's this. I watched a documentary on this years ago.
They did an experiment where they had old folks harnessed up and walking on a treadmill. They had a device that could extend from the side and trip them.
At first, they all would have fallen. But after repeated trips, they 'relearned' how not to fall, and regained their footing.
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A younger man would have also held his head up as he fell, so as not to hit his head on the sidewalk, like the old man did.
They also studied toddlers. They have this amazing ability to 'always' get their hands out front, and raise their (cute) big heads, when they fall; no matter how fast they're running.
Your body really changes as you get older. (Many older folks are naturally slim, btw.)
In that study, were they holding onto a $1,000 smartphone?