POLL: What is the World's Most Evil Religion?

Quote from axeman:

Ummmmm... how about believing that your are
born a piece of shit sinner???

Do you think that could be psychologically harmful to a child?

Starting out in the world with a NEGATIVE self worth ( a sinner )
is NOT a good thing.
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It sounds like you had a bad experience with this particular teaching, and I can understand this. I agree with your statements above. It could be psychologically harmful to a child, and it sounds like this was the case with you.

But, I don't think it is fair to say that the Bible is the source of this principle. In fact, some religions don't teach this doctrine. My religion teaches just the opposite, that children are innocent and without sin when they come into this world, and therefore they do not require baptism until they reach an age where they can be accountable for their actions.

So I don't think the problem is the Bible, but rather the particular religion that you belonged to, that taught this doctrine. If you were to read the Bible from cover to cover without knowing anything about the doctrine of original sin, then I seriously doubt that you would come to the conclusion after you finished reading that there is such a doctrine. The problem is that some religions have fabricated doctrines in order to "make it work". If you were to just stick with the principles you can read and understand I'm certain living those Biblical principles would improve your life.


Do I need to point out the fact AGAIN, that the bible supports
slavery?

Ill stop now while im ahead. Great book there.
Angry gods killing innocent babies with wild animals because
he is angry at some OTHER dude. Brilliant reasoning!

Yeah.... lots of great teachings in there. Whatever.
[/B]
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I don't believe slavery is presented anywhere in the Bible as a principle for how we are supposed to live our lives. In that respect, slavery isn't a principle that is taught with the intent that we pattern our lives after it, and as such is irrelevant to this discussion. And as I'm certain you have not personally practiced slavery, it is not relevant to this discussion.

What other Biblical principles have you lived that have made your life unhappy?
 
Quote from TriPack:



...ambiguity doesn't render the bible or science worthless. The real test is, does its teachings or advances give anything that can help one live a better, more fulfilled, more enjoyable life?
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We are not asking if religion is useful or beneficial, we are asking if it is *true* i.e. an accurate description of the workings of the universe. Astrology can be of benefit to people, so can a white lie - this does not make them true.
 
"What other Biblical principles have you lived that have made your life unhappy?"

Let's see...because Modern Orthodox Judaism (Not as bad as Ultra-Orthodox, but still pretty hardcore.) was forced on me from birth until I finally broke free at age 20, I've wasted THOUSANDS of hours praying to a non-existant imaginary friend, because I was taught that I had no other choice. Add another few thousand hours of studying religious texts instead of anything useful. I suffered extreme sexual frustration & guilt as a teenager, because I was taught that masterbation is 'the same as murdering a person'. Limits on foods, clothes, activities-pretty much your whole life you're just a religious puppet, or slave to an imaginary master. Because of my parents' mystic zealotry, we all moved from Ohio to Israel when I was 11. Drafted at age 18 to spend 3 years of my life in unspeakable hell babysitting Islamic terrorists in a 110 degree prison camp on the Egyptian border instead of getting an education and enjoying life....Yeah, I'd say Biblical principals caused my first 20 years of life to completely SUCK ASS.
 
Quote from Rearden Metal:

"What other Biblical principles have you lived that have made your life unhappy?"

Let's see...because Modern Orthodox Judaism (Not as bad as Ultra-Orthodox, but still pretty hardcore.) was forced on me from birth until I finally broke free at age 20, I've wasted THOUSANDS of hours praying to a non-existant imaginary friend, because I was taught that I had no other choice. Add another few thousand hours of studying religious texts instead of anything useful. I suffered extreme sexual frustration & guilt as a teenager, because I was taught that masterbation is 'the same as murdering a person'. Limits on foods, clothes, activities-pretty much your whole life you're just a religious puppet, or slave to an imaginary master. Because of my parents' mystic zealotry, we all moved from Ohio to Israel when I was 11. Drafted at age 18 to spend 3 years of my life in unspeakable hell babysitting Islamic terrorists in a 110 degree prison camp on the Egyptian border instead of getting an education and enjoying life....Yeah, I'd say Biblical principals caused my first 20 years of life to completely SUCK ASS.
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Damn! That is some miserable shit there :(
 
Quote from Cutten:



We are not asking if religion is useful or beneficial, we are asking if it is *true* i.e. an accurate description of the workings of the universe. Astrology can be of benefit to people, so can a white lie - this does not make them true.
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I'm saying that if the Bible's teachings are good then the Bible is good, and if they are bad then the Bible is bad. If you are happier after living the principles found in the Bible, then you can know that the book is good and that it contains true principles. If the principles in the book are true then you can know that the book is true.

Conversely, if you are made unhappy by living the principles, you will know that the principles are bad, and that the Bible is bad, and therefore it is not true.

The leap of faith comes in actually living those principles, and putting it to the test. Many here on this thread would rather only accept proof in a form as they demand it, rather than sincerely wanting to find out for themselves by putting the Bible to the test to know for themselves.
 
Quote from Specul8r:



Yes, but only morons insist something does not exist without having proof to the contrary and the fact that you have not seen or witnesed God yet, is not ample proof to infer that he definately isn't there...
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Which is why I have never claimed that he definitely isn't there. I have, however, said that there is no credible evidence that he is there, and therefore we should ascribe the same probability to his existence as we do to other alleged entities that also have no credible evidence for their existence - such as Little Green Men, the Loch Ness Monster, the Tooth Fairy etc.

For it to be rational to believe otherwise, one must present credible evidence that he does in fact exist.

If you do so, then we can use one of Hume's other contributions to philosophy - his theory of miracles. Namely, that testimony of a miraclous event should only be believed if it is more likely that the miracle is true, than that the testimony of the miracle is for some reason false or misleading. Since I alleged that all current evidence for the existence of God falls into the category of "more likely that the testimony is for some reason false or misleading", then it is not remotely moronic to claim that we have no credible evidence for God's existence (it may be disputable or even wrong, but not moronic).

It is then up to believers to challenge this view by providing support for the credibility of the evidence in question. Ancient texts written by people with vested interests, dubious miracle testimony or folklore about sainthood etc are insufficient, as Christians do not accept such arguments when presented to support the existence of other religions contradictory to their own.

I therefore await with interest the credible and convincing evidence that leads people to assign a probability to God's existence higher than that of Little Green Men.
 
Quote from TriPack:



I'm saying that if the Bible's teachings are good then the Bible is good, and if they are bad then the Bible is bad. If you are happier after living the principles found in the Bible, then you can know that the book is good and that it contains true principles. If the principles in the book are true then you can know that the book is true.

Conversely, if you are made unhappy by living the principles, you will know that the principles are bad, and that the Bible is bad, and therefore it is not true.

The leap of faith comes in actually living those principles, and putting it to the test. Many here on this thread would rather only accept proof in a form as they demand it, rather than sincerely wanting to find out for themselves by putting the Bible to the test to know for themselves.
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As mentioned above, the fact that a belief contributes to happiness does not imply that it is necessarily true, nor even more likely to be true. All it logically implies is that believing the principle increases happiness.

There may well be non-religious, or even atheistic principles, which if followed are likely to increase happiness. Would they be evidence that atheism is true? No - they would not affect truth one way or the other.

For what it's worth, I have a great deal of respect for many core religious principles. I just don't think you should form your beliefs about truth and reality on the basis of what makes you or anyone else happy. From the point of view of knowledge, I would rather be an unhappy Socrates than a happy pig.

Anyway, I know judge it useful to my happiness to go to bed and get some rest :D I've enjoyed the discussion, and hope that others feel likewise. Good trading!
 
Christians rule.
Jew's are cool, after all J.C., Sid Caesar, and Woody Allen are Jewish.
Shinto's and Buddhist's seem mellow.
Hindu's have serious hygiene issues.
Every one else is a terrorist thug.
 
Quote from axeman:

Would it?

Define "Above". Define "outside".

Way too nebulous to even be answerable.

My morality is based on rational thinking.
So would this mean that gods is not?

Or would god conform to what is rational?
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You've made many good points, but I must point out here that you should recognize the finite and extremely limited nature of man. Our "rationality" is limited by our ability to perceive and conceive, and by a limited, contradictory logic system (contradictions are proven both in godel's theorem and your boy Russel's Paradox, among other things). It is precisely because we not only won't know about the origins of the universe but are limited in even being able to conceive it (as well as so many obvious things, let alone the many things that would require greater comprehension capacity and more senses to begin to fathom) that demonstrate why we should not hold our rationality to be the ultimate end. I'm not saying it's useless, for it is very good for our purposes, and our math/logic systems are as close to objective reality that we will ever come to know. I'm just suggesting that you acknowledge its limits! Heck, ultimately we can be certain of absolutely nothing but our own existence.
 
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